Psychedelics for Catholics?


#1

I saw another post about marijuana and alcohol consumption, so I was wondering what peoples general thoughts were about the consumption of psychedelics.

I ask this because I have on and off wanted to try one, but I haven’t been able to get past the morality aspect.

I can live without it, but I would like to try them. I’ve tried marijuana and alcohol, and marijuana isn’t worth the after toke focus problems and alcohol just is dumb. Kills brain cells, ya know?

I’ve done a fair amount of research and would be able to take a low dose safely, having effects a little above marijuana, which is what I would like to achieve. I would rather ask this here than on a stoner website because everyone will tell me to do it. :stuck_out_tongue:


#2

Its morally wrong and also you put yourself at a higher risk of developing psychosis or schizophrenia


#3

If you’re will to read an non-believer’s perspective on the subject, this is a good read:

samharris.org/blog/item/drugs-and-the-meaning-of-life


#4

Why bother if you can live without it?


#5

Christians are called to be Christ-like. Always assess yourself against that great example.


#6

I will tell you right now that you are not missing out on anything.

Then I will ask: what is really bothering you? Solve that and be truly happy.

Nobody utilizes chemicals for the sake of it. It is always for escape or medical purposes. I doubt you have migraines so bad that cid or shrooms is required. I could be wrong with that doubt, but you made no mention of such medical problems.

I have watched people die, lives get shattered, and all the other adverse effects for the whole I am just going to party. Trust me it will not be worth the emotional, physical, or spiritual damage.

I am just glad that a close friend of mine is no longer strung. Telling somebody's mother you need to pull an intervention is not fun, and nobody ever expected it would get that bad for somebody like him.

As for being a mortal sin . . . I have never honestly looked into that question. I would assume yes, but that is me assuming; so, take that with a grain of salt.

Oh and before anybody says it is just one time. One time can be enough for something idiotic to happen that is horrible enough to kill. One time is also enough that if caught can land you in jail. There is a real risk involved. This is not pot. You will be literally a scizo for as long as the effects last.

Whatever you decide, be safe and take care.


#7

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#8

[quote="Indifferently, post:5, topic:307025"]
Christians are called to be Christ-like. Always assess yourself against that great example.

[/quote]

Very well said. :thumbsup:

The answer to "What would Jesus do" in this case is certainly not "smoke weed", as much as the South Park generation would like to believe this. ;)

And as Christine above pointed out, using cannabis in particular is associated with a 2- to 6-fold greater risk of developing schizophrenia. The exact figures vary depending on research definitions, and are substantially higher for those with a family history of schizophrenia, but cannot be understated either.

Finally, remember the old definition of sin as "turning away from God to something lesser". Does using cannabis lead us closer to God, or could it lead us on a path away from Him? As with any substance producing addiction, I think the latter is the saner answer.


#9

This is exactly what I was wondering…


#10

When reading this post, the not-so-recent-but-somewhat-recent headlines about bath salts and flesh eating "zombies" comes to mind.

Just sayin'

I know people like you who thought "hey, as long as I do this safely I won't get into any trouble." and they are now strung out individuals, addicted, doing drugs is their life. You would be playing with fire in your experimentation and presuming you and your health will be ok. It is the sin of presumption. Its quite reminiscent of the part in the Gospel where the devil temps Jesus to go jump off a high place and let the angels catch you. Notice Jesus didn't do it. Maybe you should go find that passage and read and ponder over Christ's response. What you are considering here is taking what God has given you for granted (health, a mind that works well). We are supposed to follow Christ's example.

Why are you willing to throw away or play with the possibility of destroying or damaging something that is a gift? Sounds to me you don't realize all that you have.


#11

tricky. i've used psychadelics in the past. i don't have any need or desire to use them again though. i think if you are going into it with the idea that you want to just delve into parts of your brain that you otherwise might have trouble accessing, it isn't inherently wrong. but it is ALL about setting, expectations, dosing, and who you are with. with all that said, if you still want to do it, just be cool about it. but you are probably not going to get any sort of major breakthrough. i drink, because its relaxing and fun to socialize with it, but that's not the case with lsd or mushrooms. it is a self exploratory drug. be wise.you don't need to do it.


#12

I guess I should have mentioned before that I have tried marijuana and alcohol but find them boring, and I don’t really like them. That being said, I enjoyed that I did have the experience. I like alcohol when I’m with my friends at a bro party, because I don’t get too drunk. I remember everything up until I fall asleep.

To MaryT777. The reason I would like to try it is because I have always had a good experience with mind altering substances, because I’ve always been with my friends. When we smoked marijuana, we would set a date, invite all the guys, get some chipotle, and then about half of us would smoke and have a great time, while everyone else sat around and played video games or something. This occured at most once every month, and usually every two months, so we smoked about 3-5% of the time we hung out. Everything was well planned and fun.

To Indifferently: That was one of the moral quandrys I had. I think to myself, would Christ approve of what happened and what I intended to do? Thus, it becomes a question of whether it is fundamentally wrong to be in an altered state of mind, and to what degree this is true. I hear my Catholic friends joke all the time about drinking, which I would never hear about in my protestant church (I’m a convert), and which we all know can severely limit your abilities. Being with all guys, an experienced tripper, and low dosage, and these are all guys I have known for 6 years plus, they are my best friends, I would think using them for fun instead of marijuana or alcohol would be okay.

I can definitely understand where some of you guys are going with the “it only takes one time” logic, and if you were tripping alone, on a high dose, you could definitely do something stupid. The effects I would be achieving would be the more hallucinatory affects of marijuana, with some sensory distortion. I would be more in control than I am on alcohol.

And to Anne Elizabeth, yes I see what you are trying to say with that Bible verse, and I agree. You shouldn’t do something crazy expecting God to save you. The thing is, I’m not expecting God to save me, because I am not expecting to do something crazy. I have an experienced tripper and 5 sober guys and a low dose. That is like saying that I shouldn’t skydive because I shouldn’t test God. Well, I’m not testing God. I’m using a parachute. The only difference is that my friends are my parachute.

Plus, mushrooms do not cause people to eat people. Crazy laboratory drugs do.

I guess I am just wondering what a crazy room on shrooms would look like, is the bottom line. There isn’t a psychological or philosophical break through I am looking to have, nor am I looking to explore myself, as datritle had done. I don’t do marijuana because while it is cool, I like reality better. Same with alcohol, but I am not opposed to having a different experience as long as it doesn’t lead me into a mortal sin.

I had an old priest friend who told me that marijuana is a sin when it interferes with your life. It never did with mine. Same with shrooms. Shrooms aren’t addictive either because of the psilocybin tolerance build up, which takes place in minutes. And they are pretty expensive.

I’m not wanting to try any other drugs, at all. I had to research a drugs in high school for a health class and shrooms and marijuana were the only two that seemed okay. I tried marijuana before I tried alcohol. That’s one of the two.

I’d like to try shrooms. Thoughts?


#13

well, I am not speaking for the Church, but I don’t see any harm in this. as you said, low dose, “babysitters”, and a safe environment. sounds like you are setting yourself in a good place.


#14

One of my brothers started off using MJ in low doses in a safe environment. It progressed over the years to dependency because it is insidious that way. He told us that he liked the feeling it gave him and that he was in control, he had an executive position.

Gradually, he started behaving erratically and became paranoid. His co-workers advised my sister at a work function that he had been behaving strangely the last few months, talking to himself and telling them fanciful stories.

On several occasions he called me at all hours of the night complaining that the FBI was tailing him. We live in Australia, the FBI has no jurisdiction here. One day he borrowed a friends car and drove from Cairns to Brisbane, a two day trip and turned up on my doorstep weeping at 3am. His friend had reported the car stolen. I checked him into the nearest substance abuse ward when he was diagnosed with drug-induced psychosis. He stayed for months and came out clean. Unfortunately recently he has gone back to his old ways.

Sometimes MJ doesn't affect peoples ability to function. After long-term use, even in small doses can affect mental health.


#15

Yeah, substances can agitate conditions which may not be apparent without the substances as catalysts.

But as I said, I’ve tried alcohol, and pot, and although I’ve done both multiple times, they just aren’t fun after the initial “exploratory” experiences. As soon as I know what to expect, even if it is really random, it isn’t worth doing.

There is a good chance that I would try shrooms, feel bad, do them again, then stop. That was my pattern before. Haven’t done marijuana in… 7 months? And even then, we only smoked about once a month, for a total of 5ish times in a 6 month period.


#16

As being a former raver, burner, and goth I have vast experience in this department and I’m also heavy hardcore straight edge and sober these days. I would heed the advice of everyone here. Drugs are bs and an illusion. Especially psychedelics. You think you learn all this deep stuff about the universe and when you are sober for a while you learn it is all bull. It’s impossible to describe to someone who has never done it. And I know some people that are permafried. Oh man I almost ruined my life with this stuff. Forget if it’s ok with Christianity just think about the damage you can do to yourself like not being able to talk again or hearing demonic voices for the rest of your life. Jute people always talk about the groovy side to tripping. It gets dark bro. Don’t f ing do it. I been there. Thought I’d never come back. I guess it’s up to you though if telling worked the world would be cured.


#17

[quote="crumblymunky, post:15, topic:307025"]
Yeah, substances can agitate conditions which may not be apparent without the substances as catalysts.

But as I said, I've tried alcohol, and pot, and although I've done both multiple times, they just aren't fun after the initial "exploratory" experiences. As soon as I know what to expect, even if it is really random, it isn't worth doing.

There is a good chance that I would try shrooms, feel bad, do them again, then stop. That was my pattern before. Haven't done marijuana in... 7 months? And even then, we only smoked about once a month, for a total of 5ish times in a 6 month period.

[/quote]

me 135lbs 4grams of shrooms, big deal so what
buddy 200+lbs 4grams of shrooms couldn't even stand up any more.
"babysitters" , safe enviroment, these are good things but yu don't have a clue what it's going to do to you.

salvtis(sic) wife blown away scared to death by one hit. me yuck tastes horrible no effect.

yeah listen stay away form them.


#18

Yeah I think I've decided against them. I just get bored and thinking about stuff like this sometimes, but I remembered that it is always a big let down, so I figured I wouldn't risk it.


#19

[quote="crumblymunky, post:1, topic:307025"]
I saw another post about marijuana and alcohol consumption, so I was wondering what peoples general thoughts were about the consumption of psychedelics.

I ask this because I have on and off wanted to try one, but I haven't been able to get past the morality aspect.

I can live without it, but I would like to try them. I've tried marijuana and alcohol, and marijuana isn't worth the after toke focus problems and alcohol just is dumb. Kills brain cells, ya know?

I've done a fair amount of research and would be able to take a low dose safely, having effects a little above marijuana, which is what I would like to achieve. I would rather ask this here than on a stoner website because everyone will tell me to do it. :p

[/quote]

Crumbly,

Why not try something legal like contemplative prayer or sitting in a monastery for a year, that may change your mind some.


#20

it isn't inherently wrong. but it is ALL about setting, expectations, dosing, and who you are with

Someone always says something like this in the drug threads, but the Catechism says otherwise.

2291 The use of drugs inflicts very grave damage on human health and life. Their use, except on strictly therapeutic grounds, is a grave offense. Clandestine production of and trafficking in drugs are scandalous practices. They constitute direct co-operation in evil, since they encourage people to practices gravely contrary to the moral law.

(Bold mine)

Honestly, I think there should be a sticky about this topic, since it seems many posters don't know the actual Church teaching.


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