Did the church change the “rules” for allowing couples to have sex after it was no longer possible for validly married couples to have children together?
The Church never had such a rule.
First, God would have to change the image of Himself in order to change the image and likeness of his highest creation.
I think holding hands or a kiss or a phone call is as much a part of the ongoing sacrament of Matrimony as making love in bed.
I’ve seen one day workshops for marraige enhancement in parishes, complete with a baby sitting system. We will see more. The Chastity pages are great, they answer a lot of questions, but I would like to see more informative pages about sex for married couples: problems and solutions. The Church is in full favor of sex in an “irrevocable love” relationship whenever the submission is mutual.
there is no rule against it, there never was a rule against it, so no, the Church did not make a change
It’s unclear what you mean by “change the rules” since there are no “rules”.
So far everyone’s answered exactly what I already thought. I ask because I went to a weekend retreat where the person teaching said that this changed in the 1970’s or 80’s…one of the two. I never thought that was correct. But if it did then their should be documents that point to it and I’d like to see them.
I wonder if that’s what people did because they mistakenly thought that had to abstain. It seems that in order to be open to life we have to be open to even a miracle for whatever reason, not that that is likely to happen.
I understand by the wording of your question that you want to continue to have sex after menopause.
Since we are in a direct line of descent spiritually from Abraham, and since Abraham was having sex with Sarah after menopause, and since the angelic visitors indicated that Sarah would be pregnant within a year of their visit, the heavenly directive to Abraham was to continue to have sex with Sarah even though she was post-menopausal. Thus post-menopausal Catholic women are permitted to have sex.
I’m not sure that’s the reason, but the OP assumes a “rule” in existance that never was. :shrug:
Ha Ha Ha Ha
No I’m intentionally be vague so as to not scandalize someone that led the class I’m talking about. I’m intentionally avoiding saying which class it was. My personal assessment is that this person, who should be in the know, said that the Church used to not allow married couples after menopaus have sex. It was hard and etc. etc. I never heard this growing up and the time that it supposedly changed was a time I rmemeber very clearly. I never heard that before in my life and I’m old enough to know. I’m not dumb you know, but then you don’t know me.
If what this person said were true today I would never have been allowed in my current situation. I just thought I’ve gotten things wrong before, maybe there was something related to this.
The person I speak about is a cleric.
Charity suggests the cleric should be gently and respectfully informed of his error.
Surely not a Catholic cleric?
(And don’t call me Shirley…ta da boom)
I am so very tired of this one getting around, the “no sex after menopause” nonsense!
I would catagorize him as a mainstream Catholic. This was the only thing I bit my tongue on though. I really wanted to say something, but I was not there as a participant as much as someone that was preparing to take over the retreats. I was hoping someone would crawl out from a rock and admit that there used to be many that were like this. I know my dad thought all non-Catholics were going to hell and that is not a teaching of the Church, nor ever was. It may have been taught, but it’s not part of “Official” teaching. But I’ve seen some try to argue that it was. I was hoping to see if there was any basis for believing this even though I still think that its way out there.
If I am correct it was Saint Augustine that taught that and he was wrong. The church says that. He caused a lot of confusion and anxiety in Catholic Marriages after Menapause.
The Church wants married couples to have as much sex as they can or want all through their married life.
The Church never had rules on this But Saint Augustine did teach that having sex for any other reason than procreation even in marriage was a sin and he was wrong. That probably is what this couple are refering to.
No, but I appreciate your comments. I sort of remember this about Augustine. But I was away from the church for quite some time. However, I know for a fact that is not what they were saying. The man said for a fact it changed in the early 1980’s…my wife remembers too.
Given his pre-Christian past, Augustine had a lot of hang ups about sex and I think, as great as he was, these hang ups in some way hurt the church.
Sex after menopause or during pregnancy, limbo, all suicides and protestants go only to hell, etc. I expect at one time or another, over the centuries, that well meaning people including priests and religious have taught such things as being “Infallible Church Teaching.” When we read threads written by folks suffering from scruples, it is not so difficult to see how these teachers go astray. It is not just lay folks who can go off track.