Today I watched a podcast made by a brazilian priest and he was talking about the legalization of marijuana. He pointed out that this shouldnt happen because the use of it causes loss of conscious, diminishing the human dignity. This made me think: alcohol also does this. So my question is: should alcohol be forbidden?
fabio rocha said : "Today I watched a podcast made by a brazilian priest, and he was talking about the legalization of marijuana.
He pointed out that this shouldn’t happen because the use of it causes loss of conscious, diminishing the human dignity.
This made me think: alcohol also does this.
So my question is: should alcohol be forbidden?"
Well, First, if all alcohol was Banned, the Catholic Church would have to “Modify” the Sacrament of Communion.
I imagine that we would have to count on Grape Juice, for God to turn into the Blood of Christ.
So, I think that an ALL-OUT Ban on Alcohol is unlikely (in the foreseeable Future).
Second, in the United States, around 1920, we changed our Constitution to Ban the production of alcohol.
It did NOT go very well.
It DID, however, create Organized Crime.
If people want to drink it, THEN they WILL be able to drink it.
If it costs MORE (because of Organized Crime charging a lot), well, that does NOT matter.
This is the SAME concept with Marijuana (and “Hard” Drugs, like Heroin and Cocaine).
There are a BUNCH of people who want to “Medicate” themselves with one of these Drugs.
They are ALREADY very Illegal … but people STILL smoke Pot.
I (personally) do not Drink or Smoke, but I understand that Life is difficult, and that one way to COPE with Stress is to “Take a Vacation” from Reality for a little while.
Everything in Moderation.
Most people who drink liquor can “Handle” it well.
And, most people are NOT Alcoholics.
Unfortunately, SOME people become “Addicted” to alcohol, and lead a less-Productive Life because of it.
So, an Alcohol Ban would be punishing the 80% of Social Drinkers, just to “MAKE SURE” that the other 20% don’t do something that will “hurt” them in the End.
I don’t know - it seems like smoking 1 joint of marijuana has more of an effect on the body than drinking a glass of wine.
Sunbreak said** : “I don’t know - it seems like smoking 1 joint of marijuana has more of an effect on the body than drinking a glass of wine.”**
Hmm, in that case, just have them Smoke Half-a-Joint.
What about a glass of tequila/vodka/whiskey? Or why not absinthe?
A glass of wine is basically the definition of minimum in the terms of alcohol. That would probably be a joint with a 75% tobacco 25% marijuana ratio
I was with you up until your concluding statements. Alcoholics not only harm themselves but also others, both strangers due to driving under the influence, for example, and family members who suffer living with an alcoholic, as well as society as a result of loss of economic productivity and increase in health expenditures. Yet I agree that a total ban would be detrimental for religious, as well as possible medicinal, reasons. The curtailment of the manufacture and sale of alcohol would be preferable, but that, as you pointed out, is not too practical and will no doubt not work.
You cannot consume marijuana in moderation.
You can consume alcohol in moderation.
“smoke half a joint”… actually, in previous debates on this subject, it has been said, that for some people, just one “hit” of a blunt will make them pass out. That is not moderation, therefore it is sin.
Will anyone pass out with a sip of wine or beer? No.
That is the Church’s position. Drugs cannot be consumed in moderation, and therefore they are sinful.
If we were going to forbid everything someone can possibly abuse, we’d end up with more to ban than just alcohol.
People huff all kinds of things. Glue, paint, gasoline, canned air for cleaning computers etc… We could ban all of those items because people misuse them.
Alcohol is like anything else. If someone wants to abuse something, they will.
Banning alcohol because some people are drunks is like banning cars because some people are poor drivers.
I’ll have to check up on your claims of the potency of marajuana. I have a feeling that the Church will define its stance on weed more in the future.
The analogy does not sound quite right to me. The purpose of cars, glue, paint, gasoline, computer cleaners, etc. is not harmful although they can all be abused. The purpose of alcohol in most cases is to ingest a drug that has the potential of doing harm by lowering one’s inhibitions due to altering brain chemistry both as a depressant and an excitatory agent, as well as encouraging dependency in those with a genetic predisposition. I think there is a significant difference.
Me? Im not for baning alcohol mate, I was just pointing out that you can’t compare a joint to a glass of wine when it comes to damage to the body. They are not at the same level of potency. A glass of tequila would be more fair.
“Joint” is a broad term, there are lots of variations. How packed it is, whats the tobacco vs marijuana ratio, how wide is the paper. I can’t believe that people can’t grasp this. Its perfectly logical.
A king size blunt with 100% marijuana that is packed tighter than a stuffed turkey could knock you out in one hit yes probably. But compare it with slaming a 6 cl shot of absinthe and not a sip of wine ffs. If you are going to compare a sip of wine then it would have to be compared with a hit from a slim size rizzla joint, losely packed with 75% tobacco. I doubt it will give you any more effect than that sip of wine. Other than perhaps a slight food craving…
Why do these things have to be explained? Its really not obvious to you? Moderation is not a hard concept… And neither are portions/doses…
It would seem as im advocating for legalization here, but im not, its not the topic at hand. Im just calling out these, frankly, dumb comparisons as they just do not belong in argument
RC Spjourner said** : “You cannot consume marijuana in moderation…
“smoke half a joint”… actually, in previous debates on this subject, it has been said, that
for some people, just one “hit” of a blunt will make them pass out.
That is not moderation, therefore it is sin.”**
Hmm, this gets back to the argument about Banning Cars, because some people are lousy Drivers.
Because, most Pot Smokers KNOW how much to Smoke, in order to alter their Perception to a specific Point, so that they can feel the “Best.”
So, Banning something because some people are “Light Weights” is Silly.
And, "Will anyone pass out with a sip of wine or beer? No."
This may be, but I know a person who gets SMASHED on ONE Beer.
Different people react differently to the Same thing.
So, let’s talk about Apples and Apples . . . NOT Apples and Oranges.
And,** “Drugs cannot be consumed in moderation, and therefore they are sinful.”**
This is NOT a sound argument.
Many people MUST take Powerful Pain-killers, like Morphine, to bear their Pain (like Cancer).
And, a lot of these people are WHACKED OUT, by being under the influence of those NECESSARY Drugs.
The Catholic Church has NOTHING against a person taking Prescriptions that leave these unfortunate people a virtual Vegetable.
Therefore, if a person ILLEGALLY BUYS SOME Morphine, to treat his Pain, then is HE Sinning?
And, there is Prescription Pot (named Marinol) … a little Pill with THC inside.
Doctors can FREELY prescribe it to their Patients, for a Variety of different illnesses.
And, turning to Medicinal Pot in general, many Cancer patients vomit violently after a round of Chemo.
The anti-vomit Drugs are swallowed (and then barfed up, before they can work).
That person takes 2 Puffs on a Joint, and MAGICALLY they Stop wretching.
This person consumes Pot in Moderation … and his LIfe is Better for the Experience.
So, then there are many people who have Psychological problems, and they Discover that Pot can Calm them down.
Or, any of several other “USES” for it.
I find the comparisons between marijuana and alcohol rather apt. I can not imagine a closer comparison. Alcohol was banned once. It legalized again, not because it became less dangerous, but because banning simply did not work. It was our first “War on Drugs.” I cannot imagine marijuana killing more people or destroying more families than alcohol. Yet still, drinking in and of itself is not sinful, prohibition was a failed proposition and we are stuck where we are.
As to which is worse, since I prefer to judge by the effect, I would say alcohol.
I think this is key. The Church is always re-defining its stance based on shifting factors, such as medical research, especially in the field of bioethics. Even if marijuana is deemed sinful, it is still a debatable question if the money and human suffering legalization would cost would be less or more than the suffering and monetary cost to its being illegal.
It is like banning food because some become Obese.
I find it very odd that nearly every state, city and county, aggressively go after illegal drug use, claiming it is to save people and protect the public, they say drug abuse causes problems for law enforcement, hospital ERs, the general public, etc. but if you look at the statistics, alcohol cause a whole lot of problems and results in death alot of time…all this, yet I have never heard of one person standing up and fighting to ban alcohol again…? But at the same time, they are more than ready to create new laws left and right to combat drugs, this makes no sense.
They know alcohol prohibition did not work, but they are trying the same exact thing with street drugs…why do they think this will work,when it was proven ineffective? Is not the very definition of insanity doing the exact same thing over and over but expecting different results?
I think the true reason no one fights for more laws on alcohol is due to the large companies that distribute beer, whiskey, etc. Govt makes alot of revenue from alcohol taxes,so it seems Govt really only cares about public safety if it suits their interests.
The sole purpose of drugs like marijuana is intoxication which is a sin, moderate use of alcohol does not result in intoxication.
ANY drug can be used in moderation…I know quite a few people who use Heroin in moderation, they get up, use a small amount, then go to work/school, and are fully able to maintain their days and lives with no problems. The key word is moderation.
No matter what the drug happens to be, someone can choose whether to abuse it or use in moderation, alcohol, Heroin, pot, etc. Why would this kind of usage be looked at differently, its the exact same thing…whats the difference in someone choosing to have one glass of wine with a nice dinner and the person who chooses to use a small amount of another drug that only comparably effects them (same as the person who has one glass of wine at dinner)
I think its very strange that in our world, they seem to worry about whether a substance CAN be abused, and they rush to create new laws to combat it, yet alcohol, tobacco…CAN be abused with lethal results and no one is rushing to enact prohibition again…?? Seems like there is a double standard.