Response & Refutation: Mike Gendron's "Why Can't Born Again Christians Remain in the Catholic Church?"

Why Can’t Born Again Christians Remain in the Catholic Church?

This is a question we have been asked many times in our 23 years of ministry.Then perhaps you should endeavor to give a correct and Biblical answer, Sir.

We must answer it with the authority of God’s Word.

Okay…let’s see this.

When Catholics repent and believe the Gospel of God, they are born again and the indwelling Holy Spirit will lead them out of spiritual darkness into the glorious light of Jesus Christ (Mark 1:15; Eph. 1:13-14).

Alright, here we see the beginning of his usual anti-Catholic propaganda. It assumes several things.

That Catholics do not repent or believe the Gospel of God. Notice here that he does not define what exactly that “Gospel of God” is, but I will offer the following links to relevant articles from my blog.

[LIST]
*]Who REALLY Preaches “A Different Gospel”?
*]How Is A Catholic Saved?
[/LIST]
He infers that we Catholics do not have the indwelling Holy Spirit, yet I would point out that the holy lifestyles of many devout Catholics flies right in the face of his inference. Furthermore, we can point to the great number of documented holy lives of saints such as Francis of Assisi, Maximilian Kolbe, Elizabeth Seaton, and Pope John XXII and Pope John Paul II, just to name a few. Our Blessed Lord Jesus Christ tells us in Matthew 7…
[15] "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. [16] You will know them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thorns, or figs from thistles? [17] So, every sound tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears evil fruit. [18] A sound tree cannot bear evil fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. [19] Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. [20] Thus you will know them by their fruits.

As they abide in God’s Word, they will know the truth and the truth will set them free from religious bondage and deception (John 8:31-32).

This assumes that faithful Catholics do not read and practice their faith according to the Bible, which is simply untrue. Discussions here on CAF as well as my own personal research indicate that most faith Catholics are avid Bible readers, know the Bible at least as well as our n-C contemporaries and are well aware of the Biblical basis for our most holy faith.

In many cases, my own included, we have found that the “religious bondage and deception” was not in the Catholic Church, but in the communities that we were previously a part of. (See My Testimony for details) Whether that previous deception and resulting errors was intentional is open to debate because most of those who were involved were quite sincere. I would further assert that if there is any deception from anyone involved in this discussion, that it has been already been proven to be Mr Gendron himself. Please see the following articles on my blog’

[LIST]
*]Refuting anti-Catholic tract: “Rome vs The Bible” by Mike Gendron
*]Refuting: “Is a Catholic Christian an Oxymoron?”
*] Refuting Mike Gendron’s attacks on Eucharistic Adoration
*]Response to Hard Questions to Ask Good Catholics (By Mike Gendron)
*]Refuting Mike Gendron’s tract “Are You Being Deceived?”
*]Refuting Mike Gendron’s ‘Another Jesus?”
[/LIST]
(Cont’d)

Thank you for this information my friend. For the last year I have been unsure why the Catholic Church is so highly regarded as to attract so much criticism (hatred). I was born into a Catholic hater religion, I tried to source the origin of my hatred, it ended up being Puritan, it was as complicated as a family tree, but when I got there I had no more family tree without going through Catholic. I was standing on a cliff with no bridge to Jesus Christ, and the only bridge was only the Catholic Church.

In many cases, my own included, we have found that the “religious bondage and deception” was not in the Catholic Church, but in the communities that we were previously a part of.

I agree with this so much.

It would be interesting, however, if Mike Gendron and others successfully eliminated the Catholic Church (yes that is so hypothetical and impossible), what would they then do?

Thank you for your apologetic work.

Then they will look for a church that worships God in Spirit and truth because that is the kind of worshippers God seeks (John 4:24)

And every faithful Catholic will respond to what that scripture says with a heartfelt “Amen and Alleluia!”

But let’s move on and see if Gendron is really offering truth. This we do in obedience to the Word of God, which tells us, "[FONT=Palatino Linotype]but test everything; hold fast what is good, " (1st Thessalonians 5:21)[/FONT]

Anyone who says they have been born again, yet refuses to leave a false religion that deceives people with another gospel, must examine themselves to see if they have genuine saving faith (2 Cor. 13:5).
Christians are called to walk according to the truth which means, as they become more and more passionate for the truth, they will turn away from any falsehood that stands opposed to God’s Word.

Well then Mr. Gendron it would seem from the list of my articles above that you have been hoisted upon your own petard because it is indeed my own passion for the truth that led me out of the errors of n-C communities and to return to the Catholic faith. Then further, it has been that same passion for the truth which has led me to carefully examine so much of your anti-Catholic propaganda (That you are paid for by the way, while I seek and receive no form of compensation at all. I am merely a simple and faithful Catholic who love his faith and pursues truth wherever it leads, because our Blessed Lord Jesus Christ said “I am the way, the truth, and the life…” .(See John 14:6)

I would then suggest to all those who follow you and have so far paid you to be deceived by you that they at least follow your very words here one last time, and “turn away from any falsehood that stands opposed to God’s Word.”

One of Catholicism’s false practices is described as a doctrine of demons in the Bible. Under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, the Apostle Paul wrote that some will “depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons through the insincerity of liars whose consciences have been seared who forbid people to marry” (1 Tim. 4:1-4). Catholicism is the only religion that names the name of Christ and forbids its clergy to marry, thus proving that some of its teachings are directly opposed to Scripture.

This is categorically untrue and here again, we see Gendron deceiving people, both about the Catholic faith, and even the very word of God.

First, the Catholic Church does not forbid its clergy from marrying. There are many married priests in our church from other than the Latin Rite. We are, however, the only Christian people who allow and encourage our clergy to obey the very words of Christ Himself. For a detailed study, see my article, Priestly celibacy is unBiblical. NOT!

Furthermore, since this mandate that you oppose and call a doctrine of demons, comes directly from Christ Himself, I would urge you to be cautious lest you actually find yourself blaspheming a work of the Holy Spirit.

Another reason true converts must leave Catholicism is that it demands submission of every person’s will and intellect to the bishops’ teachings. Catholic bishops are said to be the only authentic instructors and teachers of the faith, and Catholics are bound to adhere to their teaching with a religious submission of the mind (Canon Law, 753).

As usual with Gendron , he rips his quote out of all context in order to further his agenda which is deceive persons into opposing the Catholic faith, so we’ll take a look at the actual context and see if what he asserts is accurate and unreasonable.

Can. 747 §1. The Church, to which Christ the Lord has entrusted the deposit of faith so that with the assistance of the Holy Spirit it might protect the revealed truth reverently, examine it more closely, and proclaim and expound it faithfully, has the duty and innate right, independent of any human power whatsoever, to preach the gospel to all peoples, also using the means of social communication proper to it.

§2. It belongs to the Church always and everywhere to announce moral principles, even about the social order, and to render judgment concerning any human affairs insofar as the fundamental rights of the human person or the salvation of souls requires it.

Can. 748 §1. All persons are bound to seek the truth in those things which regard God and his Church and by virtue of divine law are bound by the obligation and possess the right of embracing and observing the truth which they have come to know.

Can. 749 §1. By virtue of his office, the Supreme Pontiff possesses infallibility in teaching when as the supreme pastor and teacher of all the Christian faithful, who strengthens his brothers and sisters in the faith, he proclaims by definitive act that a doctrine of faith or morals is to be held.

(Cont’d)

§2. The college of bishops also possesses infallibility in teaching when the bishops gathered together in an ecumenical council exercise the magisterium as teachers and judges of faith and morals who declare for the universal Church that a doctrine of faith or morals is to be held definitively; or when dispersed throughout the world but preserving the bond of communion among themselves and with the successor of Peter and teaching authentically together with the Roman Pontiff matters of faith or morals, they agree that a particular proposition is to be held definitively.

§3. No doctrine is understood as defined infallibly unless this is manifestly evident.

Can. 750 §1. A person must believe with divine and Catholic faith all those things contained in the word of God, written or handed on, that is, in the one deposit of faith entrusted to the Church, and at the same time proposed as divinely revealed either by the solemn magisterium of the Church or by its ordinary and universal magisterium which is manifested by the common adherence of the Christian faithful under the leadership of the sacred magisterium; therefore all are bound to avoid any doctrines whatsoever contrary to them.

§2. Each and every thing which is proposed definitively by the magisterium of the Church concerning the doctrine of faith and morals, that is, each and every thing which is required to safeguard reverently and to expound faithfully the same deposit of faith, is also to be firmly embraced and retained; therefore, one who rejects those propositions which are to be held definitively is opposed to the doctrine of the Catholic Church.

Can. 751 Heresy is the obstinate denial or obstinate doubt after the reception of baptism of some truth which is to be believed by divine and Catholic faith; apostasy is the total repudiation of the Christian faith; schism is the refusal of submission to the Supreme Pontiff or of communion with the members of the Church subject to him.

Can. 752 Although not an assent of faith, a religious submission of the intellect and will must be given to a doctrine which the Supreme Pontiff or the college of bishops declares concerning faith or morals when they exercise the authentic magisterium, even if they do not intend to proclaim it by definitive act; therefore, the Christian faithful are to take care to avoid those things which do not agree with it.

Can. 753 Although the bishops who are in communion with the head and members of the college, whether individually or joined together in conferences of bishops or in particular councils, do not possess infallibility in teaching, they are authentic teachers and instructors of the faith for the Christian faithful entrusted to their care; the Christian faithful are bound to adhere with religious submission of mind to the authentic magisterium of their bishops.

Can. 754 All the Christian faithful are obliged to observe the constitutions and decrees which the legitimate authority of the Church issues in order to propose doctrine and to proscribe erroneous opinions, particularly those which the Roman Pontiff or the college of bishops puts forth.

So, as we can all see from this extensive context (Linked here), Gendron is misleading people with his article. it’s nothing new…as you saw in my links above…he does this a lot.

A third reason to leave is that the Word of God condemns the Catholic clergy for preaching another gospel (Gal. 1:6-9). The Catholic plan of salvation nullifies God’s saving grace by adding works, sacraments, purgatory and law-keeping to the Gospel.

[FONT=Georgia]Actually, what we have here is a third reason not to listen to this man. again, I offer my article [/FONT][FONT=Georgia]Who REALLY Preaches “A Different Gospel”? which details specific scriptures regarding the plan of salvation, versus what many n-C communities offer. I urge you all to obey the New Testament mandate in [/FONT]2nd Timothy 2:15 to “[FONT=Palatino Linotype]Carefully study to present thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly handling the word of truth.[/FONT][FONT=Georgia]” Please see also [/FONT][FONT=Georgia]How Is A Catholic Saved?[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial]Not to be outdone, Catholic bishops responded by condemning born again Christians with over 100 anathemas from the Councils of Trent and Vatican II.

Here again, Gendron proves himself to be unworthy of our trust in his teaching and preaching as he misstates that the Church was “[/FONT]condemning born again Christians”, when in fact it was condemning heretical teachings as per the New Testament.

Here is what CA apologists offer concerning this.

Could you explain anathema? Does the Church teach that Protestants are anathema because they don’t agree with the Church? **

Answer**

The use of the word anathema has evolved during the history of the Church, and today it means the same thing as excommunication. (The word anathema is no longer officially used.) Because a person must be a Catholic to be anathema (excommunicated) the term does not apply to Protestants.

So then this in no way applies to n-Cs, so again Gendron is deceiving his readers.

here too is another much longer and more in depth answer. Does the Church condemn those who disagree with its teachings?

By way of addressing Gendron’s inclusion of Purgatory and the sacraments, I’ll also include my own research articles on them in refutation.

[LIST]
*]Biblical and Jewish Traditional Beliefs About Purgatory
*]“I Find No Sacraments In the Bible” he said.
[/LIST]

Glory be to God for your honest journey! May God give you every grace to both live out and share what you have found and treasured so dear. :thumbsup:.

It would be interesting, however, if Mike Gendron and others successfully eliminated the Catholic Church (yes that is so hypothetical and impossible), what would they then do

?Wander around all fall into a pit? (See Luke 6:39):shrug:

Thank you for your apologetic work.

:blush: See Luke 17:10

In addition to what you pointed out, if I am not mistaken, Vatican II pronounced no anathema whatsoever, so that is yet another reason to distrust what he says.

From the link:

Anyone who says they have been born again, yet refuses to leave a false religion that deceives people with another gospel, must examine themselves to see if they have genuine saving faith

Wouldn’t that mean that everyone must leave not only the Catholic Church but also all 30,000 Protestant denominations, except for the one which teaches the whole True Gospel?

Is there any criteria for what is a false gospel, and what an acceptable difference of interpretation?

Thank you and God Bless, Memaw

As for Catholics not being “born again” I have two things I usually say about it:

  1. The moment the waters of Baptism fall upon the head of a person, they are born again. It is a re-birth unto life in Christ and into His Church and is everyone’s 2nd birthday. All Baptized persons have been re-born and nothing can change this.

  2. Why do folks who insist that everyone be “re-born” deny the life of Christ that their Baptism gave them? Why isn’t my Baptism good enough for them?

I try no to talk to them if they are hard-line about this. And most of them are.

Glenda

I see Gendron’s name mentioned alot on CAF. Obviously he’s getting under alot of people’s skin. Thanks for helping those people who might be troubled by him, by systematically rebutting Gendron’s positions.

Thank you, Church Militant, for being both tough and knowledgeable. Gendron is a nasty bit of goods - a liar and a deceiver.

I tried my hand with him and ended up bruised and bloodied. He twists the words of Catholics and Catholic sources (including the Bible), quotes out of context, and has no shame.

The arguments against Gendron will (likely) not convince him, but they are useful for those who might be fooled by him.

I have not seen any good anti-Catholic material in a while. Thanks. It re-affirms my joining the Catholic Church. John MacArthur was my original inspiration. When these people have to say things that can clearly and demonstrably be seen as false for one steeped in Scripture and exegesis, it just highlights the truth found in the Catholic Church.

BTW - The biggest objection to the whole “forbidden to marry” part, besides the fact that no one is really forbidden to marry, is that St. Paul was not referring to the clergy. He was referring to* everyone* being forbidden to marry, perhaps because the world was going to end. The Catholic Church elevates Marriage to a Sacrament and calls it holy.

I have no respect for a Bible preacher that knowing misuses the Bible. I guess he could just be ignorant and lack skills, or simply not be able to be intellectually honest with himself. :shrug:

I hadn’t thought of that, but I believe you’re right! Thank you! :thumbsup:

Yeah, it does present a huge problem for n-Cs and so far I’ve encountered none who can respond definitively, though they all tend to imply that what they believe/preach is it, but when questioned closely they cannot make that case.

Sometimes…that’s the best you can do, though I always pray for encounters with objective seekers who will follow the truth wherever it leads them. We just have to keep sowing the seeds.

Yeah, but we already know that he’s just a small but noisy gong who’s given more cred than he really merits and doesn’t like it when we can and do answer back. Check out, Mike Gendron & GLC get a dose of counter evangelism (and don’t like it)

Sorry to hear that. Ya gotta remember that people pay him to push this stuff. This is how he makes his living, and controversy that he feeds also feeds his wallet. I’d have no problem if PTG did what their name suggests and proclaimed the Gospel, but the way this guy butchers the scriptures in his messages and his a-C agenda is enough to make you question his motives. You have to take all of scripture in context in what you believe…not just the parts that can be twisted to make you sound like you know what you’re talking about. That’s one reason that I love being Catholic because we never do that.

BTW - The biggest objection to the whole “forbidden to marry” part, besides the fact that no one is really forbidden to marry, is that St. Paul was not referring to the clergy. He was referring to* everyone* being forbidden to marry, perhaps because the world was going to end. The Catholic Church elevates Marriage to a Sacrament and calls it holy.

I have no respect for a Bible preacher that knowing(ly) misuses the Bible. I guess he could just be ignorant and lack skills, or simply not be able to be intellectually honest with himself. :shrug:I completely agree my friend! This is one reason that I do these threads and articles from time to time, so that people can see the holes and misinformation in his stuff and hopefully, being honest believers, separate themselves from him and anyone else who propagates similar stuff.

Like I said above I looked into the celibacy allegation and that resulted in the following article. It’s a long way from any “doctrine of demons”. Priestly celibacy is unBiblical. NOT!

However…it occurs to me that Our Blessed Lord Jesus Christ made a very clear statement about lies and their father in John 8:44. "You are of your father the devil, and your will is to do your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, and has nothing to do with the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks according to his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies."

Hello Church Militant - Michael.

You are awesome. Lots of man-hours on the job in the Vineyard. The Church is blessed to have you. Keep it up!

Glenda

:thumbsup: :clapping:

Just FYI. The article for my blog, taken from this discussion is now online at
Refutation: Mike Gendron’s "Why Can’t Born Again Christians Remain in the Catholic Church?"

So, the question to any and all of Mike Gendron’s church members, supporters, and those who believe what he teaches, is…If he is wrong on all these points, both about what the Catholic Church actually teaches and about what the Word of God says, then how must one respond to this reality?

Is he a trustworthy person?

Have any of Mike Gendron’s supporters ever responded here? I haven’t noticed, tho I’m here sporadically myself.

Great information. Always enjoy reading your posts. Keep up the good work.

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