Schoolboys punished with detention for refusing to kneel in class and pray to Allah

Schoolboys punished with detention for refusing to kneel in class and pray to Allah

Two schoolboys were given detention after refusing to kneel down and ‘pray to Allah’ during a religious education lesson.

Parents were outraged that the two boys from year seven (11 to 12-year-olds) were punished for not wanting to take part in the practical demonstration of how Allah is worshipped.

Full Story

Maybe the First Amendment isn’t such a bad thing, after all, um?

Those who are all in favor of putting government-sponsored religion in public schools often forget what the practical implications will be.

More brilliant inter-religious insight from the Daily Mail.

Couldn’t they have waited with the story until they had substantive information from the school and teacher involved?

Perhaps you would prefer the same article from the Telegraph?

World Net Daily:

worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=68785

Or This is London:

thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23509115-details/Schoolboys+punished+with+detention+for+refusing+to+kneel+down+and+pray+to+Allah/article.do

Amen. And this is why all Christians and anyone else who cares about free speech as well as freedom of religion should cast aside their concerns about abortion and focus on dangers to speech. Support the jurisprudence that the non-partisan ACLU favors and the rights of Christians in this area of free speech and religion will forever remain. Don’t and look in fear at what’s happening in Canada or Europe.

Oh yes we are all absolutely terrified of the Muslims here in London, why walking down my street is a comple nightmare with young Muslim women wheeling their kids to the shops and back. Why I never know when one will whip back the covers from the recumbent child and detonate a stick of
C-4 or spray the passing bystanders with a hail of bullets from a Kalashnikov.

You’ll excuse me if I pass on the Daily Mail also - Kaninchen pointed out elsewhere it’s wonderful ongoing support for fascism in the 1930s and while I don’t absolutely agree with her on all subjects I tend to dislike the ‘shock, horror, look what them Muslims are doing now’ type of news found in that paper continually and agree with her about the ugly underlying motives behind such reporting. Also, it’s rather less than 20 years since that paper was calling us Irish pyschopathic pigs regularly in it’s cartoons and editorials (carrying on in a long standing tradition of anti-Irish cartoons in the popular press in the UK) so I’m just a wee bit biased against it perhaps.

I’d like to know the actual reality of this case and what actually happened - what is see here is scaremongering yellow journalism.

And btw if you think I always agree with Muslims on all issues or points look through my posts for quiet lot of evidende to the contrary. I just dislike the unbalanced tone and rhetoric of the kind of reporting we see in this article.

Amen. And this is why all Christians and anyone else who cares about free speech as well as freedom of religion should cast aside their concerns about abortion

Isn’t it just possible we can have freedom and protect the unborn? I sure hope so.

and focus on dangers to speech.

Very basic. When a regime wants the freedom to abuse it’s people, the first thing it goes after is freedom of speech.

Support the jurisprudence that the non-partisan ACLU favors and the rights of Christians in this area of free speech and religion will forever remain.

Not just Christians. Although the ACLU is commited to protecting the rights of students to pray in school, carry a Bible, and so on, it also protects the rights of non-Christian, something the Church says is also essential to a free society.

Don’t and look in fear at what’s happening in Canada or Europe.

Too bad, they don’t have the first amendment that protects them from government interference in religion.

But we do. Be thankful to God for His great blessing upon us.

Europe is a collection of a large number of countries with widely differing outlooks on how religion is practised or incorporated into the state so it’s impossible to use a blanket term such s ‘Europe’ when discusssing religion throughout o many countries.

Thank you, that was much better. Yes, the teacher should have had more sensitivity.

I feel sorry for the poor people at Dhimmi Watch who have to read the Daily Mail every day so that others can get their daily fix of ‘Muslim ate my police dog’.

You got to wonder about the “shoot the messenger” type responses is to attack the source. Are some so blinded by hate of anything that does not come from a liberal source (unless it furthers their agenda) must be completely false?

The Daily Mail speaking favourably Human Rights legislation, get your cameras out quick!

Anyone’s who’s ever taken RE in this country (I mean England, I think Scotland has a different system so I won’t comment on that) would know that it’s almost exclusively on Christianity, so there’s no need to panic about Muslims taking over English schools. If anything English kids should be learning more about Islam, seeing how Muslims are 3% of our population. I had RE lessons twice a week at secondary school and sixth forum for 7 years, and we never looked at Islam in a single lesson, not even once. Most of our lessons were on Christianity with the occasional (and very brief) look at Judaism, Sikhism, Hinduism and Buddhism, but funnily enough never Islam.

Speaking as an American, I am finding it difficult to place this story into a proper context.

What’s RE? Does it stand for “Religious Eduction”? If so, does this take place in public school? I’m having such a hard time trying to figure out the role of classes like this in a secular school, could someone help me out?

As a former geography teacher in an American middle school, we covered religion only in a cultural context. This meant we gave a brief rundown of the major tenants of the religion’s belief system, history of its development, and description of major holidays. That’s it. There was no practicing of anything, deliberately so. Any discussion of the pros and cons of one religion over another, or any activity that could be construed as participation in the religion was strictly forbidden. Are things so different in the U.K.?

Good for those boys. I hope the parents sew this school for every last penny. If the school has asked them to pray to Jesus, the school would be bombarded by the media and in a lot of trouble.

Cari, the UK is a constitutionally Christian country and most public schools were founded by the Anglican Church (we don’t really have ‘secular’ schools). So RE (yes that’s religious education) is taught from a Christian perspective and is mandatory.

We often find the whole ‘prayer in schools’ debate in the US puzzling too, because here it’s illegal to *not *have a daily Christian prayer service in public schools. So Nate, I don’t mean to be rude here but you ought to learn a little about how other countries do things before passing judgement; the situation with praying to Jesus in school is wholly different here than in the US.

If everyone cast aside their concerns for abortion, who is going to need free speech?

What about this also? For those of you who are just poo pooing this whole thing like it’s nothing. (my bold)
Last month, WND **(World Net Daily) **reported Principal Robin Lowe was reassigned after staging a mandatory lesson in Islamic religious beliefs for nearly 900 students at her Houston-area school.
The controversy erupted at Friendswood Junior High when students were diverted from a scheduled physical education class and taken to a special assembly.

In the 40-minute session, representatives of the Houston office of the controversial Council on American-Islamic Relations, an organization critics link to terrorist groups, presented a lesson in the religious beliefs and requirements of Islam.

The CAIR representatives instructed students that Adam, Noah and Jesus are prophets; announced “there is one god, his name is Allah”; taught the five pillars of Islam; told students how to pray five times a day; and gave instruction on Islamic religious requirements for dress.

The assembly had not been authorized by the district, officials confirmed.

If everyone cast aside their concerns for abortion, who is going to need free speech?

It might be difficult to understand, but there are other evils in the world than abortion, some of them just as evil.

If you don’t have free speech, there will be mandatory abortions, count on that.

It apparently is even harder to understand that if you don’t give a voice to an innocent preborn that probably nothing else will matter.

Apart from the fact that:

  1. there is no constitutional provision that the UK is a Christian country;

  2. most public schools were not founded by the Anglican Church;

  3. most schools are secular,

you’re entirely correct there.

So RE (yes that’s religious education) is taught from a Christian perspective and is mandatory.

No, anybody can opt their children out of any daily rite of religious observance.

We often find the whole ‘prayer in schools’ debate in the US puzzling too, because here it’s illegal to *not *have a daily Christian prayer service in public schools.

Actually, the provision is supposed to be ‘mainly Christian’ in nature but, again, anybody can opt their children out of any kind of religious observance.

When I was a child in public school learning about the Middle Ages, one of the class’ favorite days was when we pretended to be Catholic monks. I was Protestant at the time. The teacher met us outside and had us put all of our jewelry or other nice things in our bags, then we entered the dimly lit room. One station had Gregorian chant on a tape player where we knelt for prayer, one had manuscripts to copy at desks, one had brown paper on the floor for resting, and one had cards with chores we each had to do. We were silent the entire class. We all loved it!

I could see some parents not wanting their children to participate in it. None of the parents knew about it because teachers don’t usually share their lesson plans in advance, so they would have had to make their religious tenants known up front so the teacher would alert them. That teacher would have and would have given some interesting reading, listening, or viewing instead if she’d known. Many teachers today would have intentionally not told the parents, thinking they know what is better for the children than their own parents do. I don’t see why the teacher made a problem out of it. If some 12 year olds care enough about their faith that they won’t bow down in another religion’s prayer posture, ask them some questions or give them a comparable asignment to determine their understanding and move on. That’s part of her job description. Making twelve year olds do Muslim prayers against their will isn’t…Patricia

DISCLAIMER: The views and opinions expressed in these forums do not necessarily reflect those of Catholic Answers. For official apologetics resources please visit www.catholic.com.