Tableeghi Jamaat: No Gunpoint Sharia

ISLAMABAD: In an unprecedented move, top leaders of the Tableeghi Jamaat have denounced enforcement of Sharia at gunpoint, religious extremism, militancy and terrorism.–bi-12

Is the Taliban going to pay any attention to that?

Can you tell us why the Taliban and such groups so badly misunderstand Islam, and what imams and Muslim groups are doing to instruct these members in the true form of your religion?

And why the Talibanistas are so brave they cover their faces?

And can you tell us how sharia got implemented in Swat?

The 90-year-old scholar, who left his job as sessions judge in pre-partition India and joined the Jamaat, cited the example of Prophet Mohammad (PBUH), said the Holy Prophet never used force. Instead he spread the word of God only by peaceful means.

And the Statue of Liberty is located in Lake Ontario.

I doubt it, because I think the Taliban isn’t much interested in establishing Islam as they are as establishing their power. True Islam gets in the way, so they ignore it. The reason I posted it isn’t to tell the Taliban anything, but to tell the people here who inevitably ask such questions like, “How come Muslim leaders don’t denounce the Taliban’s enforcement of religion, if 2:256 is true?”

Can you tell us why the Taliban and such groups so badly misunderstand Islam, and what imams and Muslim groups are doing to instruct these members in the true form of your religion?

I don’t really know why anybody badly misunderstands their own religion, although I will tell you that I think the Taliban is interested power, obtaining it and keeping it by any means necessary. As to what Muslim groups are trying to do to help, I know of a few organizations trying to increase awareness about what is going on and to help actual Afghans and Pakistanis. And I just posted an article about how the Tableeghi Jamaat (which is a very anti-political organization!) has made a statement against what the Taliban are doing.

And why the Talibanistas are so brave they cover their faces?


And can you tell us how sharia got implemented in Swat?

The Pakistani government didn’t do a very good job of implementing any sort of law there in the first place, making it ripe for a Taliban insurgency. Government of Pakistan just sort of gave up and let them implement Sharia.

And the Statue of Liberty is located in Lake Ontario.

Muhammad did not force people to follow Islam.

The blanket claim that Muhammad did not force people to follow Islam by Muslims always amazes me. It is always the nail in any other claim they have of ‘being informed and logical’, or having any view based on facts, history or reality.

But they must believe in a “Jesus like” Muhammad or they would just be unable to continue on…

It is one of the biggest signs of self deception out there in the Muslim world.

You will not find any other historical expert make that same statement. Only a Muslim one because he must deny the truth or it ‘insults’ his prophet.

This is a WONDERFUL thing. Now, hopefully, others will follow their lead and denounce violence in the name of Islam. Perhaps this is the much needed first step.

Also, I hope no one kills these guys for saying that.

Muslims do that all the time, Ralph, denouncing violence in the name of Islam.

I would say Muslims all the time deny the violence IN Islam and those you claim are a ‘small minority’ (even ten percent of 1.8 billion is not a small group!) find plenty of reason to ignore the even smaller groups that say they are wrong because they find strength in Islamic history and Muhammad’s history of battles for Islam.

Self defense is defined as the right to destroy anyone and anything that offends Muslim sensibilities, or disagrees with Islam. The disbeliever is an offense that one has the right to view as an enemy, one who ‘fights’ you and so Muslims are justified to destroy them.

This something that is codified in your religion, so small groups saying Islam is peace, wont matter when they have no power to change the actual actions or words of its own prophet that are so easily and readily used to support actions of violence against non-believers in the world. Non-believers and not innocent, they are enemies of God, period. Holy war in Islam must prevail. They are far more active who believe this, to the tune of close to 18 million people, and ACT on this, than those who stand up and oppose their ‘Muslim brethren’.

Make-believe statistics don’t mean a thing.

Yes, but this is a high profile religious and political person in a nation that is uner threat of a hostile take over by a militant group of people who think that if you disagree with them, you should die.

it is a brave and bold act.

“Taliban are our brothers. We are Muslims (thanks be to Allah) and they are also Muslims. It’s there aim and ours to bring Islamic law”

“This will not be restricted to Malakand only. May Allah give us the strength and the power to spread this message and extend this movement to the whole of humanity.”

“As long as these infidels (western white women) are in our lands we have the duty to fight them”.

Sister Amy is all safe and sound in peaceful America but these people are not listening to her at all and wouldn’t even if she lived there as a white American Muslim revert.

You might want to go read the first post in this thread to figure out what we’re actually talking about, since it seems that you might not be sure.

‘**We should reach out to all human beings and guide them out of darkness. **Before the advent of Islam, people were so inflexible that they used to bury their daughters without remorse. (But they changed.) Remember …human beings are above other creations of God,’ said Maulana Ahmed, the custodian of the largest seminary of the Tableeghi school of thought in Raiwind near Lahore.

**The main message of the gathering was that Islam could not be confined to Pakistan or any other geographical area and there was a need to spread the religion of peace in every corner of the world. **

People from across the country who had converged there pledged that they would continue the mission of spreading Islam across the world.

This message went from “no gunpoint sharia” to “spread islam all over the world” and to guide “**all **human beings out of the darkness”.

Muhammad did not force people to follow Islam.<<


 Abdullah b. 'Umar reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: You and the Jews would fight against one another until a stone would say: Muslim, here is a Jew behind me; come and kill him.  ""

Are you saying that this is NOT an authentic saying of Mohammed?

Plenty of Imams and other Muslim leaders have quoted it.

Exactly, so why do Muslims use them so much? Why do the have so much need to deny the ten percent figure that is found over and over again by many different studies, and then the need to puff up and elevate numbers of ‘reversions’ or their population in the world? Funny how that works…

Provide some sources and stats that deny these:

It’s time we open our eyes and confront reality. Ever since the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, the media has sought to reassure us that only a tiny minority of Muslims actually support the use of violence against Israel and the West.

It’s just a small fringe, a marginal few at best, they tell us, so don’t worry about it all too much. One percent or three percent - who cares? Just sit back, enjoy your morning eggs and coffee and have a nice day.

But a look at the numbers tells a very different story. The extent of support for global jihad is frightening in its proportions, and the numbers are anything but insignificant.

Consider, for example, the following statistics regarding support for suicide bombings and other types of terror attacks.

In a poll conducted five months ago, and broadcast on Britain’s Channel 4 TV, nearly 25% of British Muslims said the July 7, 2005, terror bombings in London, which killed 52 innocent commuters, were justified. Another 30% said they would prefer to live under strict Islamic Sharia law rather than England’s democratic system.

Now, one in four justifying terror may not be a majority, but it certainly isn’t a “small fringe” either.

In other countries, the figures are no less unsettling. A survey published in December found that 44% of Nigerian Muslims believe suicide bombing attacks are “often” or “sometimes” acceptable. Only 28% said they were never justified.

According to the annual Pew Global Attitudes Survey, released in July 2006, “roughly one-in-seven Muslims in France, Spain and Great Britain feel that suicide bombings against civilian targets can at least sometimes be justified to defend Islam.” The report also found that less than half of Jordan’s Muslims believe terror attacks are never justified. In Egypt, only 45% of Muslims say terror is never justified.

STILL THINK only a “tiny minority” are in favor of violence? In Israel, the percentages are even more alarming. After Cpl. Gilad Shalit was abducted by Hamas terrorists last summer, a poll conducted by the Jerusalem Media and Communications Center revealed that 77.2% of Palestinians supported the kidnapping, while 66.8% said they would back additional such attacks.

More than six out of 10 Palestinians also said they were in favor of firing Kassam rockets at Israeli towns and cities.

And lest you think that war fever lay behind the results, consider this: four additional polls published in September, nearly a month after the Lebanese conflict had ended, all found large majorities of Palestinians backing terror attacks against the Jewish state.

Indeed, in various countries around the world, support for Muslim fundamentalist terror groups appears to be widespread.

On the fifth anniversary of the September 11 attacks, a survey conducted by Al-Jazeera asked respondents, “Do you support Osama Bin-Laden?” A whopping 49.9% answered: yes.

And the July 2006 global Pew survey (found here: found that among Muslims, a quarter of Jordanians, a third of Indonesians, 38% of Pakistanis and 61% of Nigerians all expressed confidence in the mass murderer who founded al-Qaida.

In Lebanon six months ago, the Beirut Center for Research and Information found that over 80% of the Lebanese population said they supported Hizbullah.

And do I need also to mention that a majority of Palestinians backed Hamas in parliamentary elections last year? Sure, there are also places where support for violent jihad is not as high. As Reuters reported on October 15, just **10 percent of Indonesian Muslims said they backed jihad and supported bomb attacks on the island of Bali aimed at foreign tourists.

But Indonesia is home to more than 200 million Muslims, so while 10 percent may sound like a small number percentage-wise, it is actually quite large in absolute terms. It means there are some 20 million Muslims in Indonesia alone who are willing to say out loud that they support the use of violence and terror against innocent human beings.**

Since when is that a “marginal few”? The question of whether a “tiny” or “sizable” minority backs the global jihad is far more than just one of semantics. It goes to the very nature of the struggle that Israel and the West now find ourselves in.

The figures above, taken from a variety of nations, continents and contexts, all point in one very ominous direction. They demonstrate beyond a shadow of a doubt that the global jihadist movement enjoys a wide and broad base of support that extends far beyond just a minuscule number of supporters.

POLITICIANS and journalists might wish to believe, as we all do, that the backers of violent jihad are few and far between, and that they do not represent large numbers of people with like-minded extremist views. But that is simply not the case.

The arithmetic of jihad is quite straight-forward, and it is time we stopped looking the other way and pretending otherwise.

The threat posed by Islamic fundamentalism to Israel and the West can, and must, be met. With determination and a sense of purpose, victory is not out of reach.

But the longer we continue to underestimate the extent of the problem, the more difficult it will be to defeat it.

So let’s put aside all that wishful thinking, and roll up our collective sleeves and get to work. Like it or not, the war on terror still faces a long road ahead.

You might want to view the video I posted which was reported on the current military action going on in this region (leading to Islamabad), and has interviews which I quoted as to the mindset of those in the villages along the way who support what this one brave person has denounced.

I am sure, are you?

And why the Talibanistas are so brave they cover their faces?

You will notice, class, that Sister Amy did not actually answer my question, but only deflected.

Spreading Islam by teaching it. Preaching it. Living it.

Not forcing it.

Of course it is an authentic hadith. Definitely. And it does NOT say that anyone is being forced to follow Islam.

I suppose so. I thought it was a rhetorical question, not one you actually wanted answered. I don’t know why the Taliban cover their faces. Nor do I know why you chose to call them “Talibanistas.” I answered yours, now maybe you can answer mine.

Well, I will never be a Muslim AND I would refuse to pay Jizya, so how is that going to work out for me if Islam covers this world? And if I want to build a Christian church how will that work out for me? And if I want to do what my religion has commanded me to do, preach the Gospel, how will that turn out for me, when Sharia, which IS Islam’s laws, rule the land?

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