repent


#1

who should pay?
Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

how to avoid paying ?

Ezekiel 18:21 But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die.

why God say that?
Ezekiel 18:23 Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live?


#2

Yes, we Catholics are well familiar with those words of the prophet Ezekiel and the need for repentance from sin …

that would be the purpose of our Sacrament of Confession, it is an aid to regularly and thoroughly examining our lives, and helps us in turning away from our sins :thumbsup: :cool:

you wanted to add anything?


#3

but according to these verses we didnt inherit sins from prophet Adam ,and there is no need to someone to pay for our sins :slight_smile:


#4

We didn’t inherit actual sin from Adam, even though it’s CALLED Original Sin (the term is a bit confusing), what it is we inherited from Adam is an imperfect human nature, a greater tendency to sinning than humans were supposed to have originally.

As for Christ - he chose to take some (not all) of the burden of our sins upon him. This was voluntary, not forced on him. We still pay for our own sin also, at least partially. I don’t make another MAN pay for my sin, because Christ was God, not just man.

Isn’t that what God does when he forgives anyway? He volunteers to wipe away our sin because we’re sorry for it? :hmmm:


#5

Your confusion stems from the fact that you have been misinformed about the Church’s teachings on The Fall and Original Sin. You can read the Catechism on this here:

vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p1s2c1p7.htm

And this is the summary:

**IN BRIEF **

413 “God did not make death, and he does not delight in the death of the living. . . It was through the devil’s envy that death entered the world” (*Wis *1:13; 2:24).

414 Satan or the devil and the other demons are fallen angels who have freely refused to serve God and his plan. Their choice against God is definitive. They try to associate man in their revolt against God.

415 “Although set by God in a state of rectitude man, enticed by the evil one, abused his freedom at the very start of history. He lifted himself up against God, and sought to attain his goal apart from him” (GS 13 § 1).

416 By his sin Adam, as the first man, lost the original holiness and justice he had received from God, not only for himself but for all human beings.

417 Adam and Eve transmitted to their descendants human nature wounded by their own first sin and hence deprived of original holiness and justice; this deprivation is called “original sin”.

(This means we did not inherit their sins, we inherited a wounded nature. Do you see the difference?)

418 **As a result of original sin, human nature is weakened in its powers, subject to ignorance, suffering and the domination of death, and inclined to sin (this inclination is called “concupiscence”). **

419 “We therefore hold, with the Council of Trent, that original sin is transmitted with human nature, “by propagation, not by imitation” and that it is. . . ‘proper to each’” (Paul VI, CPG § 16).

420 The victory that Christ won over sin has given us greater blessings than those which sin had taken from us: “where sin increased, grace abounded all the more” (*Rom *5:20).

421 **Christians believe that “the world has been established and kept in being by the Creator’s love; has fallen into slavery to sin but has been set free by Christ, crucified and risen to break the power of the evil one. . .” **(GS 2 § 2).


#6

yes we are sinner like our father but even if we inherited the ability to sin ,that doesnt mean we inherited the sin ,and according to Ezekiel ,we have the way to pay or being forgiven

As for Christ - he chose to take some (not all) of the burden of our sins upon him. This was voluntary, not forced on him. We still pay for our own sin also, at least partially. I don’t make another MAN pay for my sin, because Christ was God, not just man.

first ,christ didnt choose to pay for our sins ,simply bec there is no need to pay if you repent
if we still paying for our sins .

Isn’t that what God does when he forgives anyway? He volunteers to wipe away our sin because we’re sorry for it? :hmmm:

no ,its not going like that ,when God forgive sins ,he just forgive ,like when you do me something bad and i forgive you ,i dont hurt myself or make you hurt me again to forgive you
sorry but your words are contradicting ,

so we didnt inherit sin of eating from the forbidden tree?

(This means we did not inherit their sins, we inherited a wounded nature. Do you see the difference?)

so we didnt inherit “original sin”

419 “We therefore hold, with the Council of Trent, that original sin is transmitted with human nature, “by propagation, not by imitation” and that it is. . . ‘proper to each’” (Paul VI, CPG § 16).

sorry but thats not true ,the original sin is the action of eating from the forbidden tree ,not the nature of doing that .

421 **Christians believe that “the world has been established and kept in being by the Creator’s love; has fallen into slavery to sin but has been set free by Christ, crucified and risen to break the power of the evil one. . .” **(GS 2 § 2).

sorry but Ezekiel say that we will pay for our sins ,and even we dont need to pay if we repent
if as you say that christ paid to break slavery to sin ,we wouldnt sin again bec we are set free after the so called crucifixtion (i dont believe in crucifixtion)


#7

guess who is back… :rolleyes:


#8

And banned again pretty quick smart. Some folkses don’t learn.


#9

thats for sure.
i pray that he finds peace and can be peaceful to others.


#10

The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that ALL SHOULD COME TO REPENTANCE (2nd Peter 3:9). God wants ALL people to repent; that is, change their minds. God wants us to change our mind about how we view our sins. Most people try to rationalize and justify their sins. God wants us to “confess” or “admit” to Him alone that we are hell-deserving sinners. God also wants us to change our minds concerning any unbelief we may have had in the Lord Jesus Christ. We must turn to Christ in faith and believe on Him alone for the forgiveness of sins. This is repentance—a changing of the mind concerning our sin and of the Lord Jesus Christ. Simply confess your sins to Christ and ask Him to come into your heart as Savior.

Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1) -
re·pent·ance
–noun 1. deep sorrow, compunction, or contrition for a past sin, wrongdoing, or the like.
2. regret for any past action.

American Heritage Dictionary - Cite This Source re·pen·tance (rĭ-pěn’təns) .
The act or process of repenting.
Remorse or contrition for past conduct or sin. See Synonyms at penitence.

Easton’s 1897 Bible Dictionary - Cite This Source
Repentance

There are three Greek words used in the New Testament to denote repentance. (1.) The verb metamelomai is used of a change of mind, such as to produce regret or even remorse on account of sin, but not necessarily a change of heart. This word is used with reference to the repentance of Judas (Matt. 27:3).

(2.) Metanoeo, meaning to change one’s mind and purpose, as the result of after knowledge. This verb, with (3) the cognate noun metanoia, is used of true repentance, a change of mind and purpose and life, to which remission of sin is promised. Evangelical repentance consists of (1) a true sense of one’s own guilt and sinfulness; (2) an apprehension of God’s mercy in Christ; (3) an actual hatred of sin (Ps. 119:128; Job 42:5, 6; 2 Cor. 7:10) and turning from it to God; and (4) a persistent endeavour after a holy life in a walking with God in the way of his commandments. The true penitent is conscious of guilt (Ps. 51:4, 9), of pollution (51:5, 7, 10), and of helplessness (51:11; 109:21, 22). Thus he apprehends himself to be just what God has always seen him to be and declares him to be. But repentance comprehends not only such a sense of sin, but also an apprehension of mercy, without which there can be no true repentance (Ps. 51:1; 130:4).

American Heritage Dictionary - Cite This Source re·pent 1 (rĭ-pěnt’)
v. re·pent·ed, re·pent·ing, re·pents

To feel remorse, contrition, or self-reproach for what one has done or failed to do; be contrite.
To feel such regret for past conduct as to change one’s mind regarding it: repented of intemperate behavior.
To make a change for the better as a result of remorse or contrition for one’s sins.

v. tr.

To feel regret or self-reproach for: repent one’s sins.
To cause to feel remorse or regret.

God COMMANDS us to repent. “And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent” (Acts 17:30). It is not an option whether or not we want to repent, it is a divine command from Almighty God. It is wicked for any person not to repent when they have been warned to do so. We hear Bible preaching everywhere in this great nation, we are all without excuse if we fail to heed the masters call to repentance.


#11

I’m interested in the scripture verses that support your claim. Would you mind posting them? Thanks


#12

I can see that “islamtoday” does not understand the difference between inheriting a wounded nature and inheriting the actual sin.

Again, we did not inherit the sin of eating the forbidden fruit. We inherited a wounded nature inclined to sin.


#13

Does your water baptism wash away this “wounded nature inclined to sin”?


#14

You’re an ex-Catholic and you don’t know the answer to this? :confused:

Baptism removes the stain of original sin and infuses sanctifying grace into the soul.


#15

Romans 5:12Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned—

Sin entered the world through Adam

Genesis 8:21 The LORD smelled the pleasing aroma and said in his heart: "Never again will I curse the ground because of man, even though [a] every inclination of his heart is evil from childhood. And never again will I destroy all living creatures, as I have done.

God says that we are inclined to sin and evil (that Adam brought into the world) from childhood. So we are born with the tendency to sin as Adam did.
Why? Why not just punish Adam for his sins and then start over with Adam’s children? Yet Adam’s children were sinners, too. Hell, Cain was a murderer. Why would they be born with the inclination to sin if God didn’t allow that inclination to pass on to them. Makes sense if we use those brains that God blessed us with.


#16

You said… “we did not inherit the sin of eating the forbidden fruit. We inherited a wounded nature inclined to sin.”

“Baptism removes the stain of original sin and infuses sanctifying grace into the soul.”

So… are you is the “stain” referring to “the wounded nature inclined to sin” or is the stain referring to something completely different?

Forget that I’m in ex-Catholic. I’d just want to know how you’ll answer.


#17

LilyM said we inherited an imperfect human nature, a greater tendency to sinning than humans were supposed to have originally.

First, we were never supposed to sin. Adam’s disobedience that one time was all it took for the fall of man.

Also, I think that is a very watered down version of the truth. We have inherited more than just “an imperfect human nature with a greater tendency to sinning.” Adam’s sin has made all men guilty before God. Therefore all have sinned.

Rom 5:12
Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Rom 5:18
Therefore as by the offence of one [judgment came] upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one [the free gift came] upon all men unto justification of life.

Rom 5:19
For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous


#18

Since this is, apparently, a game and you just want to know how I’ll answer, I’ll put in the all the effort required to cut and paste on this one and save the more thoughtful responses for serious inquirers:

Some folks have a problem with the concept that we, Adam’s posterity, should have to pay a price for a sin we didn’t commit. They do not understand how the Church is using the term original sin. As the Catechism says, “original sin is called ‘sin’ only in an analogical sense: it is a sin ‘contracted’ and not ‘committed’—a state and not an act” (CCC 404).

catholic.com/thisrock/2005/0502fea5.asp

You can only carry guilt for a sin committed by you. The Church does not teach that the state of being born into original sin (born in a state in which even infants are subject to sin and death due to our wounded nature which Adam’s sin brought on us all) means we are born with guilt as though we personally committed the sin. There is no guilt on the infant soul but the infant soul needs to be filled with God’s grace in that dark spot (wounded nature) in order to be able to be a part of God’s Kingdom (baptism).


#19

Maybe he had not reached to learn about the holy water yet when he was catholic. :highprayer:


#20

hello ,

I have a question . If ew have inherited the wounded nature o fthe capacity to sin from the act of eating from the tree, where adam and eve sinless or have the capacity to sin ?

If they didnt have the capacity to sin then how did they sin ? If they did have the capacity to sin then surly we would have the capacity to sin without them having to eat frm the tree in the first place.

any comment?


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