Paul VI & the Ephod


#1

http://www.mostholyfamilymonastery.com/Paul%20VI%20and%20John%20XXIII%20pictures/ephod.jpg

Anyone have any info on this?


#2

I don’t know why he would wear something like that.
It is the ephod of the Jewish High Priest from back in the
old Temple days before 70 A.D.
Love,
Jaypeeto3


#3

For those who have no idea (like me) what an Ephod is:
newadvent.org/cathen/05497a.htm

Jayson… what do you know about it? What questions do you have? where did you get the picture?


#4

I remembered seeing it on the web so I google image searched it. All I know is that Paul VI wore it.

I was wondering if anyone had any info about it.

I know about the breastplate in the old testament, which it clearly is.


#5

[quote=Jayson]I remembered seeing it on the web so I google image searched it. All I know is that Paul VI wore it.

I was wondering if anyone had any info about it.

I know about the breastplate in the old testament, which it clearly is.
[/quote]

Well, here is the article that it is taken from:
(WARNING this link contains theory that Paul VI is Masonic)
mostholyfamilymonastery.com/Paul6photogallery.html

I do not think that an Ephod is a sure sign of being “Masonic” as this article wants to imply. Remember… a lot of Masonic symbology <sp?> was taken from religious symbols.


#6

Well, a lot of masonic symbolism is derived from Judaism, but I don’t think the fact that Paul VI has a jewish symbol means he is masonic. If you take the masonic temple, for example, it’s a reversal of the Jewish temple. Satanic symbolism is often a reversal or distortion, often very subtle, of genuinely sacred things, hence their temple.

That site is run by a bunch of sedavacantists, so I don’t put any stock in their assertions.

Isn’t their a liturgical vestment called a rationale (same name as on the breastplate in question)?


#7

[quote=Jayson]Well, a lot of masonic symbolism is derived from Judaism, but I don’t think the fact that Paul VI has a jewish symbol means he is masonic. If you take the masonic temple, for example, it’s a reversal of the Jewish temple. Satanic symbolism is often a reversal or distortion, often very subtle, of genuinely sacred things, hence their temple.
[/quote]

That is true… there is a bit more to this, but I would leave that for another thread.

This is the question you should have started with! A picture may be worth a 1000 words, but choosing a word from that bunch can be difficult to expound on. I did not know what you were asking or implying.

Catholic Rationale:
newadvent.org/cathen/12651c.htm

The Rationale is an imitation and an equivalent of the pallium. That this is the case is evident, apart from other papal Bulls, from the Bull of John XIX (1027), conferring on the Patriarch Poppo of Aquileia the pallium and the rationale at the same time, with the condition that he could only wear the pallium on high festivals. It appears, however, that the humeral ornaments of the Jewish high-priests (ephod, etc.) were not without influence in evoking this pontifical adornment, as may be seen from the original rationales preserved at Bamberg and Ratisbon. The name at least is derived from the appellation of the breast ornament of the high-priest Aaron.


#8

It really isn’t similar to the rationale in question (that of Paul VI).

Something else springs to mind now that I know I’ve read somewhere. Didn’t JPII wear vestments that were made from scarlet, blue and purple thread while opening the holy door during the jubliee year of 2000?

http://www.stpetersbasilica.org/Interior/HolyDoor/HolyDoor-JPII-a.jpg


#9

[quote=Jayson]http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/6322/78/320/rationalekrakow.jpg

It really isn’t similar to the rationale in question (that of Paul VI).

Something else springs to mind now that I know I’ve read somewhere. Didn’t JPII wear vestments that wear intentionally colored to mirror those of the Jewish high priest while opening the Holy Door at St. Peters during the Jubilee year?
[/quote]

I’ve only read that assertion made on radical traditionalist sites.


#10

That’s probably where I read it too.

I posted a photo of the vestment in question above, here it is again:

http://www.stpetersbasilica.org/Interior/HolyDoor/HolyDoor-JPII-a.jpg

There are clear connections between the old testement priesthood and the Catholic priesthood. I assume they are just acknowledging this.

Paul VI, for example, was probably given the ephod by some Jewish visitor as a thankyou for all he has done to heal the rifts between catholicism and judaism. It seems more like a piece of jewelry than anything else.


#11

you are of course aware that it is the easiest thing in the world to manipulate photos displayed on the web to show anything you want to show to make your point.


#12

I’m not sure the point you are trying to make. I don’t think any of these photos are photoshopped.


#13

the point I am trying to make is that just because something, a photo, article etc. appears on the web does not make it valuable or reliable. We don’t know the source of the photo, we do know something about the site which is anti-Catholic, we do not know the context of the photo, whether or not it has been manipulated, what the article in question is, the implications if it actually is an “ephod”, from any source other than the anti-Catholic link. Therefore the entire thing is not even worth speculation and discussion.


#14

Well, it’s obviously got 4 rows of 3 stones. What else could it be?

And to further this discussion:

“Moreover, Christ commands the faithful of all time to obey the Church, and its supreme shepherd, as He commanded His disciples to obey the high priest who sat in the chair of Moses. And, in the Old Testament, when the high priest spoke from the Chair of Moses, arming himself with the ephod of authorty over the people of God, he too was infallible, and had to be obeyed.

Now, this might also be from a traditional site, I’m not sure. It’s from catholicism.org/pages/infal.htm


#15

why not do some research on Papal vestments and find out what it is instead of speculating?


#16

That is what I am attempting to do :slight_smile:

Anyhow, it doesn’t seem to obviously be anything that is traditionally worn by a pope.

I found it interesting and am trying to have a discussion with people who are vastly more knowledgeable in these things than I am about what it might be.

puzzleannie, could you please stop being so defensive. I am not trying to imply anything negative about Paul VI.

I wish I could find something about it on a mainline catholic site, but I can’t. It seems to be something that has been used by sedevacantists in their giant conspiracy theory. Therefore, I’d like to know if there’s a good explanation for it that can be used to refute their absurd claims.


#17

no you are not personally, but you are referring us to a site that discusses a topic banned on this forum, and I am within my rights in questioning your motives for doing so.


#18

Well, my motives were simply to find some information about what the object shown in the photo is, that does not involve some crazy conspiracy.

I didn’t specifacally try to point anyone to a sedevacantist site. I found the photo on google image search.


#19

30 years ago “the Ephod” controversy arose through the so-called “traditionalist” quarters - and was NOT limited to the sedevacantists.

The motivation was to demean Pope Paul VI AND the Liturgy of Mass that he promulgated in 1969; guilt by association!

Also at the same time, was pointed out the curious number of time the numeral “6” was associated with his person. So much so that he was demeaned as being “666” - THE “Antichrist”!

People do these things, of course to suit their purposes. Demean the Mass by demeaning the author of the Mass.

Bottom line: Inasmuch as Pope Paul VI died - so many years ago - it is/was impossible for him to have been the Antichrist. End of THAT suggestio!

Noted Marianist, eschatologist and author of Trial, Tribulation and Triumph, Desmond Birch, has dealt with many of these “end times” theories.


closed #20

DISCLAIMER: The views and opinions expressed in these forums do not necessarily reflect those of Catholic Answers. For official apologetics resources please visit www.catholic.com.