Is the Latin word “tuum” pronounced “too-oom” or “too-um,” with the second “u” sounding the same as in English “fun?”
If I remember my high school Latin (after all, it’s been almost sixty years! ), you would say “too-um” with the “u” pronounced as in “fun”…
it is too-oom
I am fromthe same time frame for High School Latin and earlier served at the Latin masses. I agree. It may not be right, but it is the way we did it.
I don’t know, it seems nearly impossible to actually say it that way with any projection.
Grace & Peace!
I agree that it should be TOO-uhm. Mostly, a UM ending is pronounced OOM, but coupled with OO of the TOO, the sound is less than felicitous.
Also, in my Latin classes, it was always pronounced TOO-uhm
i.e.–Pater Noster, qui es in caelis, sanctificetur Nomen Tuum=
PAH-tehr NOH-stehr, KWEE ESS EEN CHAY-lees sank-tih-fi-CHAY-toor NOH-men TOO-uhm
Or at least that’s how I would pronounce it via ecclesiastical Latin (for classical Latin, replace CHAY-lees with KAI-lees and sank-tih-fi-CHAY-toor with sank-tih-fi-KAY-toor)…
Under the Mercy,
I’ve just recently discovered the beauty of the Latin Mass. I’m 27 and grew up in the Novus Ordo. So now I’m methodically trying to learn the Latin form of our most frequent prayers.
Getting off topic here, but I went to my first Tridentine Mass on Easter Sunday, and it has changed my life. Sometimes I go to both our Novus Ordo and the indult TLM at another parish. I can’t get enough of that Mass.
I do not know about this word, but I do know that the Latin language as taught is different somewhat in pronunciation in some words in the Latin used at Mass. “Ecclesial Latin” is a term I heard as per that.
Listening to it is easier for me than actually using pronunciation guides.
I was taught too-oom, and that’s the way it was said in sixz years of classes and eight years of Latin novus ordo Masses at high school and college. The ending -um is most often pronounced “oom” as the “u” is pronounced “oo.”
That said, I wonder how much the pronunciation is the result of the teacher’s base language (my first teacher was Austrian), and whether the difference also has to do with the difference between Classical and Ecclesiastical Latin pronunciation.
For some reason, when I teach my kids “Semper ubi sub ubi,” “ubi” is oobi and sub is pronounced as in submarine. I could be wrong.
My Mama was the local Latin teacher, and her Latin/English dictionary says it’s “too-uhm”. (From tuus, pronounced “too uhs”…Just like, “The book is ours, so send the book to us”).
Matt, Thanks for posting these!
PS: The Pope’s birthday picture, he does not look well. So sad, it make me:crying: we shall pray for him!:signofcross:
It is not pronounced too-uhm.
An Italian would never pronounce tuum like that.
Pronounce it thus: toom.
With the lips in a tight circle.
There is no repetition of or variation of the u sound just because there is a double u.
Boxers have a motto in Latin:
Soc et tuum!
:nope: :nope: Repeat after me, “Latin is not Italian, Latin is not Italian, Latin is not Italian, Latin is not Italian…”
Gosh, those guys sure:bowdown: :bowdown: know their Latin, don’t they??? :rotfl:
But Ecclesiastical Latin is pronounced exactly the same way as you would modern Italian.
I think more precisely: Ecclesiastical Latin is pronounced the way a modern (circa 1900) Italian would pronounce Latin.
Wonko: Would you distinguish the pronunciation of *tuum *(your in the approriate case) and *tum *(then, at that time)?
Yes I would.
Tum would have a short u sound.
Tuum would have the exact u sound, only longer.
No glottal stop, not change in the type of u sound, just longer.
Would I be correct in saying this?
Or do you or someone else have to correct me?/
I’m not sure. It’s soooo difficult to communicate pronunciation by a written medium. (Also, it has been waaaaay to long since I have had a trustworthy Latin speaker to ask in person) But here is my take:
*Tuum *contains two short u’s in a row, which I suppose could sound like a long u. But they are distinct vowels and syllables – *uu *is not a Latin dipthong (*ae, au, oe, *sometimes ui), so both should be pronounced. I would not call it a “glottal stop”, but maybe an elision?
The best example I can give for correct* pronunciation is that I believe it should sound like To whom [it may concern], if you take out the breathed sound of the wh in whom.
Or maybe if you reverse the old *West Side Story *comraderie oath, “Womb to tomb”, a la “Tomb to womb” – To me, *tuum *should sound like “to womb” (but pronounced quickly enough that it does not sound like two words).
(* I admit, if I’m being sloppy and not paying attention, I probably fall into the long-short combo or “too-um”)