Sacrifice?


#1

Where in the scripture does it say that we should or should not sacrifice? My protestant friends keep on saying the Eurcharist is bad because the Lord commanded us not to sacrifice and in our Mass we say that we do.


#2

[quote=emom]Where in the scripture does it say that we should or should not sacrifice? My protestant friends keep on saying the Eurcharist is bad because the Lord commanded us not to sacrifice and in our Mass we say that we do.
[/quote]

if your friend is making a claim about Christ’s words in scripture and their meaning, it is up to him to provide the citation and the source for his interpretation. don’t even begin to discuss the issue until he does so. meanwhile, you may direct him to Christ’s clear words in the Last Supper where he commands us to do precisely what he did in instituting the Eucharist, precisely as a memorial (re-presentation) of his sacrifice.


#3

Try these tracts: -

Sacrifice of the mass

The Eucharist is a true sacrifice, not just a commemorative meal, as “Bible Christians” insist. The first Christians knew that it was a sacrifice and proclaimed this in their writings. They recognized the sacrificial character of Jesus’ instruction, “Do this in remembrance of me” (*Touto poieite tan eman anamnasin; *Luke 22:19, 1 Cor. 11:24–25) which is better translated “Offer this as my memorial offering.”

Christ in the Eucharist

Jesus first repeated what he said, then summarized: “‘I am the living bread which came down from heaven; if any one eats of this bread, he will live for ever; and the bread which I shall give for the life of the world is my flesh.’ The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, ‘How can this man give us his flesh to eat?’” (John 6:51–52).

His listeners were stupefied because now they understood Jesus literally—and correctly. He again repeated his words, but with even greater emphasis, and introduced the statement about drinking his blood: “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in you; he who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. For my flesh is food indeed, and my blood is drink indeed. He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him” (John 6:53–56).

The Institution of the Mass

Vatican II puts the Catholic position succinctly:

“At the Last Supper, on the night he was betrayed, our Savior instituted the Eucharistic Sacrifice of his Body and Blood. He did this in order to perpetuate the sacrifice of the cross throughout the centuries until he should come again, and so to entrust to his beloved spouse, the Church, a memorial of his death and resurrection: a sacrament of love, a sign of unity, a bond of charity, a paschal banquet in which Christ is consumed, the mind is filled with grace, and a pledge of future glory is given to us” (Sacrosanctum Concilium 47).

Even a modestly informed Catholic can set an inquirer right and direct him to biblical accounts of Jesus’ final night with his disciples. Turning to the text, we read, “And he took bread, and when he had given thanks he broke it and gave it to them, saying, ‘This is my body which is given for you. Do this in remembrance of me’” (Luke 22:19).

The Greek here and in the parallel Gospel passages (Matt. 26:26; Mark 14:22) reads: Touto estin to soma mou. Paul’s version differs slightly: Touto mou estin to soma (1 Cor. 11:24). They all translate as “This is my body.” The verb estin is the equivalent of the English “is” and can mean “is really” or “is figuratively.” The usual meaning of estin is the former (check any Greek grammar book), just as, in English, the verb “is” usually is taken literally.

Fundamentalists insist that when Christ says, “This is my body,” he is speaking figuratively. But this interpretation is precluded by Paul’s discussion of the Eucharist in 1 Corinthians 11:23–29 and by the whole tenor of John 6, the chapter where the Eucharist is promised. The Greek word for “body” in John 6:54 is sarx, which means physical flesh, and the word for “eats” (trogon) translates as “gnawing” or “chewing.” This is certainly not the language of metaphor.


#4

There are a great number of passages in Scripture that support the Eucharistic sacrifice and sacrifice that is pleasing to God. Hope this helps.

Eucharist Prefigured in the O.T.

Leviticus 24, 1: 5-9

Eucharist Prophisied in O.T.

Malachi 1: 11

Eucharist Promised by Christ

John 6: 48-60 (already listed above)

Eucharist Prepared

Luke 22: 15

Eucharist Instituted

Matthew 26: 26-28
Mark 14: 22-24
Luke 22: 19-20 (mentioned above)
1 Corinthians 6: 23-26

Eucharist Celebrated and Received

1 Corinthians 10: 16-17
1 Corinthians 10: 21
1 Corinthinas 11: 27-29
Acts 2: 41-42
Acts 20: 7

Sacrifice pleasing to God O.T.

Psalm 4: 6
Psalm 50: 18-19
Ecclesiasticus 35: 2-5, 8-9 (most likely will not be in your friends protestant bibles…they exclude this book)
Malachai 1: 10-11

Sacrifice pleasing to God N.T.

Hebrews 13: 16
1 Peter 2: 5


#5

Peace be with you!

The Eucharistic sacrifice is the same sacrifice as Christ on Calvary. We need not do any new sacrifices because Christ’s was the perfect sacrifice. We do not do a new sacrifice each Mass, but rather the same that has been done before, only in a different way because in the Mass Christ is not being crucified anew.

In Christ,
Rand


#6

[quote=emom]Where in the scripture does it say that we should or should not sacrifice? My protestant friends keep on saying the Eurcharist is bad because the Lord commanded us not to sacrifice and in our Mass we say that we do.
[/quote]

Others gave you some good Scripture references. So I will reinforce what a previous poster said.

Get them to show you the exact Scripture references they are saying Catholic teachings contradict. Don’t let them make statements without backing it up with Scripture. Write down the references and bring them here.

Because I can guareentee you that there is not one teaching in the Catholic Church that contradicts Scripture. If it appears that way when they explain it to you from the Scripture shown to you, DON’T WORRY! The have just misinterpreted Scripture. Bring the references here and we can help you with the real meaning of the Scripture and/or set you straight on what the Catholic teaching is.

An example: Only God forgives sin. When Catholics go to a priest to have their sins forgiven, they are going against scripture.

This statement implies that the Catholic Church teaches that a priest forgives sins by his own power. Catholics agree that only God forgives sin. (I or others could find it in the Catechism if needed.) But in John 20:21 - 23 Jesus Himself told the Apostles to “go and forgive”. (He did not tell them to go and teach forgiveness, as you Evangelical friends might say, He said go and forgive!) Jesus gave the authority to the apostles to forgive, in His name! When the president sends an ambassador he sends them with the presidential authority. No one believes that the ambassador is making the deals, we know the president is the deal maker. In this way, ONLY GOD Forgives sins, but priests have been given the authority to do so in His name.

My prayers are with you. I pray that through this struggle of yours, your faith in Christ, your knowledge of the teaching of Christ as given to the Catholic Church and your faith in the teachings of the Catholic Church are strengthened. And I also pray that seeds are planted with your friends and that you will see the harvest!!!

God Bless,
Maria


#7

[quote=Rand Al’Thor]Peace be with you!

The Eucharistic sacrifice is the same sacrifice as Christ on Calvary. We need not do any new sacrifices because Christ’s was the perfect sacrifice. We do not do a new sacrifice each Mass, but rather the same that has been done before, only in a different way because in the Mass Christ is not being crucified anew.

In Christ,
Rand
[/quote]

You are correct. Christ does not die again at Mass. We remember his sacrifice as if we were standing at the foot of the cross. We receive in the host the risen and glorified Christ.


#8

I agree with MariaG entirely. . .Require your Protestant friend to provide you with the proof-texts that say that we, as Christians, should no longer bring any sort of sacrifices before the Lord!

And when they do. . .

What about Malachi 1:11?

“For from the rising of the sun, even to its setting, my name is great among the nations; And everywhere they bring sacrifice to my name, and a pure offering; For great is my name among nations, says the Lord of hosts.”

Here, we see very explicitly that the Lord expects “a pure offering” “from the rising of the sun, even to its setting” (which is a poetic way of saying all the time, forever). That “pure offering,” we know is not the Old Testament idea of sacrifice. Instead, the only “pure offering” that the Lord would possibly accept from all nations for all times is the once and for all offering of His Son, Jesus Christ. God found no favor in the sacrifices of the Old Covenant. Instead, His Son came as the once and for all sacrifice which we re-present to the Father through the Son “from the rising of the sun, even to its setting” during each and every Mass that is said here on earth.

And what about 1 Peter 2:5?

“You too are living stones, built as an edifice of spirit, into a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.”

We, all Christians, are called into the holy priesthood of believers. The primary function of a “priest” is to offer sacrifice before the Lord. If we were no longer meant to offer sacrifice, then why is St. Peter telling us to?

Basically, the whole New Testament is peppered with the idea of sacrifice. For a Christian to deny that sacrifice is needed or required is to deny the message of the gospel. We are to take up our cross daily and follow in the footsteps of our Lord. His once and for all sacrifice on the Cross has made our sacrifices (spiritual and sacramental) acceptable before the Lord.


#9

You don’t need to demand that your friend produce the quote. Show your knowledge of Scripture by identifying the passages for him:

Hos 6:6: For I desire steadfast love andnot sacrifice,
the knowledge of God, rather than burnt offerings.

Mt 9:13: Go and learn what this means, `I desire mercy, andnot sacrifice.’ For I came not to call the righteous, but sinners."

Mt 12:7: And if you had known what this means, `I desire mercy, andnot sacrifice,’ you would not have condemned the guiltless.

No where in these quotes does it say that we should not sacrifice; these quotations from Hosea and our Lord indicate that sacrifice for its own sake is empty. The sacrifice we offer in the Mass is none other than the Sacrifice of Christ himself, a re-presentation of the one perfect sacrifice offered for all time on Calvary.


#10

[quote=mercygate]You don’t need to demand that your friend produce the quote. Show your knowledge of Scripture by identifying the passages for him:

Hos 6:6: For I desire steadfast love andnot sacrifice,
the knowledge of God, rather than burnt offerings.

Mt 9:13: Go and learn what this means, `I desire mercy, andnot sacrifice.’ For I came not to call the righteous, but sinners."

Mt 12:7: And if you had known what this means, `I desire mercy, andnot sacrifice,’ you would not have condemned the guiltless.

No where in these quotes does it say that we should not sacrifice; these quotations from Hosea and our Lord indicate that sacrifice for its own sake is empty. The sacrifice we offer in the Mass is none other than the Sacrifice of Christ himself, a re-presentation of the one perfect sacrifice offered for all time on Calvary.
[/quote]

isn’t the sacrifice we make the gifts?? we offer the bread and
wine, with the prayer that God will find our offering pleasing and turn it into the Body and Blood of our Lord… we aren’t sacrificing
the Lord again, we are accepting the sacrifice he made for us
by doing what he instructed us to do… (( i also understand the
deeper sacrifice of ourselves, but i’m refering to the gifts at the
altar ))…

remember, i’m a newbie catholic, i will be confirmed at Easter…

:slight_smile:


#11

These are all great posts, I think an important point for your Protestant friend is that the Eucharist is the perfect sacrifice pre-destined in the Passover sacrifice that God Himself commanded. Jesus is the lamb, we eat His body and blood like the OT Jews did. The only difference is this is a perfect sacrifice.


#12

[quote=Rand Al’Thor]Peace be with you!

The Eucharistic sacrifice is the same sacrifice as Christ on Calvary. We need not do any new sacrifices because Christ’s was the perfect sacrifice. We do not do a new sacrifice each Mass, but rather the same that has been done before, only in a different way because in the Mass Christ is not being crucified anew.

In Christ,
Rand
[/quote]

Please explain this because I completely don’t understand how it is the same sacrafice but different. I thought it was the same sacrafice, renewed. I’m lost…

Thanks in advance,

cheddar


#13

1364 In the New Testament, the memorial takes on new meaning. When the Church celebrates the Eucharist, she commemorates Christ’s Passover, and it is made present the sacrifice Christ offered once for all on the cross remains ever present.185 "As often as the sacrifice of the Cross by which ‘Christ our Pasch has been sacrificed’ is celebrated on the altar, the work of our redemption is carried out."186

1365 Because it is the memorial of Christ’s Passover, the Eucharist is also a sacrifice. The sacrificial character of the Eucharist is manifested in the very words of institution: “This is my body which is given for you” and "This cup which is poured out for you is the New Covenant in my blood."187 In the Eucharist Christ gives us the very body which he gave up for us on the cross, the very blood which he "poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins."188

1366 The Eucharist is thus a sacrifice because it *re-presents *(makes present) the sacrifice of the cross, because it is its *memorial *and because it *applies *its fruit:

1367 The sacrifice of Christ and the sacrifice of the Eucharist are one single sacrifice: “The victim is one and the same: the same now offers through the ministry of priests, who then offered himself on the cross; only the manner of offering is different.” "And since in this divine sacrifice which is celebrated in the Mass, the same Christ who offered himself once in a bloody manner on the altar of the cross is contained and is offered in an unbloody manner. . . this sacrifice is truly propitiatory."190

Does this help, Cheddar Sox?


#14

Yes! Thank you very much!

cheddar


#15

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