Televangelists and Jewish traditions


#1

I admit. I’ve watched many televangelists in order to figure them out, but I do not understand some things like how there’s this surge of interest into Jewish holidays and practices. Like…

During Passover time, Steve Munsey appeared on INSP and asked viewers to make a “Passover offering” i.e. money and receive the seven passover blessings and a metzuah (that thing that goes on your door…sorry I can’t spell it).

Pastor Larry Huch told his congregation that Jesus wore a Jewish prayer shawl and when the woman with the issue of blood touched the hem she was healed. He encouraged others to buy their very own prayer shawl and experience healings as well. I saw him wear a yamica (a Jewish skullcap) and hand out communion. He also announced that his congregation celebrates Shabat, Yom Kippor and Rosh Hanhanna and has experienced miracles because of it.

Pastor John Haggee advertised the Feast of Tabernacles to celebrated at his megachurch.

Bible Prophecy evangelist Perry Stone frequently presents Jewish traditions, structures and feast days in light of Bible prophecy and applies them to Christianity today. This week on INSP, he was showing David Currello the ancient temple.

In light of these examples, I have some questions:

  1. As a Jew, how do you feel about televangelists rediscovering and sometimes practicing your traditions?

  2. As a Christians, how do you feel about fellow Christians practicing our elder brothers’ traditions?

  3. Why do you think this is so popular? Is this a cry for liturgy? (I do not get it!!!)

This thread is not meant to sow hatred between Jews and Christians. Please keep your responses charitable!


#2

bump


#3

As a Jew, I am a little offended by the examples you gave, as they seem to be used as a shill to part people from their money.


#4

It reveals that the Protestants can’t admit they can’t go it without Tradition, but they can’t go back to Catholic Tradition, so they make use of the Jewish ones, in the name of the “restoration” of primitive Christianity.

It makes me wonder about Protestants who emphasize the land where Jesus walked, while DEemphasizing the woman in whom He was pleased to dwell.


#5

I agree with everything you said, however I have one quibble. Protestants do not fight over actuall historical sites in Israel and the Palestinian territories. But many Catholics and Orthodox in the Holy Land or who care about it seem to think there is some right of the Church to the Holy Land. So Orthodox and Catholics get pretty focused on sacred real estate too. I think all there group have very shaky ground for such beliefs.

Mel


#6

Not saying that we (Orthodox and Catholic) don’t-to the point of scandal (and that’s an understatement). But the Orthodox Catholic Tradition has a sense of Tradition, etc. pilgrimage, Apostolic succession etc… So their attatchment to the sites is consistent with their beliefs, althought their conduct may not be.:frowning:

The Protestants have not sense of history and deny a historic living chain to the early Church, but instead seem they can dig it up in the Holy Land at some archeological site. Their involvement with the Temple Mount Museum and the digs going on to dig up the Red Heifer borders on the bizare.


#7

Good points. That is the best explanation I have heard, lamentable but understandable given how much history is involved here.

Thanks,

Mel


#8

I think there is one important fact that catholics do not accept , but some protestants accept .
Some protestants feel that christianity is not a separate religion , but instead feel " christianity " is the final revelation of Judaism .
here is a link to a web site of Zola Levitt ministries , Zola was a Jewish convert to christianity , his doctrine is similar to Perry Stone this site has good info on doctrine on this branch of Judaism/christianity

levitt.com/faqs.html


#9

You have it backwards. It is Catholics who believe that Christianity is the fulfillment of OT Judaism (the Church being the fulfillment of Israel). It is the sects mentioned in the OP that treat them as two separate and valid religions.


#10

Strictly speaking, Judaism as we presently know it (i.e. Rabbinical Judaism) and Christianity are two different derivatives of the Jewish religion of the Second Temple Period. Rabbinical Judaism constituted itself around the synagogue in the absence of the Temple (destroyed by the Romans in 70 AD), while Christianity continued in a sense the Temple religion (Christians would say “fulfilled”), making priesthood, sacrifice, and temple things that could function anywhere, not just in Jerusalem.

It is true that Protestants do not dispute possession of the Christian Holy Places as do Catholics, Orthodox, and other Eastern Churches – but that may be only because none of the latter would let them in on the squabble. What Protestants have done is ignore tradition and come up with their own Holy Places.

What is sad is that many fundamentalist Protestants seem to care more about the fate of the Israeli state than they do about the welfare of actual Israeli Jews, not to mention that of Palestinians, Muslim or Christian.


#11

Exactly. The Catholics didn’t stop worshipping in the synagogues on Saturdays of their own accord. They were kicked out by the majority of Jews who chose not to follow Christ.


#12

<<It reveals that the Protestants can’t admit they can’t go it without Tradition, but they can’t go back to Catholic Tradition, so they make use of the Jewish ones, in the name of the “restoration” of primitive Christianity.>>

Well put, Isa! :slight_smile:

I’m reminded of so-called “Messianic Congregations”. All they seem to be is pop-evangelicals with an overlay of post-Christian Rabbinism (usually Reform) and a big dollop of Hollywood’s Biblical epics.


#13

As Genesis already said, you have it backwards. It is Catholicism that teaches that it is the final revelation of Judaism. Besides, if the protestants really believed that they were an extension of Judaism, they would continue with Jewish practices, such as praying for the dead and belief in a post-mortem purification process.


#14

Thank you for your answers. I appreciate them. I have some follow up questions for ya:

  1. Do you think these activities hinder or promote relations between Jews and Christians?

  2. Do you think this could be common ground for evangelization? (Ex: f they like ECFs, then why not read more of what they said about the Eucharist, etc. instead the kneejerk reaction of labeling us as pagans or idol worshippers?)

Here’s my two cents. You are welcome to comment:

  1. Most dispensationalists preachers like John Hagee fully support Israel through political activism yet at the same time preach about the coming Tribulations (that will not include the church–including him–because he is raptured beforehand) in which the unbelievers will be punished with the wrath of God through bloodshed, boils, locusts, etc. because they rejected God’s Son and His offer of salvation. So in this case in point, it seems like a contradiction to me. Is he supporting Israel in order to hurry up the Rapture and then the Tribulations too so that God’s people might be punished? Of course, God only knows his heart and I for one do not understand his logic.

Also, many preachers such as the ones I’ve named seem to use Judaism for profit. Ex: Send $$$$$ Jewish feast day offering and you will be blessed for honoring God’s calendar! And remember it’s in the Bible–God’s time does not change!!! sigh I think this is self evident how this does not help anybody.

  1. Mea culpa. Mea culpa. I admit it. I want Perry Stone to discover the ECFs and subsequently discover the church. How come he can cite what they think about the Rapture but not mention what they unanimously said about the Eucharist? If ECFs can validly be used as a form of study that is not seen contradiction to Scripture, how come Sacred Tradition is not valid? How come some tradition is good but not others? How come you can delve time, money, effort, money, airtime into rediscovering Judaism but are quick to judge my Church as pagan? In other words, I welcome you televangelists to discover the Jewish roots of Catholicism.

I encourage my fellow Catholics here to pray for these televangelists and place them in the loving arms of Mary and the pierced hands of Jesus Christ.


#15

Gen. 315, I fully agree, but I’m not sure if they treat as a valid religion. I’m sure they’d say that God has not put asunder His convenant with Abraham, Issac and Jacob and yet at the same time acknowledge that the only way to the Father is through Jesus.


#16

Once upon a time, I attended for quite a number of weeks a “messianic congregation” in Charlotte, NC - :frowning:

NonJews parading around in tallisim and tzitzis - I asked myself why? G-d did not command them to wear this.

I participated in their “Pesach” seder - why? I find that the Bible teaches that nonJews are not permitted by G-d to participate in this seder.

These people that do as I said above are doing their best to entice Jewish neshamos/souls - to convert them. They say: “Believing in J is the most Jewish thing…”


#17

Well, I can’t answer for the Jews, but as a Christian I’m a bit offended by the disengenuous rediscovery of Jewish roots…being done for money.

I do encourage a thorough study of Judaism as you then understand the gospels better as well…and the Catholic Church too. I’ve studied for years with a Reform, Conservative, and Orthodox rabbi and attended shul. I’ve been to several seders and in it see the Catholic Mass.

Yes, I think outside the money issues it’s a cry for liturgy and tradition and history form the evangelicals.


#18

NO WHERE IN SCRIPTURE- does it say the church “fulfills” a distinct people. There is a remnant of Israel and believers of all nations in the church. Prophecy states all of Israel will be saved when Jesus comes back.

Anyways, there is so much to learn about Jesus and prophecy from the jewish feasts and traditions. As far as keeping them, well as long as they remember Jesus is in fulfillment of them. I dont know how that would work for the Feast of Atonement. But Tabernacles looks like a fantastic feast to participate in.


#19

Don’t know what to make of this, other than he is asking for a pa-$$-over offering. :blush:


#20

Please give source.


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