More so than Catholic doctrine, certainly, especially in church structure and soteriology.
How so exactly? What was the church structure as you see it? Which Reformed structure is like the old Church? Also teaching on salvation, how is it more so than Catholic doctrine?
It’s funny that I ran across this thread while doing a study on the word “catholic” which in the Greek was “katholikos” meaning “throughout the whole”. When the NT was translated into Latin the word “catholic” was used as a description of the church, not a name of the church. Now that word seems to be defined as “universal” but there was a Latin word for “universal” so why would they not have used that Latin word instead? That answer I have not found. I was raised in the Methodist church for 17 years and then converted to the Catholic church for the next 10 years. I left the Catholic church when I was filled with the Holy Spirit and have been a non-denominational Christian since then, almost 40 years ago. I learned the basics of the Christian religion in the Methodist church. I learned the meaning of being a Christian and loving others in the Catholic Church. I found the Lord Jesus Christ as my personal Savior when the Holy Spirit revealed the truths to me. We are all sinners, correct? We all seek truth and salvation, correct? We are all followers of the Jesus Christ and believe he is the Son of God, correct? Jesus said, “Believe in me and you will be saved.” That is all the truth I really need in my life. I believe whatever church we attend is of little consequence as long as we have accepted Jesus Christ as Savior and do our very best to follow His lead. We are justified by our faith in Him. He forgives me even though I am still a sinner just as he forgives each one of His sheep no matter which sheep pen they live in. This is just my humble opinion which of course means very little is the big scheme of things. Amen Hallelujah and Peace to all!
Just my opinion. But if you had been filled with the Holy Spirit, you wouldn’t have left the Catholic Church for another church because you would’ve realized that He is fully present in the Catholic Church.
One of my parents was Catholic and the other, Protestant. I grew up with the teachings of both sides. I was sitting in a Southern Baptist church, head bowed for prayer, when the Holy Spirit revealed to me that I needed to leave that church and return to the Catholic Church full time. That is what I did. And I have never been happier. And the parent who was Protestant is now Catholic.
It always amazes me how God moves in each of our individual lives. You and I are in the same “church” as we are Christians (followers of Christ) . I just attend a fellowship without denominational teachings. As I said though, I left the Catholic Church 40 years ago and the Catholic Church was different then as they did not follow the doctrine of the infilling of the Holy Spirit. As a young Catholic I was being taught by a young priest who also became filled with the Holy Spirit, was teaching the infilling of the Holy Spirit to the young people in the church, when the higher-ups decided he could no longer teach and moved him to a monastery. The local church lost many young worshipers when they made that move. I was one of them as I could not understand why “they” took away our teacher. Even now when I attend a mass for marriage or funeral I participate in the mass as I feel I am still a part of the “church”. I don’t take communion out of respect of the wishes of the church though. I am happy your family walks with the Lord as does mine.
Do you mean physical proximity or someone to talk to to learn about? Just because it isn’t close doesn’t mean it can’t be the truth, and the truth is worth moving somewhere else. I’m no orthodox though, I’m just seeing if you have any theological objections/problems of orthodoxy. Thanks for the reply! GOD bless.
I mean physical proximity, but I’d need to actually explore it.
“It is not those who say to me, ‘Lord, lord,’ but those who do the will of my Father in Heaven.”
In my opinion (for what it’s worth) Jesus did not come to mankind to be worshiped, but to teach.
I do not like the usually purported reason that Jesus suffered torture by crucifixion in order to enable YHWH to forgive mankind’s sins for the reason that this idea tends to obscure the true meaning of His terrible suffering. I believe that Jesus’ passion is actually an example to all of us as to how far we must be prepared to go in following the sacred Laws of our Creator.
But these issues are common to both Catholic and Episcopal Churches. To answer this thread’s question as to why I don’t convert to the Catholic faith I must note that my local Catholic Church refuses to display Jesus’ miraculous image. I gave Father Ken a nice famed picture of the Holy Face years ago, but he has never put it up in any common area. Then I gave the same to the assistant music director, Kay, who did display it in her office right next to a hallway window. There it remained for a few years. Recently I noticed that this copy of the Holy Face was not there anymore. I found out that Father Ken had refused to promote Kay when the director position became open. Kay was very upset and left St. Charles.
So, in my opinion, father Ken harbors some kind of prejudice against the Holy Face. Perhaps he doesn’t believe that the Sacred Image on the Shroud is really miraculous in nature. I have noticed this issue in other Catholic authorities. It is regrettable.
I am able to have the Holy Face on display in my local Episcopal Church. As you may surmise, this is an important issue for me.
Sorry, I don’t really want to go into detail; too much effort, and I’m not looking to debate. Maybe I shouldn’t have answered the initial question. I am, I think, reasonably aware of church history (for a layman), I’ve carefully considered Catholicism (and Orthodoxy), and am a Protestant.
No offense but that just sounds lazy to me. If you’re on a forum, especially on a Catholic forum with ideas that others are not familiar with, expect to have exchanges about things in depth and be prepared to defend your claims. I was just asking for a general answer though.
It seems that there is a lot of confusion on which religion is the correct, true, or the best path to living in Heaven for eternity with God. I can only claim what is the best for me. I’ve done some searching, reading and a lot of thinking over many, many years and have come to the conclusion that the Catholic Church is certainly the best way to the Sacred Heart of Jesus. I can see a lot of people don’t really understand the Catholic Church. The only One we worship is God, period. I pray to Mary and ask her to pray for me to her Son. Some people say ‘Mary is dead, you are wasting your time.’. I’ve asked them ‘What’s going to happen to you when you die’. I’ve received replies such as, ‘I’m going to heaven.’ Who do you think would be closer to Jesus in Heaven, a person who sincerely lived their life in the best way they felt should get them into Heaven or Mary. Praying to Mary and asking her pray for me and also remembering that the main purpose of my prayer is to worship God. there are also times when I just pray to Mary or a saint and ask them for help or thank them. When I pray the rosary I ask Mary to intercede for me and then offer the rosary to Jesus. I know some people don’t understand this. Prayer in itself is not worship, it is a form of communication. Worship comes from the heart. For me it’s the Bible plus The Catechism of the Catholic Church plus worshiping God at mass plus to never stop looking for the truth to Jesus’s heart. I hope we all see each other when we get there.
“I left the Catholic church when I was filled with the Holy Spirit and have been a non-denominational Christian since then, almost 40 years ago”
How did you know you were filled with the Holy Spirit. What specifically did the Holy Spirit reveal to you that made you leave the Catholic Church. I will appreciate if you can share your experience with us.
Greetings, Mrnuggles. I remain Protestant (in name only) because I am not persuaded of the truth of some key Catholic teachings. I’d list a few but have no desire at this time to get into a lengthy discussion on them. I have my own ongoing studies and have been attending Mass 2 or 3 times a week for nearly 4 years. I take personal retreats at a nearby monastery and have been published in a weekly Catholic newspaper.
Strictly speaking, I love the Catholic Church and feel very much at home sitting in on the liturgy. I read the Catechism, the Church Fathers, a Catholic bible commentary (the New Jerome), and always have several theological books on the go by Catholic authors. At the same time I am a very, very private person and have yet to tell anyone my name at any of the parishes I attend.
I became a higher-profile member in a cult-like evangelical church, led songs and prayers and became an accomplished public speaker. But that was never the real me. I now very much enjoy being the stranger who sits at the back and slips out just before communion. When at my desk at work I listen everyday to people like Father Mitch Pacwa and Dr. David Anders. But this is as far as I care to get involved for the moment. So I’m not Catholic, but I’m not really anything else either. However, I am quite happy with the ongoing experience.
Gotta run. Daily Mass is in half an hour and it’s just down the street from where I work.
Interesting post and welcome to the Catholic Church for all intents and purposes. You go to mass more often than many Catholics.
Is it really those issues that keep you from becoming 100% Catholic? If you were persuaded of the truth, what would be your next step?
There are certain theological issues which would have any RCIA Director raising their eyebrows if I were to tell them my opinion. But there are two other things which remain primary for me; I attend Mass because I like to. As a baptized/confirmed Catholic it would become an obligation. I spent 22 years feeling obligated to a domineering, sabbath-keeping, cult-like church. At this time I don’t care to get that involved with any one organization again, even though the RC experience has been very good up to now.
The other thing is the sign of peace. I have become a very withdrawn and private individual, which suits me fine. The gal who cuts my hair, a lifelong Catholic, told me if I don’t like being spoken to or having my hand shaken, leaving right after the Lord’s Prayer is the best time to slip away and avoid that. It took me two years to work up the courage to attend my first Mass, and another two before I was comfortable shaking the hands of a stranger sitting nearby. I sometimes will stay for that portion, but normally I am gone by the time it happens.
These may not seem like very big obstacles, and if I were seeking truth they would be easily overcome. But I am not looking for truth in religion, but rather variety. Having explored many other aspects of the faith, Catholicism has proven to be the one I like best. As to your question, what would be my next step if I decided differently, it would be to introduce myself to the parish priest and take things from there. That may happen some day, but it is not yet on the visible horizon for me.
Yes , but it is not to be saved, not a work to be justified…I believe sola fide means we are saved (justified) by faith, apart from any righteous work. I believe they would say you do righteous work, not to be saved but because you are saved, even evidence that you are…I mean even a couch potato is still your son, alive, where he was once dead…yet sola fide would say some evidence(work) of life will manifest itself.
will you please take a listen to John Martignoni? He is a smart apologist. I will post his site. God bless
may i recommend John Martignoni and the Bible Christian Society? I will post his site. He is very helpful.
plus Stephen Ray is an awesome apologist. He was a baptist for so long and converted to the Catholic faith. Here is his website
I’ve interacted with him at least once or twice. He seemed more directed toward the Reformed.
hey there Celtic warlord. I read your entry here on this page and I appreciate your honesty and where you might be coming from on religion. But when you type “religion” what exactly are you suggesting? There are hundreds of “religions” but if you are searching for a religion where God himself became flesh and dwelt among us, I think you mean the Catholic “religion”. And I don’t type “christianity”, because there are thousands of versions of “chrisitianity” that have created their own “christ” to fit their own way of living. Jesus himself, was surrounded by thousands who doubted him and he let them go and use their free will to either accept or deny him (especially those that could not handle the Truth about claiming he was to be eaten and consumed in the Bread of Life that he shared).
Please do not leave the Mass around the time of peace sharing because you are missing the whole point of the Mass in the Eucharist. The Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Our Lord is there on the altar. Be in AWE. Be present. God is calling you.