Revelation


#1

Why does God not always clearly reveal himself to those who seek him with a sincere heart?


#2

He does, maybe not just in the way we would want him to or expect him to. :thumbsup:


#3

Have you believed because you have seen, Thomas? Blessed are those who haven’t seen and still believe”.

Look at the Egyptians in Exodus and the Jews who saw all the miracles and still rejected God’s Word. I don’t think clear revelations have much of a greater affect.


#4

I’m not just talking about seeing something.

The Catholic Church teaches that faith is partially a human act, but also a gift from God. Why is it that people honestly seek faith and seek to know the truth, but God doesn’t give them the gift of faith?


#5

Because God knows what we need, and needs differ from person to person.

God speaks directly to my wife, providing key insights in moments of quiet. When we struggled to conceive, God told her she would have a son. We received the anointment of the sick, and she became pregnant the next cycle. Our son was born on St Patrick’s Day this year, a rare St Patrick’s Day during Holy Week.

We’ve struggled with external family issues for some time. God provided her insight into the problem in more specific terms than I’ll recount here. She asked Him why He told her these things, and He responded, “To give you hope.”

I’ve never had the privilege. Maybe I haven’t needed it. Perhaps I wouldn’t have listened. But I know in my bones God is there for me, watching over me and my family. My wife and I have wound up in the same place spiritually, thought the journey was long and confusing. I can only assume that God knows best, and like the loving father He is, gives us what we need, not what we think we want.


#6

Maybe God is giving them the gift and they’re not accepting it. Some of us are like the rich man in Matthew 19. We want eternal life, we just don’t want to give up the things in our life that prevent us from receiving Eternal Life.

Jesus offers it to the young man, but yet he still walks away dejected because he knows he can’t do what Jesus asks.

I think that’s often the case with us silly mortals. We want eternal life, but we want it on our terms and not God’s.

P.S. Sorry if I misunderstood you the first time (and for that matter, if I still misunderstand you).


#7

But doesn’t everybody need to know God? Scripture and Tradition make it very clear that faith is absolutely essential. And yet some people seek it with all their heart, but can never seem to find God.


#8

I think they don’t find the God that they are looking for.

IMO, these are the people that say, “I think God just wants us to be good. I don’t think it’s about going to church on Sunday. If I live a good life, I think I’ll go to heaven”.


#9

Have you ever seen the motion picture Sargeant Philko, with Steve Martin? One scene, Martin is standing in the middle of a golf course, beautiful sunny day, not a cloud in sight. Martin screams something to the effect, “God give me a sign!!!” At that moment lightening strikes all around him for about a minute, it looks like fire and brimstone! when it gets quiet, Martin repeats, “ANY sign”. How clearly do we need? Perhaps a memo? How about a teaching Church?


#10

I am a practicing Catholic. I go to Mass multiple times a week, I go to Confession almost every week. I donate money to the Church. I try to follow all the Church’s teachings, even the ones I don’t understand. I read Scripture, philosophy, theology, apologetics, and more. I want to have faith. I want to live my life not out of fear of damnation, but love of God.

Tell me then, what am I holding back? What reason would I have for not accepting faith?


#11

Believe it or not, but some people are actually more interested in finding the truth than confirming what they already believe in.


#12

Doesn’t God already know that?


#13

“Seek, and ye shall find.”

I know many who claim to be seeking Truth, but none who make an earnest attempt and fail at it.


#14

Awake, I have no clue, for I don’t know you. You are asking a generic question, and I’m giving you my best assumption.

Why do you go to Mass? What do you feel when you go to Mass?


#15

You must not know many people then.


#16

Because I fear damnation and because I hope that God will somehow reveal himself to me.

What do you feel when you go to Mass?

I feel like I’m wasting an hour of my life.


#17

If this is why you go to Mass, then I feel that you aren’t wasting an hour of your life, but you are not getting out of it what you can. There’s no such thing as wasting an hour at Mass. But there is much lost opportunities even while at the Mass.

Think of someone walking through a flower bed and they are so afraid of the potential snake in their path, that they fail to see the flowers. That’s what it sounds like you are doing. Instead of reaching out to Jesus, you’re cringing and saying “Don’t hurt me. Don’t send me to hell”.

The reasons we go to Mass are:
a) To give glory to God. What do you think about when you pray the “Glory to God in the Highest” or “Holy, Holy, Holy”? Are you as joyous as the people on the walls of Jerusalem who shouted, “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord, Hosanna!” as you prepare for the coming of Jesus in the Eucharist?
b) To give Thanks to God for all His Gifts. The meaning of Eucharist in Greek is “Thanksgiving”. Before any prayer, do you give thanks to God. Do you listen to the “Collects” before the readings or to the Eucharistic Prayer?
c) To Reconcile us with God. Here we ask God for forgiveness for our sins. This is much more important than many people realize. In seeking forgiveness, do we really believe that Jesus has forgiven our sins, and hence, have we forgiven ourselves? I have particular trouble with this sometimes, Awake.
d) To pray for others to be drawn to God. We are the Body of Christ and we should pray for one another that we are drawn to Christ together.

One more thing Awake, have you read any stories about how saints (such as the future saint Mother Teresa) have experienced extended dry spells - periods where they don’t feel God’s presence in their lives at all? The Church teaches that this is God’s way of testing you, strengthening those who will need it later in life.

Good Luck my brother!

I used to attend Mass every Sunday and occasionally daily Masses as a lenten devotion, and I was the one falling asleep in the middle of the homily. It took around 38 years for me to start receiving something out of the Mass. I found out the problem was me. I wasn’t reaching out to Christ in the Mass, I was simply wondering what was for lunch or whatever. I don’t know what happened to me, but it happened.

Now I’m 44 years old, and I center my daily work schedule around what Mass I can attend. It is simply out of a thirst to be with Christ. But if you saw me 8 years ago, you would never think I would seek anything in the Mass other than maybe to visit with my friends afterwards.


#18

Consider this from my point of view. I do not know God. He has not revealed himself to me. The closest thing he has done to revealing himself is having me born into a Catholic family and giving me a fear of damnation. I don’t know what it’s like to have a relationship with him. (I could imagine what it’s like, but I’ve never had that experience.)

So what am I supposed to do? Well, even though I don’t know God, I’m supposed to do all that I can to get to know him. I’m supposed to do all that I can to obtain faith. And so I read, pray, discuss, contemplate, frequent the sacraments, and try to lead a life according to what the church teaches.

And then I’m told that I’m doing it wrong. I’m not supposed to go to Mass because I want God to reveal himself to me; I’m supposed to go so I can praise and give glory to him. I’m supposed to reconcile with him and pray that others can know him. Well isn’t that just great. I don’t know God other than reading what other people have written about him, but I’m supposed to be going to Church because he’s my best friend and I want to spend time with him and give him praise.

One more thing Awake, have you read any stories about how saints (such as the future saint Mother Teresa) have experienced extended dry spells - periods where they don’t feel God’s presence in their lives at all? The Church teaches that this is God’s way of testing you, strengthening those who will need it later in life.

Yes, I’ve heard of dry spells. But show me one saint who has never had a religious experience or who God hasn’t revealed himself to.


#19

Yes, you’re on the right track so far. As a matter of fact, you’re way ahead of the curve. Not everyone is born Catholic or with a desire to get to know God like you. You sound like you’re far ahead of others.

And then I’m told that I’m doing it wrong. I’m not supposed to go to Mass because I want God to reveal himself to me; I’m supposed to go so I can praise and give glory to him. I’m supposed to reconcile with him and pray that others can know him. Well isn’t that just great. I don’t know God other than reading what other people have written about him, but I’m supposed to be going to Church because he’s my best friend and I want to spend time with him and give him praise.

Why do you have this urge for God to reveal himself to you. Do you think that will bring you faith? Does someone have to be your best friend in order to appreciate what they’ve done for you?

Have you seen what God has done for others around you or at your Church?

Yes, I’ve heard of dry spells. But show me one saint who has never had a religious experience or who God hasn’t revealed himself to.

God doesn’t reveal himself to many of the saints. Or I’m not sure what you mean by “reveal Himself”. Can you explain?


#20

God has already revealed himself to you. He is in the Word and he is in the Eucharist. Ask the Lord to give you eyes of faith.

You will also find God in the poor and needy. They are Jesus in disguse.

(I hope this doesn’t confuse you)


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