Seeking forgiveness of sin from God

I am not a strict Calvinist.

I believe the CC teaches you can not only lose your salvation, but one of your levels of heavenly statehood, as per Jesus parable (saved as if by fire). It is per that understanding one can also look at our Paul texts without being a Calvinist.

I believe you get to the pearly gates and the sign reads, " welcome. you have chosen well". You pass thru and the back side of the sign reads," you have been chosen since before the foundations of the earth were laid".

Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
Acts 2:41 KJV

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Same way the priest can even absolve, by the very Word and blood of Christ.

How do you know you are? I mean you might deceieve yourself, let alone Satan, into thinking you are really sincere in your priestly confession, especially if you seem to fall into the same kind of error confession after confession.

No one escapes the need for faith, which apprehends the evidences of our spiritual reality. And faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God. A believer is to have ears to hear whether from the priest and/or the Lord Himself. A believer also has a mouth, whether to declare His forgiveness as a priest in confessional, or corporate teaching/ preaching or “one to another”.



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Yes, there is precedent, and reliance becomes " customary" ( sorry, watched to much Amy barrett…in tears sometimes).

I like to cite the book of Job here, where his three friends almost pontificated their reasonings unto Job for his misfortune. A less well known but very youthful friend lastly came on the scene to do likewise :

"And Elihu the son of Barachel the Buzite answered and said, I am young, and ye are very old; wherefore I was afraid, and durst not shew you mine opinion.

7 I said, Days should speak, and multitude of years should teach wisdom.

8 But there is a spirit in man: and the inspiration of the Almighty giveth them understanding.

9 Great men are not always wise: neither do the aged understand judgment." Job 32

The three friends were wrong and had to repent, for the younger Ellihu indeed spoke the word of the Lord with correct understanding.

I would also mention the Jewish leaders of Jesus time pretty much said the same thing you did. They justified themselves (as Job did) thru reliance on precedent, citing origins and presumed continuity in Moses and Abraham.

He doesn’t.

You know this well.

Elihu was wrong too. Notice how God doesn’t pay him any mind.

Elihu’s spirit is alive in Protestant Christianity, claiming God as an authority, but having no sanction from Him.

But that particular truth isn’t what Paul is saying. He’s saying that even he has to be wary of losing his salvation and being presumption, so his converts have to be too.

The Holy Spirit isn’t a gumball machine that you put a quarter into and get a prize out of when you want one.

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Me thinks that perhaps - and I’m spit-balling here - this was where that comment was pointed (vis-a-vis “gumball machines”).

“Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives, and the one who seeks finds, and to the one who knocks it will be opened. Or which one of you, if his son asks him for bread, will give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a serpent? If you then, who are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask him!"

Doesn’t apply to the passages in question. God can give you something other than what you ask for, or lead you to places you weren’t thinking of.

The post that I responded to:

…is simply indicative of a mercurial feeling that comes not from God, but from hoping that one’s choice is right, whatever it may be. “I wanted to do this thing, I prayed over it, and the Spirit came into my heart and affirmed it” is usually how that sort of thing goes.

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Ah yes. The fake Protestant Holy Spirit experience. We had one of those I think - maybe?

About 6 months after our son was born, we discovered that he wasn’t progressing normally. At about 9 months we were informed that he had “global delay” (what used to be called “mental retardation” among other things back in the day.) And we cried. A lot. And we prayed. A lot. (You know things are serious when you and your wife are at the same side of the bed on your knees weeping - the only other time that happened was when our favorite pro-sports team was about to make it to the world series, but I digress…)

Initially we prayed for healing - because you think that if he was just “normal” everything would be OK. And then - when we came to terms with our reality, we started praying for peace. And at some point, I think we were sitting in one of 1,000 doctor office visits, I looked at my wife and I told her that I knew - for the first time in my life - what Paul meant by the “peace that surpasses all understanding” Don’t get me wrong - stuff was still hard, but everything had changed. And today we look back on those early, bleak, dark days and are thankful. We’re thankful for our son, for the blessing that he is to our family - and also for what he’s done for our faith - he’s literally a gift from God. I know a peace that surpasses understanding. (BTW - this is a big reason why I stand side by side with my Catholic brothers and sisters on pro-life issues - but that’s for another forum :slight_smile: )

Now I’m pretty sure that what I experienced wasn’t a “mercurial feeling that comes not from God, but from hoping that one’s choice is right whatever it may be” up. Maybe I did. I’m merely a Protestant after all. Either way though, I’m giving credit and thanks to God for our son, and for the peace in our hearts.


This is exactly what I’m talking about when I say:

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Except by saying the same thing and more!

Did Elihu have to repent? He was not corrected like the other three. It is like God picks up where Elihu left off.

Where was he wrong? Come again?

Any commentary, on said text, official or not, to support this from anyone?

Sometimes the barb is tossed around about having an authority problem. Would have to reread but don’t recall Elihu pulling any authority argument ( which is weak for any argument) .
Understanding is not needing an authority to be right, but authority is best to have a right understanding. We also are called to let right understanding be authoritative in our pronouncements.

Six voices gave their opinion in Job. Only God was truly authoritative, and the whole book is about knowing not just His understanding, and to line up with it, but knowing Him for who He is. He is more than authority or understanding.

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He wasn’t praised like Job.

If anything Elihu needed to keep his mouth shut.

7I thought, ‘Age should speak; advanced years should teach wisdom.’ 8But it is the spirit b in a person, the breath of the Almighty, that gives them understanding.

Yeah, Elihu is a motor mouth. He’s only gained reputation in this day and age which has many Elihu’s.

He’s given authority to an entity clearly. Many do not recognize it.

Actually, he gets very little play, unlike the 3 .

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