I understand why sleeping around is bad, STIs, loss of self-esteem, etc. Why is sex with your boyfriend still considered fornication? Why is all premarital sex wrong? What about people who are in consensual friends-with-benefits type relationships? If someone you care about is dealing a sexual sin, is it your duty to tell them they are wrong or correct them?
“Thou shalt not fornicate with man nor beast”. As far as I know it is your duty to correct them.
If you can understand that there are spiritual things we can’t see then this could make sense. If not, you’re going to think I’m nuts… lol. But here goes.
Unfortunately we learn the hard way and people didn’t really know WHY it’s a sin, just that we have to listen. Since we see no harm we do it anyway.
Well a cord or connection, a spiritual/psychological/emotional tie is created even with a one night stand. Once you are with many partners and didn’t know this you can be clogged spiritually and be dragged down with baggage. If with Jesus and in the spirit you pray to cut these ties you CAN be free but that doesn’t just give you a free pass to keep going.
Cutting the ties can be difficult especially if their was heartbreak or children involved. Spirits can attach to your wounds or misguided information from the experience which can be VERY BOTHERSOME later in life. It can be very hard to relieve yourself of it later.
The problem is when we finally do find LOVE and try to have intimacy we run into these sexual ties and baggage. Sex without love is sin because God is absent. If God is absent then who is present? The “Who” that is present instead sticks around and prevents you from experiencing love because “it” (entity) can’t be there if God is there and spirits do not like to leave.
But unfortunately the spiritual reality is hard to grasp or we just never knew it existed so we do what we want thinking people were wrong and justify our own actions. I’ve known people who got married just so they could have sex and that’s obviously an abuse of the sacrament and resulted in a bad marriage.
That’s why we need a connection to the Holy Spirit to guide us. It’s not because God is punishing, it’s because things are the way they are and we will get results. God WILL help us because he knows we don’t know, BUT we should obey the warning signs and his loving guidance.
Just my two cents because I’ve learned the hard way!!! Hope it helps you.
**Here are some selections from the Catechism regarding fornication. **
2353 Fornication is carnal union between an unmarried man and an unmarried woman. It is gravely contrary to the dignity of persons and of human sexuality which is naturally ordered to the good of spouses and the generation and education of children. Moreover, it is a grave scandal when there is corruption of the young.
2390 In a so-called free union, a man and a woman refuse to give juridical and public form to a liaison involving sexual intimacy.
The expression “free union” is fallacious: what can “union” mean when the partners make no commitment to one another, each exhibiting a lack of trust in the other, in himself, or in the future?
The expression covers a number of different situations: concubinage, rejection of marriage as such, or inability to make long-term commitments. All these situations offend against the dignity of marriage; they destroy the very idea of the family; they weaken the sense of fidelity. They are contrary to the moral law. The sexual act must take place exclusively within marriage. Outside of marriage it always constitutes a grave sin and excludes one from sacramental communion.
2391 Some today claim a “right to a trial marriage” where there is an intention of getting married later. However firm the purpose of those who engage in premature sexual relations may be, “the fact is that such liaisons can scarcely ensure mutual sincerity and fidelity in a relationship between a man and a woman, nor, especially, can they protect it from inconstancy of desires or whim.” Carnal union is morally legitimate only when a definitive community of life between a man and woman has been established. Human love does not tolerate “trial marriages.” It demands a total and definitive gift of persons to one another.
If the opportunity affords itself, it is always a good deed to educate a person regarding the teachings of the Church.
The spiritual works of mercy are:
To instruct the ignorant; To counsel the doubtful; To admonish sinners; To bear wrongs patiently; To forgive offenses willingly; To comfort the afflicted; To pray for the living and the dead.
Contrary to the expressed views of many members in other threads, I do not feel that anyone has the right to interfere or to criticise what consenting adults choose to do in their personal relationships.
God alone is our judge. He loves us and knows us absolutely.
We should look into our own hearts and try to follow Jesus in our own lives.
It is often very hard to see the good in others rather than to focus on aspects of their lives we may (presumptuously I feel) perceive to be wrong - but Jesus told us to “Love one another…” so we have to try!
God bless you
Your view is contrary to the Church and well, the entirety of human history. How do you justify it?
Response to Hoosier Daddy:
I respect your absolute right to have your opinion but feel that we must agree to differ on this issue.
God bless you.
Because sex is one of the gifts that flows from the Sacrament of Matrimony. Sex outside of marriage is an abuse of this gift. Some have explained it as a sin comparable to stealing. You are taking something that doesn’t yet belong to you.
As for counseling others, yes, if it’s a person you have responsibility for such as a child or a younger sibling. But virtually everyone knows that premarital sex is considered sinful, even if they don’t agree that it is. It is not your duty to nag someone about something they already know is wrong.
I asked you to elaborate on why you hold the position you do. How do you reconcile that to your faith? Do you care to explain?
I believe sex is a deep physical and emotional bonding between a man and a woman, where they become one. I believe when a man and woman come together without that emotional bond (marriage) they leave that encounter with bitterness, as they thought that they could separate the physical bond with the emotional one that makes them one.
Without marriage, I believe the woman leaves that encounter, doubting the mans love for her and vise versa, because in the back of their minds, they see that the other still wants an ‘exit door’
I believe without marriage, their emotions for one another are reserved and thus the bitterness of coming away with reserved emotions for on another after such physical intimacy.
I believe it also cheapens the marriage. I also believe that the less sacred ones sexuality becomes, the less intimate any marriage will be.
I believe sex should be a deep physical and emotional bonding experience, where the man and woman abandon themselves to one another in an ectasy of love without reserve and I believe without marriage, this can’t happen as it should. I also believe that those who engage in these activities also know this to be true, I believe it doesn’t take long before the ‘friends with benefits’ idea, fornication, promiscuity etc starts to backfire on them (deep internal wounds, especially from the feeling of being used instead of loved).
I have not done much reading on the subject though, these are just my thoughts on the subject articulated the best that I can.
I hope this has helped
Thank you for reading
Emily2014, the original poster asked specific questions. And I gave answers from the Church’s official teachings. As Catholics, that’s where we should start. I’m not behaving like a God or a judge.
Very well stated.
Response to Njlisa: I respect your knowledge of the Catechism and would never presume to imply that you were doing more than answering the question at the start of this thread.
God bless you.
Response to Hoosier Daddy: I was answering the final question in the initial thread and stated that it was my personal opinion.
God bless you.
I don’t believe it is right to start accusing sinners. The “take the log out of your own eye and than you can see how to take the speak out of your friends eye” passage comes to my mind.
I remember a homiliy from a priest once where he was talking about humility, he said that we should never consider ourselves above anyone else, as we don’t know the trials others have been through, we don’t know what road they have travelled, and as Dr Phil used to say on his show, I don’t ask myself why they are doing this, I ask myself why not? how could it be any different considering how they have been treated?
So I don’t believe it’s our duty to ‘tell them they are wrong’ but rather ‘show them something better, i.e. Christ’
I believe this is the best way to do it -
I believe Jesus doesn’t throw our sins in our face, nor reproach us for our crimes, this is how God corrects us and I believe that’s how we should correct our brothers and sisters.
I hope this has helped
Thank you for reading
when you have distrust and baggage and only learned to focus on the physical feelings and not the intimacy and trust and truly letting go you will not experience the true bliss which is a gift that can only happen with total trust and true love. you’re cheating yourself as well as not doing right by God.
Sex creates babies, and babies deserve a stable household with both a man and a woman to raise them. A counterpoint people tend to use is that divorce rates are so high, why bother?. Well I can tell you with 100% certainty that break up rates between non-married are far, far higher than divorce rates. Just a quick Google search I found the lowest estimate to be about 1 in 7 relationships results in marriage. That is a break-up rate of 86%. Last I read divorce rates are around 50%. Despite rising divorce rates, marriage is still likely to be more stable than cohabitation. Therefore, it is more ethical to wait until marriage for sex. It all comes down to selfishness. People want sex for pleasure and don’t care about their kids…or they use contraception, but that’s a whole nother problem.
How did you develop this personal opinion Emily?
Put it down to the acquired wisdom of old age!
I sincerely believe that it is wrong to seek to interfere, to discuss or to pass judgement upon any private relationships between consenting adults.
Only God knows and understands the secrets within a person’s heart.
God bless you.
If another person of similar advanced age held the contrary position, I guess it would not be possible for you to debate them!
I have enough difficulty in trying to follow the way of Christ in my own everyday life without ever wishing to imply that others are sinful or wrong. It is simply no business of mine. On the other hand, if anyone asked for advice or help I would do my best to answer as a fellow human being, not quoting the Catholic views with which I cannot concur.
Let God alone be our judge. He alone has that right and I trust in His love, which goes beyond our human understanding.
God bless you.