=joe370;10207479]The east - west schism did away with any possibility of a true ecumenical council?
I wouldn’t put it that way, but ISTM that for a council to be ecumenical it must be agreed to by the bishops. I’m sure, and actually hope for, an ecumencial council that resolves once for all the issue of the pope’s primacy.
That is a possibility. However, I just cannot imagine Jesus abandoning His church, in terms of ecumenical councils needed to resolve doctrinal discord when it arises, in order to preserve ecclesial unity. If I did not believe that to be the case, I am not sure if I would even belong to the CC, or any church for that matter.
We currently have doctrinal discord, and ecclesial unity is not currently preserved. That doesn’t mean the Spirit isn’t guiding us, only that we disagree what that guidance means. There is no abandonment by the Spirit. The problem is our discernment. That, to me, is why we need the Church, east and west, to be in unity.
I just don’t think the east - west schism or the development of protestant churches can prevent the CC from declaring something via an ecumenical council, in the same way that the CC did long ago.
It can, but the east must be there and accept it to be ecumenical, Protestant churches notwithstanding.
For example, even if all 23 eastern catholic rites broke away from the church universal, the church universal is still being guided by God, just as it was during those 7 ecumenical councils, IMHO. That’s just me, but I do see where you are coming from.
The Church of the early councils was in unity.
Well, if God is no longer guiding the CC, as God did prior to the east - west schism, then I would 100 % agree with you.
I think the difference in the way you and I view this is simply that I see the Spirit guiding not only the CC, but also the EO, and the OO, and Lutherans, etc. It is, therefore, a problem not of the SPirit’s guidance, but our discernment.