Reformation Day


#1

My husband has many Protestant relatives who celebrate Reformation Day. One has a photo and quote (suppose s quote) of Martin Luther on her Facebook.

I doubt these folks know Church history. I'm toying with posting something factual about ML or the reformation they may be unaware of. Suggestions?


#2

[quote="KCT, post:1, topic:303695"]
My husband has many Protestant relatives who celebrate Reformation Day. One has a photo and quote (suppose s quote) of Martin Luther on her Facebook.

I doubt these folks know Church history. I'm toying with posting something factual about ML or the reformation they may be unaware of. Suggestions?

[/quote]

A rather mean troll is to bring up Martin Luther's book Von den Jüden und iren Lügen. You can also bring up the Peasant's War


#3

[quote="KCT, post:1, topic:303695"]
My husband has many Protestant relatives who celebrate Reformation Day. One has a photo and quote (suppose s quote) of Martin Luther on her Facebook.

I doubt these folks know Church history. I'm toying with posting something factual about ML or the reformation they may be unaware of. Suggestions?

[/quote]

Why create animosity? What charitable purpose would be served by doing that? What would be gained by angering your husband's relatives? How will that strengthen your marriage? What is the best way to evangelize? What if your actions strengthen their Protestant resolve? Will you have to answer for that on Judgment Day?

(Another clue that Facebook is the creation of the devil :rolleyes: )


#4

[quote="OraLabora, post:3, topic:303695"]
What charitable purpose would be served by doing that?

[/quote]

Instruct the ignorant ;)


#5

There are more charitable ways in instructing the “ignorant.”


#6

LIKE!


#7

[quote="KCT, post:4, topic:303695"]
Instruct the ignorant ;)

[/quote]

Read in Acts what St. Paul did on Mars Hill. Did he agitate the pagans?


#8

[quote="KCT, post:4, topic:303695"]
Instruct the ignorant ;)

[/quote]

The more likely result is just to anger your relatives, and make them hate Catholicism even more.

I have had 24 years experience of a mixed marriage (married to an Evangelical Anglican), with a Pentecostal mother-in-law, may she rest in peace. Loved her dearly. Love my wife dearly.

Similarly, my mother (Catholic) was married to an Anglican for 16 years until my father passed away suddenly (I was raised Catholic).

Can I offer a bit of advice? Dialogue on points we hold in common, i.e. love for Christ, will do a lot more to winning your in-laws over than entering into a doctrinal pi$$ing match with them.

When my late mother-in-law would try to bait me I about my Catholicism, I would just smile and change the subject.

Always remember the no. 1 rule: don't confuse evangelizing with proselytizing. Evangelizing best starts at home, by doing our best to lead a life that imitates Christ and attracting others to us.


#9

Relax, I said ‘toying’ with the idea.


#10

[quote="OraLabora, post:8, topic:303695"]
The more likely result is just to anger your relatives, and make them hate Catholicism even more.

I have had 24 years experience of a mixed marriage (married to an Evangelical Anglican), with a Pentecostal mother-in-law, may she rest in peace. Loved her dearly. Love my wife dearly.

Similarly, my mother (Catholic) was married to an Anglican for 16 years until my father passed away suddenly (I was raised Catholic).

Can I offer a bit of advice? Dialogue on points we hold in common, i.e. love for Christ, will do a lot more to winning your in-laws over than entering into a doctrinal pi$$ing match with them.

When my late mother-in-law would try to bait me I about my Catholicism, I would just smile and change the subject.

Always remember the no. 1 rule: don't confuse evangelizing with proselytizing. Evangelizing best starts at home, by doing our best to lead a life that imitates Christ and attracting others to us.

[/quote]

Excellent response. There is no point in being argumentative just for the sake of it - especially on Facebook.

Simply use this occasion to pray for your relatives and leave the Facebook Follies alone.


#11

[quote="OraLabora, post:3, topic:303695"]
Why create animosity? What charitable purpose would be served by doing that? What would be gained by angering your husband's relatives? How will that strengthen your marriage? What is the best way to evangelize? What if your actions strengthen their Protestant resolve? Will you have to answer for that on Judgment Day?

(Another clue that Facebook is the creation of the devil :rolleyes: )

[/quote]

:thumbsup:
KCT---If you did what you were "toying" with, how would you be any different from people who harass Catholics by posting trolling comments on the internet?


#12

Wow people, we Christians have so much more in common than what separates us. Even JPII did plenty of ecumenical outreach in his time as Pope. How about we put the last 500 years if bickering aside and work towards Christ's mission together?


#13

Reformation Day is primarily a Lutheran thing.....you do realize to the Lutherans and Vatican signed a Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification in 1999. THIS was the main and defining issue of the Reformation and this document effectively ends the schism caused by the Reformation. Here it is from the Vatican itself:

vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/chrstuni/documents/rc_pc_chrstuni_doc_31101999_cath-luth-joint-declaration_en.html


#14

Justin the martyr trolled the authority of Rome very hard(in his first apologetic) or take the first apologetic of Tertullian, they did not say to the officials: how faithful they are and how much they have in common. No, Justin accused the religion of Rome as something evil, influenced by the demons. Read it for yourself.

Jesus said the world will hate you, so if nobody hates you Jesus did not talked about you.
But the world has to hate us for the right reason, because of the truth. And a truth is that protestantism twisted and perverted the faith. Maybe they do not know what Luther said, maybe if they see his most obvious lies they will think about this and if they don't this would be very sad.

Peace, peace peace is all people think about, who cares for the truth as long as we have peace.


#15

[quote="Andre1000, post:14, topic:303695"]
Justin the martyr trolled the authority of Rome very hard(in his first apologetic) or take the first apologetic of Tertullian, they did not say to the officials: how faithful they are and how much they have in common. No, Justin accused the religion of Rome as something evil, influenced by the demons. Read it for yourself.

Jesus said the world will hate you, so if nobody hates you Jesus did not talked about you.
But the world has to hate us for the right reason, because of the truth. And a truth is that protestantism twisted and perverted the faith. Maybe they do not know what Luther said, maybe if they see his most obvious lies they will think about this and if they don't this would be very sad.

Peace, peace peace is all people think about, who cares for the truth as long as we have peace.

[/quote]

November 1st.

*
“Lord, make me an instrument of thy peace.
Where there is hatred, let me sow love,
Where there is injury, pardon;
Where there is doubt, faith;
Where there is despair, hope;
Where there is darkness, light;
And where there is sadness, joy.

O Divine Master, grant that I may not so much seek
to be consoled as to console,
to be understood as to understand,
to be loved, as to love.

For it is in giving that we receive,
It is in pardoning that we are pardoned,
and it is in dying that we are born to eternal life.” *


#16

[quote="Andre1000, post:14, topic:303695"]
Justin the martyr trolled the authority of Rome very hard(in his first apologetic) or take the first apologetic of Tertullian, they did not say to the officials: how faithful they are and how much they have in common. No, Justin accused the religion of Rome as something evil, influenced by the demons. Read it for yourself.

Jesus said the world will hate you, so if nobody hates you Jesus did not talked about you.
But the world has to hate us for the right reason, because of the truth. And a truth is that protestantism twisted and perverted the faith. Maybe they do not know what Luther said, maybe if they see his most obvious lies they will think about this and if they don't this would be very sad.

Peace, peace peace is all people think about, who cares for the truth as long as we have peace.

[/quote]

If you can't have peace then say nothing. Peace comes from God. Arguments, family division and hate is not from God.

Peace is where God works. I can tell you from experience that when society is in a rage, and when the world is freaking out, the one who is calm and at peace will attract people like a moth to a flame. People will ask, "How can you be so calm?" and that's the opporutinty to speak truth.

Truth at the expense of peace is not truth because both truth and peace find their fulfillment in the person of Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ is peace and truth. But peace comes first.

If you poke people in the eye then you need to expect them to poke back.

-Tim-


#17

Martin Luther is easy to attack. He was not a model Christian even for those who don't believe he was an archheretic. But I think that a less direct approach would yield more fruit, one that emphasizes the GOOD he and his descendents have missed out on. Sometimes a little snark gets the point across, but be careful with that (for evidence of it backfiring, see this forum ;) )


#18

[quote="Andre1000, post:14, topic:303695"]
And a truth is that protestantism twisted and perverted the faith. Maybe they do not know what Luther said, maybe if they see his most obvious lies they will think about this and if they don't this would be very sad.

Peace, peace peace is all people think about, who cares for the truth as long as we have peace.

[/quote]

Wow, it's 1517 all over again! Too bad we learned to love peace after the 120+ years of war that ensued including the 30 Years War that wiped out 30% of Germany's population. I just hate peace. :rolleyes:


#19

Not all Lutheran groups signed this and never will so in some people’s minds it does not end the schism. I personally don’t care how people view this as we all have freedom to adhere to our doctrinal beliefs. For the record, I am Lutheran, very conservative, but I have tons of relatives and friends who are Catholic and it is never an issue.

As for the Facebook post, leave it alone, please. You likely will cause hard feelings and will not change his/her mind. Luther was a fallen man, just like we all are. I don’t start debates when my friends post about Marian feasts or other things I don’t agree with and we respect each other’s rights to post about our individual faith traditions and observations.


#20

[quote="skigirl1689, post:19, topic:303695"]
Not all Lutheran groups signed this .

[/quote]

Sorry all members of the Lutheran World Federation did. But that is the vast majority.


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