Pope Francis : "God willed the plurality of religions"


#134

Your views contradict Catholic teaching, just saying

Also, it’s not what the subject of this thread is about.

Jim


#135

“contradict.” That’s diplomatic and charitable.


#136

They ignore such teaching, as essentially irrelevant to my life at this point. For others they of course form a central influence on their life.

Leaving that aside, the thread demonstrates as others have pointed out how a rather prosaic document is being cited to show how Pope Francis is a ‘wolf in sheep’s clothing’ or other silliness. Usually because people read a headline version of what happened and not the documents involved.


#137

Thank you for being respectful, I hope that God will lead you to realize what I’ve expressed, which to me is the most fundamental Truth.

Should we bother with evangelising?


#138

Well yes of course if you are Catholic, although the approaches used by some are better than others. My aunt’s approach as a religious sister was simply to offer you the choice to ask her and tell you about it and to demonstrate quietly by doing things the value of her faith to her live. My mother’s surviving sister adopts an approach which rubs many the wrong way as she will start trying to hand you tracts or lecturing people on the deficiencies of their Churches or faiths as they step through her door. She sincerely means to help them but it really irks people.


#139

I think however the Pope here is trying to deal with a struggle between major religions which has become a breeding ground for hate and division. No doubt he will make mistakes as he does so, however doing anything runs the risk of doing so. He could of course ignore the issues concerned as well.


#140

Also Catechism:

843 The Catholic Church recognizes in other religions that search, among shadows and images, for the God who is unknown yet near since he gives life and breath and all things and wants all men to be saved. Thus, the Church considers all goodness and truth found in these religions as “a preparation for the Gospel and given by him who enlightens all men that they may at length have life.” 332

332 LG 16; cf. NA 2; EN 53.
LG Lumen gentium
NA Nostra aetate
EN Evangelii nuntiandi


#141

I would think that if the devil has ever been bound for a period of 1000 years history would bear that out!


#142

God didn’t make Adam and Eve Catholic, nor reveal the fullness of the Catholic faith to Noah, Abraham or Moses. So there’s that …


#143

:face_with_raised_eyebrow: Actively wills? Or permissively wills? If the former, heresy.

Just another Francis-ism :confused:


#144

I’m not sure what that has to do with anything


#145

You have to be careful you don’t take this out of context. It needs to be read in the context of the whole document. God wills our freedom therefore he wills (allows) a diversity of religions within the context of human freedom. Otherwise, there would be no room for free will.


#146

Yes, in that sense it make some sense.


#147

I think history of the last 100 years and current events bear out that he has been unleashed in a unique way in that the nations of the world see authority as purely secular and do not recognize the Divine authority. Not in morality, not in economics, not in human rights, not in the stewardship of the earth, not in any institution.


#148

Plurality of religions (at a minimum Judaism and Christianity), each being planned and willed by God and given to man by means of progressive revelation to the Old Testament patriarchs and prophets culminating with the fullness of truth in Christ’s incarnation and ministry.


#149

The document under discussion was released for the visit of Pope to some Muslim countries where he is welcomed with great fun fare.The tone and content of the document is unmistakable, which is that the different Religions are ok and are as per God’s plan only.Nothing special about any particular Religion.We are Catholic believe Jesus as God,you Muslims don’t believe so,but no problem,it is God’s will.Seemingly nice things to tell when visiting muslim countries .
But the idea contained in the document may be interpreted by Catholic believers are dangerous.We believe that only Christian faith is the true religion,only Jesus is the real God and all others are false and those believing in such religions can get salvation only through Christ.
At any rate this document does not reflect the spirit of what Jesus himself said in John 14:6, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.” He is not a way, as in one of many; He is the way, as in the one and only.


#150

We must look the diversity of religions in the context of Catholic Soteriology.

The pluralism and the diversity of
religions,
colour,
sex,
race,
language
are willed by God in His wisdom, through which He created human beings.

.
DIVERSITY OF RELIGION IN THE CONTEXT OF CATHOLIC SOTERIOLOGY

The Divine will is cause of all things that happens, as Augustine says (De Trin. iii, 1 seqq.).

Hence if this divine influence stopped, every operation would stop.
Every operation, therefore, of anything is traced back to Him as its cause. (Summa Contra Gentiles, Book III.)

.
CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA Divine Providence explains;

His wisdom He so orders all events within the universe that the end for which it was created may be realized.
God is the sole ruler of the world, His will governs all things.

He directs all, even evil and sin itself, to the final end for which the universe was created.

Yet all things, whether due to necessary causes or to the free choice of man, are foreseen by God and preordained in accordance with His all-embracing purpose.

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/12510a.htm

.
Aquinas said, “God changes the will without forcing it.
But he can change the will from the fact that He himself operates in the will as He does in nature,” De Veritatis 22:9.

Phil.2:13; For it is God who works in you BOTH to WILL and to ACT in order to fulfil his good purpose.
.
2022 The divine initiative in the work of grace PRECEDES, PREPARES, and ELICITS the free response of man.

God effects everything, the willing and the achievement. … (Thomas Aquinas, S. Th.II/II 4, 4 ad 3).

.
God’s graces does NOT hinders our free wills, God’s efficacious graces enlightens our minds and we always freely choose the good.

.
God’s will is immutable; therefore, God’s will always accomplished.

.
The way God willed (at this stage of our road to perfection) the diversity of sex, colour, the same way God willed the diversity of religion as well.
.
When perfection comes, will be no diversity of religion, in this side of eternity only God can see the benefit and the wisdom in the diversity of religion, in heaven we will see God’s wisdom in it too.

Diversity of religion nothing to do with our free wills, but everything to do with God’s will and His wisdom, even if we cannot understand it yet.
.
The Divine will is the cause of all things (even the diversity of religions) that happens, His wisdom He so orders all events within the universe and all events designed/ planned by God and predestined from all eternity.
.
John 14:6, “I am the way, the truth, and the life.
No one comes to the Father except through me.”

The way known only to God, He can and He will save everyone in Christ. - Eph.1:10-11; Col.1:20; etc.
.
God bless


#151

This Skelly I totally agree with, and I would also add “religion”.

The first thought I had yesterday when I read the document that Pope Francis signed in agreement was…" Peace, peace, when there is no peace" and “Peace and safety, then comes sudden destruction.”

True believers in Christ are to keep their lamps trimmed as we await the coming of the Bridegroom.


#152

Hello Angreen – My name is John Farren. Your posting made me feel that Jesus is Living in your heart and abides in you … and you in Him. I am 88 and have two master degrees, one in Philosophy and the other in Theology. I rejoice in my heart what Pope Francis stated clearly. The treasures of Vatican II are coming more and more to fulfillment. If more people read the documents of Vatican II (I have read several times all of them) they would begin to realize the Church (Roman Catholic) heavily burdened by the heavy and repeated sins of its own members and especially by its consecrated leaders was mightily released from its coldness and darkness. / you wrote, “Atheists … God may want them too” Angreen, God wants them so very much, that God Almighty took to Himself a real human nature and God Suffered and God Died for them, the Atheists, the sinners all, for those who chosen to spurn and even hate God. St John in Scripture tell us simply and clearly, “GOD IS LOVE.” I must stop now, Angreen. If you wish you may write me by email> Trinity5635@aol.com God Loves every creature Infinitely and God cannot change. Blessing … John


#153

Francis Signed Document Saying That God Willed the “pluralism and diversity of religions”. What’s Up With That?

http://wdtprs.com/blog/2019/02/francis-signed-document-saying-that-god-willed-the-pluralism-and-diversity-of-religions-whats-up-with-that/

We must seek a way to understand this without it sounding like heresy. Note well that, after that awkward phrase, the continuation speaks to our freedom to believe, etc. That hints at a solution.

God did not will a diversity of religions in the sense that all religions are equal paths to God. False religions are evil. God does not actively will evil.


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