Prophecies of Joseph Smith


#1

We know that a true prohpet’s prophecies will come to pass. But several of Joseph’s Smiths havent. Has anyone ever heard of this? I’ve read that Smith said that he’d be alive at the second coming, if the US would not redress the wrongs suffered by the Mormons in the state of Missouri, then in a few years the government will be utterly overthrown and wasted. Brigham Young foretold that the Civil War would not result in freeing the black slaves. I have references to these except for the first one. It says it is in Dand C, 112 but missionaries and i read wasnt in there. Could have been a typo but need to know!


#2

[quote=crazyage3]We know that a true prohpet’s prophecies will come to pass. But several of Joseph’s Smiths havent. !
[/quote]

Joseph Smith was not a prophet he was a teenager obsessed with his own sinful inclinations who dreamed up a mythical religion to justify his own desires, and made up, with the cooperation of a friend, the whole farce about the Angel Moroni, golden tablets of revelation and magic spectacles. Greatest hoax in history. If he were alive today he would be a blog and a superstar on his own network


#3

THank you for letting me know your opinion but people dont see it like that! I’d like to prove these prophesies were false. And if they werent prove otherwise. Please help with any references!


#4

[quote=crazyage3]THank you for letting me know your opinion but people dont see it like that! I’d like to prove these prophesies were false. And if they werent prove otherwise. Please help with any references!
[/quote]

Easy, Joseph Smith died in a gunfight during a jailbreak outside the county lockup in Carthage, Illinois. Jesus Christ hadn’t yet returned. Disproving one “prophesy” is enough to discredit the prophet.


#5

I don’t know what Brigham Young exactly said, but if he said what you said he said about the Civil War, then he was right. The Civil War did not free the slaves. It took an amendment of the Constitution to do that. Even the Emancipation Proclamation only freed slaves in Confederate-held areas, not slaves held in Union territory.

And even then, after Reconstruction, the descedants of the slaves suffered from their voting and other civil rights being taken away, from 1880s to 1910s, by the system of segregation and intimidation known as “Jim Crow”. You could even argue that the slaves were not really freed until the Civil Rights movement, nearly a hundred years after the Civil War.

As far as Joseph Smith being alive at the time of the Second Coming, from a traditional Christian stand-point that might be false. But the Seventh-Day Adventists argue that Jesus did begin the process of making His second coming sometime in 1844, the same year Smith died. So perhaps Smith really meant that he would be alive when the second coming would be initiated.

And then you have the Baha’is, who believe that a prophet named “The Bab” announced his public ministry in May 1844, and predicted the appearance of a new, more powerful messenger of God, who would be essentially the second coming of Jesus. And Baha’is believe that Baha’ullah (who joined the community surrounding the Bab in 1844) is that messenger.

So perhaps Smith was intuiting that something was going to happen in the spiritual world, but didn’t know exactly what that would be. That seems to me to be more likely than the idea that Smith was an outright fraud.


#6

[quote=Ahimsa] I don’t know what Brigham Young exactly said, but if he said what you said he said about the Civil War, then he was right. The Civil War did not free the slaves. It took an amendment of the Constitution to do that. Even the Emancipation Proclamation only freed slaves in Confederate-held areas, not slaves held in Union territory. And even then, after Reconstruction, the descedants of the slaves suffered from their voting and other civil rights being taken away, from 1880s to 1910s, by the system of segregation and intimidation known as “Jim Crow”. You could even argue that the slaves were not really freed until the Civil Rights movement, nearly a hundred years after the Civil War.

[/quote]

That’s like saying the atomic bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki didn’t end the war with Japan, but the signing of the Instrument of Surrender on the deck of the U.S.S. Missouri did. Obviously, the goal of the U.S. in both wars was accomplished. The civil war ended slavery(no one could own slaves afterwards), therefore, the civil war freed the slaves. Voting has nothing to do with the reality that slavery exists or does not exist. Women were denied the vote for the first 100 years but no one claims they were slaves(except maybe Gloria Steinem).

Since when are SDA’s “traditional” Christians??? I’m sure many things happened in 1844 but that has nothing to do with this failed prophesy. The question is when Joseph Smith said Christ would return what did he believe about the return? I’m sure he, like every LDS I know believes that Christ will come at a given moment in time, not over the course of centuries. He also would totally reject the notion that the second Christ would be a born “reincarnated” Christ of sorts. That notion is totally foreign to LDS doctrine and would be rejected out of hand by Joseph Smith. Therefore, he was wrong in his prophesy.


#7

[quote=Ahimsa]I don’t know what Brigham Young exactly said,
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Wasn’t it Joseph Smith who predicted that the Civil War would not result in the freeing of the slaves?


#8

Prophecy rarely turns out the way you expect. Just look at what first-century A.D. Jews were expecting in a Messiah.


#9

[font=Times, Times New Roman, Serif][size=][font=Courier New]Joseph Smith did make a prediction in D & C about a “rebellion” starting in South Carolina. I believe both pro- and anti-Mormons agree that the prediction was written in the early 1830s, but there is debate about how prescient it really was. (There’s no mention of slaves not being freed, though.)
*
Verily*, thus saith the Lord concerning the wars that will shortly come to pass, beginning at the rebellion of South Carolina, which will eventually terminate in the death and misery of many souls; And the time will come that war will be poured out upon all nations, beginning at this place. For behold, the Southern States shall be divided against the Northern States, and the Southern States will call on other nations, even the nation of Great Britain, as it is called, and they shall also call upon other nations, in order to defend themselves against other nations; and then war shall be poured out upon all nations. And it shall come to pass, after many days, slaves shall rise up against their masters, who shall be marshaled and disciplined for war. And it shall come to pass also that the remnants who are left of the land will marshal themselves, and shall become exceedingly angry, and shall vex the Gentiles with a sore vexation. And thus, with the sword and by bloodshed the inhabitants of the earth shall mourn; and with famine, and plague, and earthquake, and the thunder of heaven, and the fierce and vivid lightning also, shall the inhabitants of the earth be made to feel the wrath, and indignation, and chastening hand of an Almighty God, until the consumption decreed hath made a full end of all nations; That the cry of the Saints, and of the blood of the Saints, shall cease to come up into the ears of the Lord of sabbath, from the earth, to be avenged of their enemies. Wherefore, stand ye in holy places, and be not moved, until the day of the Lord come; for behold it cometh quickly, saith the Lord. Amen.[/font][/size][/font]


#10

This is all great guys but I just need to know the reference to the second coming. I thought it was in d and c 112 but that was an error.


#11

[quote=crazyage3]This is all great guys but I just need to know the reference to the second coming. I thought it was in d and c 112 but that was an error.
[/quote]

crazyage3,

Is this what you are looking for?

Feb 14, 1835. HC 2:182. Joseph Smith preached that the coming of the Lord would be in 56 years (i.e., about 1891). This prophecy also occurs in his diary for April 6, 1843 and HC 5:336. See also D&C 130:14-17. Joseph Smith prophesies that “there of those of the rising generation who shall not taste death till Christ comes.” He prophesies “in the name of the Lord God - let it be written: that the Son of Man will not come in the heavens till I am 85 years old, 48 years hence or about 1890.” (The official historians have deleted the last phrase, beginning with “48 years” from the church history, but it is contained in the original diary.) The version in D&C 130 is phrased negatively, i.e., Christ will not come before 1890. It is also made conditional on Joseph Smith living to the age of 85. Joseph Smith says (v 16) that it might merely mean that if he lives to 85 he will go where Christ is, and therefore see his face. But that interpretation would not make sense if the revelation is in response to Joseph Smith’s inquiry about the time of the second coming (v 14).


#12

Since you are an ex mormon you know all of this stuff right??? Why did you convert? I mean mormons say that after you read the BOM,ask the Holy Spirit if it is truth. With an open heart you will find it true, guaranteed. Actually sounds like one of those infomercials. Anyway, I took the BOM but didnt read it. I felt the Lord saying “not to, dont doubt your faith” I told them this and they said “are you sure it was God”


#13

Basically what I’m trying to ask you all is …have any of you read the BOM with an open heart/mind and didnt feel it was truth ? Thank you for that post regarding the seconding coming. It’ll help!@


#14

[quote=crazyage3]Since you are an ex mormon you know all of this stuff right??? Why did you convert? I mean mormons say that after you read the BOM,ask the Holy Spirit if it is truth. With an open heart you will find it true, guaranteed. Actually sounds like one of those infomercials. Anyway, I took the BOM but didnt read it. I felt the Lord saying “not to, dont doubt your faith” I told them this and they said “are you sure it was God”
[/quote]

I have read the Book of Mormon and asked the Holy Spirit if it was true, and I did not receive any “Burning in my Bosom”. The only reason anyone finds it to be or sound true is because it is a plagerized american tale of the KJV of the bible(see my posts on Mormonism need to know for further explanation on the plagerism) If you like books about war then I recomend it. Try to find it in its original format without all the footnotes and verse breaks, it will be much easier to read.

Here is my short story of finding Truth

I have been married to a catholic for ten years and found myself at a point in our marriage when the question of how our children should be raised came up. My father being a Mormon Bishop and my mother being a bishops wife have struggled for years with the fact that thier second oldest of six children married outside the covenant and that my four children are their only grandchildren out of fifteen that were not blessed in the church, but baptized catholic. I had not gone to church for ten years , except for Christmas and Easter mass, when the question of the children came up. Having feelings of guilt and preasure from my parents I started a crusade to prove to my wife that the LDS church was the true and restored gospel and that the Catholic church was the great and abominable apostasy or the whore of babylon. what I found was that the true and everlasting gospel has been here for two thousand years from Christ to Peter to Pope John Paul II. My journey began with a the goal of giving my children a single religous up bringing that turned to finding the truth and becoming a better man, husband, and father. I will receive the Holy Sacraments of Baptism, Penance, First Communion, Confirmation on holy Saturday March 26, 2005 at St. Elizabeth Anne Seaton Parish in Tucson, Arizona


#15

[quote=ex-mormon]crazyage3,

Is this what you are looking for?

Feb 14, 1835. HC 2:182. Joseph Smith preached that the coming of the Lord would be in 56 years (i.e., about 1891). This prophecy also occurs in his diary for April 6, 1843 and HC 5:336. See also D&C 130:14-17. Joseph Smith prophesies that “there of those of the rising generation who shall not taste death till Christ comes.” He prophesies “in the name of the Lord God - let it be written: that the Son of Man will not come in the heavens till I am 85 years old, 48 years hence or about 1890.” (The official historians have deleted the last phrase, beginning with “48 years” from the church history, but it is contained in the original diary.) The version in D&C 130 is phrased negatively, i.e., Christ will not come before 1890. It is also made conditional on Joseph Smith living to the age of 85. Joseph Smith says (v 16) that it might merely mean that if he lives to 85 he will go where Christ is, and therefore see his face. But that interpretation would not make sense if the revelation is in response to Joseph Smith’s inquiry about the time of the second coming (v 14).
[/quote]

Some Baha’i argue that the 1890-91 prophecies were actually fulfilled in the Baha’i faith.


#16

[quote=ex-mormon] I will receive the Holy Sacraments of Baptism, Penance, First Communion, Confirmation on holy Saturday March 26, 2005 at St. Elizabeth Anne Seaton Parish in Tucson, Arizona
[/quote]

From one convert to another - Welcome home :smiley:


#17

[quote=Ahimsa]Some Baha’i argue that the 1890-91 prophecies were actually fulfilled in the Baha’i faith.
[/quote]

The opinon of the Baha’i ranks right up there with the opinion of the Flat Earth Society and the Reverend Sun Myung Moon.


#18

ex-mormon,

Blessed be God forever! Welcome Home. His Truth will set you free.


#19

Charles Taze Russel who founded the jehovah’s witnesses is another 19th century con man who made many predictions. None of which have ever come true. And yet…still people fall for the twisted “theology”. I think if people would just look at the history (and it’s not much) of these so-called religions, they would never get involved and would run from their adherents.


#20

[quote=catsrus]I think if people would just look at the history (and it’s not much) of these so-called religions, they would never get involved and would run from their adherents.
[/quote]

What good does it do to run from the adherents? Can you teach them the truth if you run from them? Can you help them in any way if you run from them? All you do is cause them to move on to the next person who might be convinced by what they say.


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