Richard Dawkins & Moral Relativism


#1

lifesitenews.com/news/richard-dawkins-theres-nothing-wrong-with-a-little-mild-pedophilia

Is anybody surprised by this connection between atheism, evolution, and moral relativism?

Do morals also evolve?

Your thoughts?


#2

Sadly, I'm not surprised by this. When people turn away from God they will find any sort of justification for their sins and turn themselves into gods. It's really sad. According to Dawkins, he doesn't feel any lasting effects of being abused by his teacher. I'm not sure I believe him. Denial? Rationalization of his atheism? He needs some prayers.

He also said it's not as bad as being raped and is some sort of shade of gray. Excuse me?? This is a disgusting example of relativism. What I think he fails to realize is that rape and abuse like what he suffered come from the same perverted inclination. It doesn't matter which one appears to be worse as they both have lasting effects on the victims.

Just what I thought of after reading the article. This poor world suffering from such atheistic, relativistic thought. :(


#3

I read the article and I do think that some crimes are worse than others. I think the Church even teaches that some sins are worse than others but I am different from Dawkins in how I judge between the two crimes of "touching up a child" and raping an 8 year old. He thinks that "touching up" is a shade of grey, I think the two crimes are shades of black. Dawkins is not a smart man.


#4

Grey is Satan's favorite color.
,


#5

Dawkins is presenting that humanity sees morality differently over time and place, as myself an atheist I agree with this observation but that doesn't mean I agree with relative morality, if I go to Afghanistan I won't stone women for adultery.

I believe that there were moral and enlightened people who refused injustice in all periods, when the laws were injust, sadly they were few.

He is saying something that Pope Benedict earlier said :

In his traditional Christmas address
yesterday to cardinals and officials working
in Rome, Pope Benedict XVI also claimed that
child pornography was increasingly
considered “normal” by society.

“In the 1970s, paedophilia was theorised as
something fully in conformity with man and
even with children,”

Just stating out a reality doesn't mean you support it.


#6

**InSearch

Grey is Satan's favorite color.**

I expect so. The devil surely loves those who compromise with evil. :eek:


#7

[quote="Charlemagne_II, post:6, topic:339239"]
**InSearch

Grey is Satan's favorite color.**

I expect so. The devil surely loves those who compromise with evil. :eek:

[/quote]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't "gray area" a term used to describe areas where prudential discernment is required? While it's tru that many choose evils, I just don't see "gray area" the same way. To me, a gray area can be a blessing, a place where we as Christians are able to practice walking on our own two feet and puting into actions what we have learned. A failure in a "gray area" that was done with the intention to do what one believes is right, is not the same thing as a gray area as Dawkins puts it.


#8

**Corrie

To me, a gray area can be a blessing, a place where we as Christians are able to practice walking on our own two feet and puting into actions what we have learned.**

You may be right. I'm not aware of that use. The use I'm more familiar with is that gray represents an unfamiliar or vague aspect of a thought or decision or a feeling. It could also mean a middle or neutral ground. When Jesus says "He who is not with me is against me" I see him recognizing two colors, black and white. With respect to truth and love we cannot sit on the fence with the gray cats. :rolleyes:

If you are anywhere near Lubbock, you live in God's country! :thumbsup:


#9

[quote="Charlemagne_II, post:1, topic:339239"]
lifesitenews.com/news/richard-dawkins-theres-nothing-wrong-with-a-little-mild-pedophilia

Is anybody surprised by this connection between atheism, evolution, and moral relativism?

Do morals also evolve?

Your thoughts?

[/quote]

This is a real can of worms.. if you only see things in black and white then anything that is inappropriate Behavior is plainly wrong.. Charlemagne ll has raised an interesting issue..
I'm not sure if it has much to do with Atheism as such, but rather the fact that Moral standards do evolve over time... consider slavery being an acceptable practice some time ago but now we find it repulsive.. should we jail everyone that has touched a child in an inappropriate manner ? where is the line in the sand ? first the culprit must be found out..
then should there be some form of measurement to judge the crime to the jail term required ? or should there be a standard sentence of five years ?
I read the story of Richard Dawkins, and he does make the mind think, thats why I said Where is the line in the sand....
He does make for interesting reading on a number of subjects,


#10

Phil
**
should we jail everyone that has touched a child in an inappropriate manner ?**

Why not? :confused: Are we going to make exceptions to favor some but not others?

Where is the justice in that? :confused:


#11

[quote="Charlemagne_II, post:10, topic:339239"]
Phil
**
should we jail everyone that has touched a child in an inappropriate manner ?**

Why not? :confused: Are we going to make exceptions to favor some but not others?

Where is the justice in that? :confused:

[/quote]

This is where I say it's a real can of worms... I'm not defending this behaviour in any way...
Justice should be swift,,, but the point that Richard Dawkins was trying to make was should a Guilty person of inappropriate behaviour like touching , be punished the same as a person that actually conducts a rape of a child ? I think he was meaning as in jail term punishment..
it can become a grey area if we allow it to be...


#12

[quote="CorieDreams, post:7, topic:339239"]
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't "gray area" a term used to describe areas where prudential discernment is required? While it's tru that many choose evils, I just don't see "gray area" the same way. To me, a gray area can be a blessing, a place where we as Christians are able to practice walking on our own two feet and puting into actions what we have learned. A failure in a "gray area" that was done with the intention to do what one believes is right, is not the same thing as a gray area as Dawkins puts it.

[/quote]

Well, it is sometimes said that Satan's favorite color is grey because he does not like absolutes and he loves to insert in our minds that truth changes. One can have wiggle room and all sorts of justifications, whatever works to slip out of blame and accountability. This goes along with moral relativism.

For example, pornography is justified by its creators and consumers as a harmless or victimless crime / activity. They will excuse the category of soft porn, would justify it as just use of artistic license, far different from hard core. However, with more exposure and desensitization, it can and does progress to hard core on the part of producers and consumers.

You could say that Richard Dawkins for whatever reason is minimizing the effect of what he labels as mild pedophilia, as if it is no big deal at all.

Catholic writer / philosopher and professor Dr. Peter Kreeft is reportedly credited with the quote "grey is the devil's favorite color."

I came upon this picture of a sign, although the subject is made plural (shades of grey, instead of grey):

http://dailyoftheday.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/enhanced-buzz-839-1343056322-24.jpg

The sign had something to do with the 2011 poorly written yet bestselling erotic book Fifty Shades of Grey, which created a reading storm among women, young and old(er) for its depictions of BDSM.
,


#13

It could be a cop out by blaming satan for mankind's misdeeds,,,
How about we stop blaming satan and take responsibility for our own action,,,,


#14

[quote="Phil_Marinus, post:13, topic:339239"]
It could be a cop out by blaming satan for mankind's misdeeds,,,
How about we stop blaming satan and take responsibility for our own action,,,,

[/quote]

To fail to recognize Satan as the prince of darkness and the priest of evil is to accept his victory in our life.

The spiritual world is real, good and evil. We can only be good and do good through the Grace of God; on the other hand, we can only do bad through the hands of the devil. Our actions are the choice of which power to follow, holiness or evil.

Joshua 24:15

"...But as for me and my household, we will serve the Lord...":thumbsup:


#15

Phil

*It could be a cop out by blaming satan for mankind's misdeeds,,,
How about we stop blaming satan and take responsibility for our own action,,,, *

As Catholics we do blame ourselves. Confession is a form of self blame. But Satan does tempt us in the hope of ruining us and making us his slaves and increasing the empire of hell.


#16

[quote="Charlemagne_II, post:1, topic:339239"]
lifesitenews.com/news/richard-dawkins-theres-nothing-wrong-with-a-little-mild-pedophilia

Is anybody surprised by this connection between atheism, evolution, and moral relativism?

Do morals also evolve?

Your thoughts?

[/quote]

You know, perhaps this incident of being 'touched up' when he was 11 was the catalyst for Dawkins quest to eliminate the experience of guilt from his life. A child who is fondled in a sexual way, experiences natural guilt. That guilt reveals two things. First that his body is special and a temple and this act has been a violation and secondly that he might have encouraged this violation of his innocence in some way. If this second, a misconception, is not dealt with realistically, he has to find some other way to be freed from the guilt. That would be to deny the guilt and attribute it to ‘made up’ taboos. Get rid of religion and you get rid of the taboos that explain the guilt… or create the guilt as he would suggest. Where Dawkins is mistaken is that religious rules and taboos, far from being arbitrary and man made... are written in natural law. As Aquinas said 'divine law presupposes natural law'.

There are no shades of grey on a continuum regarding children and sex abuse. Even a man looking at child pornography is a criminal.


#17

LongingSoul
**
There are no shades of grey on a continuum regarding children and sex abuse. Even a man looking at child pornography is a criminal. **

And at the very least his face and address should be plastered on the local t.v. station for sex offenders so that parents may protect their children from him.


#18

Richard Dawkins is a very confused man. He needs a lot of prayers. His subjective understanding of the moral code holds no water and he will run around in circles until the day he meets his maker.


#19

[quote="Lapey, post:14, topic:339239"]
To fail to recognize Satan as the prince of darkness and the priest of evil is to accept his victory in our life.

The spiritual world is real, good and evil. We can only be good and do good through the Grace of God; on the other hand, we can only do bad through the hands of the devil. Our actions are the choice of which power to follow, holiness or evil.

Joshua 24:15

"...But as for me and my household, we will serve the Lord...":thumbsup:

[/quote]

Who is in charge of you mind ? you should be ! It is your own individual free thinking will that allows Satan or God to enter and give you guidance .. its up to you which way you go..
satan or God are not at the controls of your mind, you are...
I personally could not give a hoot for satan because I refuse to accept his Guidance ..
If I have a weakness for some sinful nonsense , then it is my responsibility , not the guidance of satan... we are not in the spiritual world, we life in a mortal world, where things perish ...


#20

[quote="Charlemagne_II, post:15, topic:339239"]
Phil

*It could be a cop out by blaming satan for mankind's misdeeds,,,
How about we stop blaming satan and take responsibility for our own action,,,, *

As Catholics we do blame ourselves. Confession is a form of self blame. But Satan does tempt us in the hope of ruining us and making us his slaves and increasing the empire of hell.

[/quote]

Very well said.... satan will tempt you but ultimately it is up to the individual to accept..


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