Scripture vs. Tradition

Hi Ruzz,

Why don’t we go here and start a discussion on Scripture and Tradition and compare and contrast it.

posted by Ruzz
I once heard someone state that using clips from the bible, they could prove that aliens are coming to pick us all up in 50 years.

This is the problem with grabbing a verse or a few words to support any doctrine. It must be taken with full context.

I don’t think the RCC has made up anything from thin air. It can all be supported using bible pieces.

However there are many teachings that are hard to fully support biblically. This is where “TRADITION” fills the void.

Such as:

Infant baptism

I think we should possibly discuss this more generally?

You have a point. A point that Catholics do not deny. But then the doctrine of the Trinity is a classic example of implicit doctrine that has been explicitly defined.

You can’t say it is explicit, because we have JW’s and Oneness Pentecostals who disagree from Scripture that the Trinity is even implicit. So how do we know? From Tradition. How are Protestants any different in this, only the field has been narrowed as to what Tradition they wish to accept?

A few more teachings and practices that aren’t in the Bible:

  • Abstinence from alcoholic drinks

  • The exchange of rings at a wedding

  • The pre-Tribulation Rapture

  • Liberian

How are Protestants any different in this, only the field has been narrowed as to what Tradition they wish to accept?

How do protestant’s views come from tradition?? Some protestants accept the trinity view while others do not. They read the bible and interpret it by what the holy spirit tells them. How is this tradition?

But you know… all Protestants long for a tradition. You read JW’s speaking of Arius, or Adventsts talking about the Waldenses, or James White arguing that sola scriptura was in the early church fathers… Protestants try and establish their own hidden tradition that the Church rejected and that they now embody. Lol… we really all want to be Catholics, without coming to terms with the fact that the Church will not teach what we invent.

And so Protestants seek a spiritual apostolic succession oppresse by the universal Church. Wisely did Irenaeus criticize the Gnostics for rejecting the tradition and succession of the Catholic Church for their own tradition and succession. Rather, he said:

“…we shall confound all those who, in whatever manner, whether through self-satisfaction or vainglory, or through blindness and wicked opinion, assemble other than where it is proper, by pointing out here the successions of the bishops of the greatest and most ancient church known to all, founded and organized at Rome by the two most glorious apostles, Peter and Paul—that church which has the tradition and the faith with which comes down to us after having been announced to men by the apostles. For with this Church, because of its superior origin, all churches must agree, that is, all the faithful in the whole world. And it is in her that the faithful everywhere have maintained the apostolic tradition” (Irenaeus, Bisop of Lyons, 180 CE: “Against Heresies”, 3:3:2).

You also have to keep in mind that much of our “tradition” is found in scripture, just in scripture rejected by protestants.

I find the apocryphal books to be full of wisdom and teachings that help me live a more devoted life.

[quote=Jayson]You also have to keep in mind that much of our “tradition” is found in scripture, just in scripture rejected by protestants.

I find the apocryphal books to be full of wisdom and teachings that help me live a more devoted life.
[/quote]

I agree…the wisdom books (Wisdom, Sirach) are great! But, of course, I had some Protestant tell me that the Dueterocanonicals “contradict the Word of God”…as if they know better what is or is not the Word of God.

Maybe for another thread, but:

If you interpret it (the bible) by what the Holy Spirit tells you, then why does the Holy Spirit tell you different things (i.e. all the differences in all the Sola Scriptura, or Bible only faiths)???

NotWorthy

[quote=Rand Al’Thor]I agree…the wisdom books (Wisdom, Sirach) are great! But, of course, I had some Protestant tell me that the Dueterocanonicals “contradict the Word of God”…as if they know better what is or is not the Word of God.
[/quote]

:rotfl:

I find that really funny!

Someone please explain how alter calls, wednesday night church service, the sinner’s prayer and a plethera of other of their traditions are not man made.

They are adding on more and more traditions…and you’ll notice this at wedding ceremonies. If you go straight through the ceremony it lasts all of 5 minutes, but if you pay 15,000$ people want them to last longer, so they’ll add the couples favorite song, so the congregation sits and stares at the bride and groom while Shania Twain sings forever and always or some such song

I found that awkward…and it was difficult not to giggle

I think this is such a great topic! I just read a post on another forum about someone feeling confused about what to believe when it came to scripture. She said she reads one person’s explaination and it sounds good, and then she reads another’s explanation that condradicts the first one’s explanation but that also makes sense to her, and she gets confused. That’s where the need for proper interpretation comes in to the picture. God would not leave us a bible to be interpreted in thousands of contradicting ways! There is one truth, and dueling scripture verses will not cut it when trying to understand what God was telling us.

Hi all!

This is something that Orthodox Jews & Roman Catholics have in common. We rely on the traditions passed on, and maintained, by our Sages, much as you really on those passed on, and maintained by, the Church, to teach us (inter alia) how to understand the Scriptures and how to act on the basis of these understandings. If 100,000 Jews/Roman Catholics drew 100,000 different, subjective, conclusions from the Scriptures, we would soon have communal anarchy (how many Protestant groups/sects are there?) & no internal cohesion/discipline. We each have our respective authorities to provide the necessary structure, cohesion & discipline. Sola Scriptura is as alien to our way of thinking as it is to yours.

Be well!

ssv :wave:

posted by bkniceley

How do protestant’s views come from tradition?? Some protestants accept the trinity view while others do not. They read the bible and interpret it by what the holy spirit tells them. How is this tradition?

Because most protestant denominations do not interpret Scripture without the further understandings and “traditions” or explanations of men. Luther, Calvin, Wesley.

This is no different than Catholics who today can point to Scripture and Augustine, Justin Martyr etc.

But your point that they read Scripture and interpret it by the Holy Spirit cannot be right. The Holy Spirit could not tell one person there is such a thing as the Trinity and another that there is not. One is a lie and one is truth. The Holy Spirit is not a liar.

Maria

Next time you debate a protestant, ask them to show you in scripture where it specifically states that the Bible was meant to be the sole authority for Christians.

If they cannot (they can’t it’s nowhere in the bible :wink: ) then the belief of sola scriptura disproves itself because “that’s not in the Bible!”

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