Stealing?


#1

I purchased a child’s bus ticket for multiple uses when I was a child, but now having surpassed the age of a child is it alright for me to use the ticket up? In one way it could be stealing, because I’m traveling on a child’s ticket when I’m actually an adult. But on the other hand it would be a waste of money not to use it up. I’m pretty sure its fine to use it up, but I just wanted to make sure.

Hope that makes sense, thanks.


#2

If you're an adult, pay the adult fare.

You know it's wrong, because adults can not travel on a child's ticket.

Give the ticket to a sibling who can legally use it, or donate it to somebody with a child.

Sarah x :)


#3

If you honestly bought the ticket, then you should use it. You aren't cheating anyone.


#4

They are cheating.

There are conditions and restrictions attached to using a child’s ticket.

You have to be a child :rolleyes:

Sarah x :slight_smile:


#5

I agree, unless the company itself doesn’t care. I’d suggest either assuming you can’t use it, or calling and asking and doing what they say.


#6

If you have a child's ticket and you do not meet the requirement for that ticket and still use it, yes, you are stealing. On the other hand, you could call the issuing company and ask their policy in this case, generally these tickets have an expiration time on them and it may be within their policy for someone to buy it as a child but age past that requirement during the life of the ticket and have it still allowed. Or, perhaps they would credit you what you have already paid and adjust with an additional charge to an adult ticket making you perfectly legal.


#7

[quote="atheistgirl, post:4, topic:322955"]
They are cheating.

There are conditions and restrictions attached to using a child's ticket.

You have to be a child :rolleyes:

Sarah x :)

[/quote]

Then the poster should be given back their money, huh?

It would be "cheating" if the poster did something unethical to get the ticket in the first place or intended to "cheat" the system. If the poster honestly bought and paid for the ticket then there is nothing wrong with using it.


#8

The poster states that she bought the ticket properly. What exactly is she stealing if she uses it?


#9

[quote="FAH, post:1, topic:322955"]
I purchased a child's bus ticket for multiple uses when I was a child, but now having surpassed the age of a child is it alright for me to use the ticket up? In one way it could be stealing, because I'm traveling on a child's ticket when I'm actually an adult. But on the other hand it would be a waste of money not to use it up. I'm pretty sure its fine to use it up, but I just wanted to make sure.

Hope that makes sense, thanks.

[/quote]

You will probably want to run this by your confessor. As always with these types of threads, you're going to get different opinions.

One way to settle the doubt is to call the ticket seller and ask them if you can do that.


#10

Using a child ticket when you’re not a child is cheating the system and unethical.

It’s irrelevant when the ticket was bought.

If you’re not a child, you can’t travel on a child’s ticket.

Sarah x :slight_smile:


#11

Sarah's right, consider an alternative scenario.

You are given a keg of beer by your friend and promise to drink it all by Christmas. However, you are caught drink driving and part of your penalty is that you cannot imbibe in any alcohol for 12 months. As such, you won't be able to fulfill your promise to finish the keg of beer. Which obligation do you follow? Clearly, the legal one, since you are responsible as a citizen for obeying a just law. The promise, though well intended, can no longer reasonably be fulfilled.

I think that's the case with the tickets here. You are now legally an adult and cannot use them anymore. As Sarah said, why not just give them to a young friend, or perhaps even try to get a refund?


#12

I agree with atheistgirl.

The fee which was paid was for a childs journey, but the traveller is not a child and it is therefore dishonest to use the ticket.

Maybe the answer is to see if a refund can be obtained for the unused child journeys - if so, this could then be put toward the cost of an adult ticket. Or maybe the OP could pay extra, to "top up" their ticket to the right value.

I would always advise against using public transport with either no ticket or the wrong ticket - as there can be quite severe penalties if caught (fines etc).

I was on a train to Berlin airport once, heading home after a holiday, and we bought the cheap tickets (about 2 Euro) from a machine at the station where we got on. As we got near the airport, three large, casually dressed men suddenly revealed themselves as ticket inspectors and asked to inspect tickets.

2 guys sitting near us (French I think) had no tickets. Its only a short journey and they obviously thought they could chance it. They were given a fine of 40 Euros (20 times the ticket cost), had details of their passport and identity noted, and told that this information would continually show up during passport inspection at German airports etc, until they had paid the fine.


#13

Guys....girls...this is so simple and clear. I agree with all who said call the company and discuss it with them. I'd do this regardless of the fine print which may be there to avoid intentional abuse of the "system". They may be very accomodating one on one. Another option that they may offer is to simply pay the difference.

That said, AethiestGirl is correct, it would be dishonest and sinful to intentionally go against their policy & without their permission to use a ticket that was purchased previously as an childs ticket as an adult.

Pork


#14

[quote="atheistgirl, post:10, topic:322955"]
Using a child ticket when you're not a child is cheating the system and unethical.

It's irrelevant when the ticket was bought.

If you're not a child, you can't travel on a child's ticket.

Sarah x :)

[/quote]

+1 I also agree that you should call the company and ask them. They may choose to make an exception or make an exchange or something of that nature. It's best to speak with them and do as they say, because you would be practising the virtues of honesty, stewardship and obedience.

:blessyou:


#15

I'd just call and ask.

Most times I've had a situation like that, they've said to go ahead.


#16

The ticket was bought fair and square, so the system was not cheated.

Using a ticket that one has bought fair and square is certainly not unethical. In the future, the poster will have to pay the adult price. That makes everything even.


#17

[quote="jonathan_hili, post:11, topic:322955"]
Sarah's right, consider an alternative scenario.

You are given a keg of beer by your friend and promise to drink it all by Christmas. However, you are caught drink driving and part of your penalty is that you cannot imbibe in any alcohol for 12 months. As such, you won't be able to fulfill your promise to finish the keg of beer. Which obligation do you follow? Clearly, the legal one, since you are responsible as a citizen for obeying a just law. The promise, though well intended, can no longer reasonably be fulfilled.

I think that's the case with the tickets here. You are now legally an adult and cannot use them anymore. As Sarah said, why not just give them to a young friend, or perhaps even try to get a refund?

[/quote]

What a ridiculous scenario. Buying a train ticket is a morally neutral act, unlike driving drunk. Unless the poster misrepresented themselves to get a cheaper price for the ticket, there is no moral dimension to the act.


#18

[quote="Timothysis, post:17, topic:322955"]
What a ridiculous scenario. Buying a train ticket is a morally neutral act, unlike driving drunk. Unless the poster misrepresented themselves to get a cheaper price for the ticket, there is no moral dimension to the act.

[/quote]

It is not ridiculous to care about one's spiritual life and obey the Ten Commandments. I recall that Jesus said that "whoever loves Me keeps My Commandments."

As for this situation, there IS a moral dimension. Although this person didn't misrepresent himself to purchase the ticket, he is now an adult and WOULD be misrepresenting himself every time he used it, so indeed it does matter. I recall that Jesus said "he who is faithful in small matters will be faithful in large matters", and "amen, amen, I say to you, you will not be released until you have paid the last penny."


#19

[quote="Jennifoo, post:18, topic:322955"]
It is not ridiculous to care about one's spiritual life and obey the Ten Commandments. I recall that Jesus said that "whoever loves Me keeps My Commandments."

[/quote]

What commandment would the poster be violating if they used a ticket that they honestly and fairly purchased?

[quote="Jennifoo, post:18, topic:322955"]
As for this situation, there IS a moral dimension. Although this person didn't misrepresent himself to purchase the ticket, he is now an adult and WOULD be misrepresenting himself every time he used it, so indeed it does matter.

[/quote]

The poster isn't misrepresenting themselves at all; they are simply using a ticket that they purchased fair and square. The fact that they are now older than when they purchased it is inconsequential. They bought it, it is theirs.

[quote="Jennifoo, post:18, topic:322955"]
I recall that Jesus said "he who is faithful in small matters will be faithful in large matters", and "amen, amen, I say to you, you will not be released until you have paid the last penny."

[/quote]

This is a constant issue that I see here at CAF, the armchair theologian. According to your line of reasoning, no one can be faithful in large matters because we are all guilty of some lesser sin.


#20

[quote="Timothysis, post:19, topic:322955"]
What commandment would the poster be violating if they used a ticket that they honestly and fairly purchased?

[/quote]

That would be the commandment against stealing. By travelling on a child's fare when they are an adult and should be paying an adult fare, they are in effect stealing the difference in price between an adult ticket and a child's ticket. Like having a ticket that enables one to travel to a certain point and then deliberately travelling further than one is entitled - one would be stealing the difference between the fare for the actual distance travelled and the (lesser) fare for the (shorter) distance they are allowed to travel on that ticket.

The poster isn't misrepresenting themselves at all; they are simply using a ticket that they purchased fair and square. The fact that they are now older than when they purchased it is inconsequential. They bought it, it is theirs.

They purchased it on condition that it is still the appropriate and correct ticket every time it is used. If someone gets a cheaper travel fare because they are unemployed or a student then clearly that concession is only meant for such time as they are a student or unemployed. If they get a job or finish their studies before that concession card expires then it is no longer appropriate to use it, and in fact they may be prosecuted for fraud if they do. Because it is misrepresentation - in fact one is indicating by their use of the ticket that they are still a child, a student or unemployed when such is no longer the case.

This is a constant issue that I see here at CAF, the armchair theologian. According to your line of reasoning, no one can be faithful in large matters because we are all guilty of some lesser sin.

The solution is to make more of an effort to be faithful in the smaller things, then the big things will be easier for us. Someone who is honest about their bus fares will find it easier to be honest with their taxes, their clients' money and so on.


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