Sing a New Church Into Being


#1

Has anybody been treated to this heterodox drivel? Our 20 something Music Direc....er, I mean Minister, has taken to using this thing as our opening "chant". Not only are the lyrics abysmal self agrandisement, the nun who wrote it has the temerity to co-opt the music from "Come Thou Fount of Every Blessing". Gad zooks1

How many people have to leave the Church before the light goes on for somebody in authority?


#2

I DEFINITELY wouldn't go so far as to leave the Catholic Church over it.

I would however locate the nearest parish in my diocese that offers the Latin Mass,
where I would never have to hear that hymn.

:thumbsup:


#3

If only we could teach people that WARM FUZZIES AND PRETTINESS DO NOT EQUAL HOLINESS! Ugh... my reasoning: heterodoxy = heresy = unholy = Satanic. That's right. I called something purty and happy "Satanic".


#4

Who then shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation? or distress? or famine? or nakedness? or danger? or persecution? or the sword?

Romans 8:35

No, but a music director or a guitar might.


#5

Ooh, that's one that makes me cringe too.

I treasure the OF mass and would probably be willing to drive to attend one in Latin but wouldn't want to attend the EF mass on a regular basis, although I was perfectly satisfied with it back in the old days and I respect those who make the choice to do so. Really bad/even heretical hymns in English aren't a reason to return to Latin. There are many excellent hymns in English; some are even fairly recent.

If this happened in my parish I'd probably take my specific objections to the new music director in the nicest possible way, with a selection of alternate hymns that aren't objectionable. (Perhaps she doesn't even realize there are better words to the same tune?) And to the pastor and/ or the liturgy committee. After that, if no improvement was made, I'd have to decide whether to stay or leave the parish. However, this matter is serious enough to try to make a difference I think. Leaving the church, of course, is not an option.


#6

There's nothing unCatholic is the words of that hymm. The phrase "one in faith and love and praise" is a better sentiment than thinking others fail to live up to another's standards, no?


#7

[quote="Stylites, post:4, topic:242054"]
No, but a music director or a guitar might.

[/quote]

Lol good one! :thumbsup:


#8

Fortunately, I have not had such a “blessing” of hearing that song in person, even back at my old guitar-oriented parish. At my current parish, the most frequently used hymns (besides the responsorial psalms) are from the pre 1960s.

This I find moderately interesting. Such a statement can be attached to any ideological cause within the “politics” of the Church, and I have seen this used on both sides of the aisle in some form or another.

I do not disagree with you, however. Songs that are about the self rather than the Christ are not spiritually nourishing. Songs alone, however, do not the Mass make. You can have Attende Domine in Latin, but if the Mass is celebrated by, say, a clown, the Mass is not reverent.


#9

[quote="Stylites, post:6, topic:242054"]
There's nothing unCatholic is the words of that hymm. The phrase "one in faith and love and praise" is a better sentiment than thinking others fail to live up to another's standards, no?

[/quote]

Except that the entire hymn fixates on some idea of how we as individuals in our warm wuv of liberal egalitarian multiculturalism create some faithful, loving, and praising atmosphere that the old Church lacked. Oh, and the ecclesiology is shot too because of its egalitarianism. It's anti-clerical and anthropocentric. It doesn't have a thing to do with worship, it's all about comforting and encouraging the parishioners - it's as horizontal as planting your face in the dirt. Which means that it's utterly out of place in the Prayer of the Mass - prayer, not self-edification through some form of borderline psychotherapeutic validation. There's a place for true kindness, unity, and love around the broken body and shed blood of our sacrificed savior. And not through egalitarianism.

I'm listening to it right now and silently screaming "They're basically toeing the line of nature worship! There's more in the song about how awesome humans are than JESUS!"

If this is how we use the Mass to catechize people... their minds are going to turn to jelly.


#10

[quote="JRRTFAN, post:1, topic:242054"]
Has anybody been treated to this heterodox drivel? Our 20 something Music Direc....er, I mean Minister, has taken to using this thing as our opening "chant". Not only are the lyrics abysmal self agrandisement, the nun who wrote it has the temerity to co-opt the music from "Come Thou Fount of Every Blessing". Gad zooks1

How many people have to leave the Church before the light goes on for somebody in authority?

[/quote]

After re-reading this thread I'm wondering about your last question. I thought you meant people leaving in protest of bad hymns. But looking at it from the point of view that the liturgy catechizes us, poor catechesis can cause people to lose sight of the truth and leave because they don't have a true idea of what the church really teaches.


#11

[quote="JRRTFAN, post:1, topic:242054"]
Has anybody been treated to this heterodox drivel? Our 20 something Music Direc....er, I mean Minister, has taken to using this thing as our opening "chant". Not only are the lyrics abysmal self agrandisement, the nun who wrote it has the temerity to co-opt the music from "Come Thou Fount of Every Blessing". Gad zooks1

How many people have to leave the Church before the light goes on for somebody in authority?

[/quote]

I don't know if I know the song you are talking about. Do you have a link to the lyrics?

A couple of points about hymns and church music in general. Just because we don't like the music style, doesn't mean it is heterodox. Also, musicians and poets for centuries have used existing music to set new lyrics, borrowing from music of all genres.

In this particular instance, have you spoken to the music director/minister? Politely? Have you asked about using other hymns for the opening? Are you a member of the choir or music group? If you have asked, have you then talked to your pastor? Again politely and with options and an offering of help?

In the church, just like almost everywhere else that people come together, it is better to have a solution that you are willing to implement quietly, than to complain and sulk.


#12

Here is the lyrics

puckermom.wordpress.com/2008/07/11/lyrics-to-sing-a-new-church-if-youre-interested/

As for the New Church is heard many times: I am a new man, and never saw anything wrong with that. Every repentance is renewal too, and everybody need repentance.

As for the

Draw together at one table, / all the human family;

this was Christ dream, and we can dream with Him.

What is wrong?


#13

[quote="Claire_from_DE, post:5, topic:242054"]

Really bad/even heretical hymns in English aren't a reason to return to Latin. There are many excellent hymns in English; some are even fairly recent.

[/quote]

1) For me, since I love Latin, everything's a reason to attend the Latin Mass. :p
That said, more often than not I've been attending my English-speaking parish instead of my Latin-speaking one. The English-speaking one is (okay, I'll admit it) more convenient and highly reverent, so yes, I'm happy there.

2) In fact, I enjoy listening to many modern praise and worship songs on Christian radio.

3) You've definitely come up with some good alternatives, Claire from DE, for how to handle a touchy hymn situation in the case of those who vastly prefer hearing the Mass in English.

:blessyou:


#14

[quote="Mrs_Sally, post:11, topic:242054"]
I don't know if I know the song you are talking about. Do you have a link to the lyrics?

A couple of points about hymns and church music in general. Just because we don't like the music style, doesn't mean it is heterodox. Also, musicians and poets for centuries have used existing music to set new lyrics, borrowing from music of all genres.

In this particular instance, have you spoken to the music director/minister? Politely? Have you asked about using other hymns for the opening? Are you a member of the choir or music group? If you have asked, have you then talked to your pastor? Again politely and with options and an offering of help?

In the church, just like almost everywhere else that people come together, it is better to have a solution that you are willing to implement quietly, than to complain and sulk.

[/quote]

Lyrics and song. Pretty lame :rolleyes:
youtube.com/watch?v=ETV1DXQk_Gk


#15

[quote="ZDHayden, post:8, topic:242054"]

Songs that are about the self rather than the Christ are not spiritually nourishing. Songs alone, however, do not the Mass make. You can have Attende Domine in Latin, but if the Mass is celebrated by, say, a clown, the Mass is not reverent.

[/quote]

Wow. They sure don't have a clown celebrate Mass in the parish where I attend the Mass in Latin !!!!! :eek:

Now at my English-language parish, the pastor once gave a memorable sermon in which he impersonated the Wicked Witch of the West, complete with voice inflections, gestures, and body language. I actually found it meaningful and was not offended. (It was one of those things where you just had to be there, and I think perhaps there were some parishioners who found it more controversial than I did.) In fact, I have great respect for the pastor and like I said in my previous post, am very happy with this parish.

:blessyou:


#16

[quote="the_phoenix, post:15, topic:242054"]

Now at my English-language parish, the pastor once gave a memorable sermon in which he impersonated the Wicked Witch of the West, complete with voice inflections, gestures, and body language. I actually found it meaningful and was not offended. (It was one of those things where you just had to be there, and I think perhaps there were some parishioners who found it more controversial than I did.) In fact, I have great respect for the pastor and like I said in my previous post, am very happy with this parish.

:blessyou:

[/quote]

I struggled with leaving my old parish because the priest there was very good. Every chance he'd get, he'd give a Baptist-styled hellfire sermon that would fill the confession line for, if I am not mistaken, the entire week. He had other quirky homily styles, and was all around excellent. It was his first position as a pastor. The parish itself, however, was no longer feeding me and another parish (my new one) brought me to my knees. My Knights of Columbus chapter is based at my old parish, so I still will probably help there.

archangel04 said: Lyrics and song. Pretty lame
youtube.com/watch?v=ETV1DXQk_Gk

I second that! Immediately afterwards I had to clean out my ears with "O Filii et Filiae."
My parish sung it the second week of Easter this year, and I fell in love with it.


#17

[quote="ZDHayden, post:8, topic:242054"]
Fortunately, I have not had such a "blessing" of hearing that song in person, even back at my old guitar-oriented parish. At my current parish, the most frequently used hymns (besides the responsorial psalms) are from the pre 1960s.

This I find moderately interesting. Such a statement can be attached to any ideological cause within the "politics" of the Church, and I have seen this used on both sides of the aisle in some form or another.

I do not disagree with you, however. Songs that are about the self rather than the Christ are not spiritually nourishing. Songs alone, however, do not the Mass make. You can have Attende Domine in Latin, but if the Mass is celebrated by, say, a clown, the Mass is not reverent.

[/quote]

Speaking of which, we typically use the Marty Haugen Pslamette in lieu of the cononically approved Psalm. The Vatican would not allow the Revised Psalms of the NAB to be used in liturgy so we have the Grail Psalms in the Missal. Does Marty take precedence over the approved Missal, and the NAB?

As respects politics, I have none other than knowing why I come to Mass and it is not to sing about what a joy I am and how radiant I appear to the God who needs me desperately.


#18

[quote="JRRTFAN, post:17, topic:242054"]
Speaking of which, we typically use the Marty Haugen Pslamette in lieu of the cononically approved Psalm. The Vatican would not allow the Revised Psalms of the NAB to be used in liturgy so we have the Grail Psalms in the Missal. Does Marty take precedence over the approved Missal, and the NAB?

[/quote]

No, he does not. Replacing the psalm with a psalm-based-song is not ok.


#19

The TLM was awesome today.

I thank God I have options in beautiful NY.


#20

[quote="Claire_from_DE, post:10, topic:242054"]
After re-reading this thread I'm wondering about your last question. I thought you meant people leaving in protest of bad hymns. But looking at it from the point of view that the liturgy catechizes us, poor catechesis can cause people to lose sight of the truth and leave because they don't have a true idea of what the church really teaches.

[/quote]

If people left for bad hymns, there wouldn't be anybody left. What I mean is the swarm of people who's catechesis is non-existant but who know they go to Church to worship God and are smart enough to know that any song written by a greying nun is going to be hogwash 98% of the time. Why do you think people go to Evangelical Churches? Because they worship God. You'd never hear pap like this in an Evangelical service, they hay have heretical teachings in the sola(s) but they don't sing about themselves.


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