Sorry but there’s a difference between objectively looking at morals and then generalizing an entire culture based on your generalizations and assumptions of its people
By the way, it’s also important that Catholics be charitable. What you’re saying is not charitable to those faithful Catholics who are in predominately nonchristian cultures. Just because someone grew up in a culture contrary to yours doesn’t mean that yours is superior
I’d also like to point out that peter once didn’t dine with gentiles and Paul chastised him for it
I disagree. I also don’t consider that worship and lastly I don’t want to continue this conversation with you
I think one can, carefully, criticise various cultures from a disinterested perspective. Though mind you, the conquistadores were quite heinous on their own, and were apt to ignore the Church when it told them that enslaving nations was wrong.
At any rate racism, believing that one biological race is superior in dignity to other races is fundementally against Christian doctrine. Its also a rare belief, but it crops up occasionally. Its been soundly condemned in the Catechism.
Furthermore, the Church commands that not only do we treat them with equal dignity to ourselves, no form of discrimination based on their race can be allowed.
"1935: The equality of men rests essentially on their dignity as persons and the rights that flow from it: “Every form of social or cultral discrimination in fundamental personal rights on the grounds of sex, race, color, social conditions, language, or religion must be curbed and eradicated as incompatible with God’s design.” Catechism of Catholic Church,
Hopefully a Pope won’t change that like what happened with the Catechism on the Death Penalty.
I actually think this can be incultured into the Catholic Church, in as much as their ancestors might in fact be in purgatory, or in Heaven. At any rate, even if we disregard their eternal state, giving their ancestors honour would still be a good thing.
Catechism of the Catholic Church #1935:
The equality of men rests essentially on their dignity as persons and the rights that flow from it:
Every form of social or cultural discrimination in fundamental personal rights on the grounds of sex, race, color, social conditions, language, or religion must be curbed and eradicated as incompatible with God’s design.
It doesn’t say sin, but the language is strong enough to assume that. I guess it depends on what you mean by “superior”. If superior means you have basic human rights that another race doesn’t, that is treating the other race “less than human” since all humans have certain inherent rights, such as the right to life.
If it did it would only move to be even more strictly against racism. Natural development of morality always moves from the more permissive, to the less permissive.
I’m personally less concerned with the Catechism and more interested in Councils of the Church, Infallible Proclamations from Popes, and the opinions of highly respected Theologians. But to each his own.
Besides, we can all be honest and look around us and say that in modern times in America and Europe, Racist and Racism have basically lost any meaning since the word is used to mean any number of things by any number of people. First, one would have to define what exactly they consider racist or racism.
I don’t think we as lay catholics have any freedom to disagree with the Church on this. At the very least we have to give it assent of will.
I respectfully disagree. I do believe that one nation can be superior to another, if it is more just and makes better use of its talents and resources. That may have nothing to do with race, just a spirit of justice and efficient processes.
Racism isn’t that hard to define as a belief. First and foremost its the belief that its possible to sequester humanity into biological races. Which by now is considered a pseudoscience by the biological community. In an informal sense we talk of ethnicities instead, which are defined more by ancestral place of origin than by biological terms.
Secondly its the belief that certain ethnicities have inherent, essential, superior qualities. Or conversely that other ethnicities (races) have bad qualities, as an essential part of them. Something that is not due to culture, or the accidents of history, but is part of their blood.
That would be racism as a belief. Racism as an institution are all those things in society that defacto confers priviledge on the basis of ethnicity. This could be places just happening to hire more people if they’re white, even if there are equally qualified black people present. Such social experiments have been run, where the person has been blinded to the color of the person.
What’s wrong with privilege based on an ethnicity? For example, I never had a problem with Apartheid. Why? Because the Europeans were the ones who built South Africa: The Government, the Police, the Military, the Laws, the Roads, the Hospitals, the Schools, the cars, the electricity, the planes, the telephones, etc. So why should they give up control of the government? Why should they allow themselves to be governed by those who did not create their society?
The same thing in Europe. Europeans built Europe, their descendants have a right to their own countries. They should be able to have a European Culture, not a “multiculture” which basically means not having your own traditional culture. Everyone deserves a right to self-determination and a home, regardless of race. That includes Europeans.
Cultural differences is not the same as racism necessarily. Criticising the cast system of India, or the treatment of women in Yemen, or the violent gun culture of the US, doesn’t constitute believing that the people living in those places are essentially superior than others. There are specific historical, social and cultural reasons why things are the way they are.
It would be racist however to believe that India could never outgrow their cast system, or that women in Yemen could never become liberated, or that there’s just something the blood of americans that make it impossible for them to have reasonable gun control.
Europeans got first to develop a civilisation, and reach the industrial revolution. That’s an accident of history. There’s nothing inherent in our blood that did this.
Gotta say though, I’m impressed with how much open racism there is on Catholic Answers.
Even the slave owners of the South in the US hoped that one day the slaves would become a working class, and become civilised. Their racism was patronising, yours is downright xenophobic. There’s no reason why India won’t reach the wealth of Europe. There’s no reason why Africa won’t reach and even exceed the wealth of the United States of America (save perhaps climate catastrophy).
I never said anything about Europeans being Racially Superior, you’re putting words in my mouth.
I think we agree about the race issue. I guess one way to put it would be that some countries have superior value systems and are in the habit of making better choices than others. I probably disagree with you about the “reasonableness” of various gun-control laws, but that’s an issue for another thread.
Nobody has a right to come to our country. Furthermore, why should Europeans accept becoming the minority in their own countries??? How would people in Nigeria feel if millions of Europeans started moving there and told them to change their country to accommodate them and that they’re racist if they don’t do that? What about if Europeans flooded Japan and told the Japanese they have to adapt to the Europeans and welcome them and welcome being the minority in their own country or else they’re racist? Why shouldn’t people have a right to have their own country and govern themselves?
Nothing I said is “openly racist” by the way. All I did was say that “Everyone deserves a right to self-determination and a home, regardless of race.” How is that racist? I specifically said regardless of race. Furthermore, are you saying that people do not deserve a right to their own countries and that nations do not exist? That England should not be English and Russia should not be Russian? Stop with the strawmen.