The council of priests of the diocese Rottenburg-Stuttgart has “decided”, in a “democratic vote” to reject the correction of the “pro multis” translation by the Vatican.
The Pope is just a figurehead now IMO. No real authority or “troops”.
Its why the liberalization of the Tridentine Rite keeps being delayed IMO. The Vatican knows if they do this Europe and American bishops will generally ignore it. And the reality that the Pope has no real authority anymore will be revealed. I think they are really scared and are pretty much immoblized out of fear.
The church in the US and Europe is in defacto schism and, IMO, the Vatican is more afraid of revealing that than they are of in being a shephard to souls.
What can I say, its why I am no longer Catholic and these kinds of things continually reinforce me in my decision to leave the church.
BTW, I think its a safe bet Rome will do nothing about this. Like they ever do?!
I agree with what you say and it is what has prompted me to leave the conciliar church, the novus ordo, and return home to traditional Catholicism.
The ICEL and all their counterparts and followers seem to have more power than we thought. Control over the liturgy, control of Catholic theology, control over most vernaculars, and now almost control over the Vatican. Being schismatic is the least of their sins. How can they even be Christian if they profess to know better than Christ?
No way they touch the ancient Latin Mass!!! The Mass (both NO and the Tridentine) needs to stay in Latin.
The council of priests of the diocese Rottenburg-Stuttgart has “decided”, in a “democratic vote” to reject the correction of the “pro multis” translation by the Vatican. As in English, the current German translation is “for all”. According to the council, the translation “for many” is confusing “in this day and age”: "The promise of salvation is directed to all people. This truth of the faith is put most clearly in the “for all”. They added that the original text said “for all”, citing a Protestant 18th century scholar, who’s been proven wrong long since.
Well, let’s not confuse anyone by having them think they aren’t all going straight to heaven.
After all, isn’t an eighteenth century Protestant scholar on a par with the Pope in this day and age? :rolleyes:
“Look, those German priests are revolting against the Pope again. Shame on them.”
“Yes, isn’t that a shame. So rebellious. That’s what the church is coming to nowadays. That’s why I no longer submit to the Pope.”
Help a girl out here… what am I missing?
I came to the conclusion it was all charade a few years ago under JP2. After some of his bishop appointments which were not at all orthodox.
If the Pope does not seem to believe or at least have the courage to act on his beliefs then all this talk about the Shephard he is supposed to be kind of collapses don’t you think. That is where I went anyway and I think more and more are abondoning this “farce” if I can be so blunt.
I believied at one time, I tithed, I thought there would be a new springtime under JP2. But it never happened and I am not so foolish now to believe it will happen under Benedict. He is ironically less orthodox in essentials it seems that JP2.
We don’t need a non-binding book on his thoughts about Christ. We need a teaching authority. He can’t seem to bring himself to that. It is no longer there. I came to the conclusion it never was.
I may be banned for being so upfront but the truth for me is the truth.
I believe things will get worse. What we see happening there in Germany is just the the result of a power struggle against the Pope. I also believe that this struggle is initiated by the Neocatechuemanl Way. As I said in another thread.
Where ever the Neocatechumenal Way go—Chaos will follow.
I think it’s rather sad that a story about a bunch of ignoramus clerics pretending they have some magical democratic authority to alter the liturgy has got people griping about *Pope Benedict *and his order to correct the bad translation allowed by his predecessor. The pope moves to improve the liturgy and he’s the one under fire, instead of the boobs who are defying him. Real mature…
Since the issue seems to arise from the German translation of the Mass, perhaps the Pope can just solve the issue by removing the recognito of the German vernacular Mass.
These priests can then just say the Mass in Latin only. Problem solved
Too bad they can’t use the excuse some American bishops offer in that the Vatican doesn’t understand modern English well enough.
These priests would have a hard time convining anyone that +Joseph Ratzinger isn’t fluent in German.
Well, you know those Bavarians just use a hillbilly German, anyway. He can’t speak real German (must have had a ghostwriter cleaning up all those academic publications…).
I actually sometimes wish the pope would clear up our own English translation issues with the very same stroke of the pen as you suggested for the Germans. “You insist on only banal and inaccurate translations? No translation for you!”
I sure hope they don’t ban you for being honest. In my opinion, we are living through the Great Apostasy that was predicted in the Bible and by many saints. In the Great Apostasy there will be many victims and many casualties. God will be with us during this terrible crisis, but we must do our part and pray for guidance.
There are many who are blind to what is taking place before their very eyes… and the devil does his best to keep them that way.
Your eyes were opened, and you can see the apostasy for what it is. But that is just the first step. Once our eyes are open we have to pray for the grace to handle the situation properly. It is EXTREMELY easy to fall into error in one way or the other.
You say that you left the Church. In my opinion, that is the wrong way to handle it. God gave you the grace to see the apostasy around you, but not so that you would abandon the Church He founded. That is not what He wants from you.
God opened your eyes so that you can join the fight for the faith, rather than blindly following the blind as so many are doing. The Church is in a terrible crisis and it needs people like you to stand firm in the faith and resist the corruption that is destroying it. In this crisis our Lord is calling you to stand firm for the faith for the sake of His Church.
Do you know how many of the saints actually desired to live in our day of apostasy? There were many. They wanted the opportunity to stand firm for the faith to prove their love for God.
You have been given the opportunity that the saints wanted. What they desired is what you have… and you have been given the grace to see what many cannot see. Now it is time for you to make the most of it. The following words apply to you…
Our Lad of LaSallette (approved apparition): “I make an urgent appeal to the earth. I call on the true disciples of the living God who reigns in Heaven; I call on the true followers of Christ made man, the only true Saviour of men; I call on My children, the true faithful, those who have given themselves to Me so that I may lead them to My divine Son, those whom I carry in My arms, so to speak, those who have lived on My spirit. Finally, I call on the Apostles of the Last Days, the faithful disciples of Jesus Christ who have lived in scorn for the world and for themselves, in poverty and in humility, in scorn and in silence, in prayer and in mortification, in chastity and in union with God, in suffering and unknown to the world. It is time they came out and filled the world with light. Go and reveal yourselves to be my cherished children. I am at your side and within you, provided that your faith is the light which shines upon you in these unhappy days. May your zeal make you famished for the glory and the honor of Jesus Christ. Fight, children of light, you, the few who can see. For now is the time of all times, the end of all ends.” christthekingmaine.com/Our_Lady_of_La_Sallette.html
The unfortunate consequence of this is that the “for all” will stay in the liturgy and will only bring out more of its defenders in the name of the abiding by the Living Magisterium of the Church.
As long as their liturgy remains “valid,” 99% of churchgoers won’t really care. Seems the only way to make headway is to threaten that validity but the Vatican doesn’t have the courage to do it.
This is the best post I have read on Catholic Forums.
Every generation since Peter and Paul has thought it is living in the “last days”.
Ain’t that the truth but the “last days” will come. Just a matter of when.