The Bible and Catholic teachings

Hello,

I would like to ask that the following questions be answered with proofs or examples.

Do Catholics believe that the Bible is the foundation of their teachings?

Are the teachings of Catholicism all supported by the Bible?

Thank you.

Katie Kilbane

Katie I think this may help and save me some typos. :slight_smile:

vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19651118_dei-verbum_en.html

If you need further explanation of this topic, you can always watch my video titled:
“Oral, Sacred or Apostolic Tradition”
youtube.com/watch?v=f_GA7kYvBfg

God bless!

The Church came before the Bible. The Bible is just a too we have used for a long time that record the gospels and other works from the Apostles. Though most of our teachings can be found in the Bible.

The Church’s teachings are all supported by Scripture. But Catholics don’t believe that Scripture is the foundation of our doctrines. Rather, apostolic tradition - which is the teaching of the apostles handed down and preserved by the Church in writing and preaching - is the foundation of the Church’s belief.

IOW the Church doesn’t believe something BECAUSE it’s in Scripture, but rather, something is in Scripture because it reflects the Church’s ancient belief. That was in fact one of the criterion to determine the canon of Scripture, does this document teach something contrary to Sacred Tradition i.e what the Church has always believed and professed? If it did, it was rejected. Of course there was other criteria also used to decide if it was authentically inspired (was it written by an apostolic man, has it been universally used in the liturgy etc…) But agreement with Tradition was a major factor.

Hope that helped a little. :slight_smile:

Thank you,

Your reply and all the replies before it - including the links, will be very useful

Sounds like the antithesis of an important Islamic principle with regards to transmitting sacred knowledge: The Truth is not known by men, men are known by the Truth.

Is it safe to say then that an important principle regarding the transmission of the church teachings would be: The church teachings are not known by scripture -Scripture is known by the Church teachings?

.

I would like to ask for clarification of how this “truth”* is known and/or obtained in the first place.

*The quotation marks are not used ironically, but to indicate direct citation of your wording.

Understood. But are you really asking for clarification??? I mean come on, you already accuse islam of having GAPING HOLES and it is quite apparent that you do not find even a modicum of “truth” in Islaam whatsoever.

Anyways - I will post for you the beginning of a transcription of an explanation given by one of the erudite scholars of Islaam (words in parentheses are mine to clarify meaning)

The shayateen (devils) from mankind and jinn have misguided many of the slaves (worshippers) of Allaah by three mighty deviations that are nothing but lies upon Allaah.

1.Taking people away from the texts i.e The Book of Allaah and the Sunnah of Muhammad (sallallaahu ‘alayhi wa sallam) to the opinions, desires and allegiances.

2.Glorifying ignorance amongst the people so much so that it became an objective that the majority of the people be upon that mannerism of ignorance.

3.Glorifying or thinking of some scholars as being holy and infallible.

As a result, it is necessary to clarify the straight path of Allaah and thus the Shaykh outlined some principles needed by the student of knowledge that he/she can use as a light on the path towards his/her Lord.

[RIGHT]more… [/RIGHT]

I sense that you feel this process is a weakness, somehow? That hundreds of hand present opportunity for error? You prefer putting all your eggs (so to speak) in one basket of a single source of revelation?

Katie, Catholic’s hold that Jesus taught the apostles and the apostles taught their descendants the One Faith, handed down in both spoken word and letter. The apostles were witnesses to Christ’s death and resurrection and eleven of them died as martyrs believing he was the God incarnate. The transmission of faith from the apostles to their descendants includes St John teaching St. Ignatius of Antioch (one of many non-biblical testimonies to Christ’s divinity).

“We have also as a Physician the Lord our God, Jesus the Christ, the only-begotten Son and Word, before time began, but who afterwards became also man, of Mary the virgin." Ignatius of Antioch, To the Ephesians, 7 (A.D. 110).

The Catholic Church recognizes the degree of truth found in other religions. From the Catechism of the Catholic Church below. You can read the entire text here.

843 The Catholic Church recognizes in other religions that search, among shadows and images, for the God who is unknown yet near since he gives life and breath and all things and wants all men to be saved. Thus, the Church considers all goodness and truth found in these religions as “a preparation for the Gospel and given by him who enlightens all men that they may at length have life.”

PnP

That the 27 books of the New Testament were discerned out of several hundred writings is correct.

And all of those men - inspired by the holy ghost -were the ones who determined what would be included in the Canon, correct?

The authors of the 27 books of the NT had no idea that when they were writing, that their words would become “scripture”. All writings of the NT were written before the year 110ad. Those that decided what was scripture were their later descendants who were taught the one faith: Catholic Bishops in the late 4th century.

My analogy - although perhaps not a good one - was that in Catholic beliefs, the truth (scripture) is known by men (church fathers, teachings) But since scripture is not the foundation of Catholicism - the church teachings (men i.e. church fathers, church teachings) are not known by the truth (scripture).

Katie, scripture says that the Church is the Pillar and Foundation of Truth. 1 Timothy 3:15 below. The Church, the Pillar of Truth, both guarded the Truth from heresy and proclaimed the Gospel, both in the preached word and in writing.

15 if I am delayed, you may know how one ought to behave in the household of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and bulwark of the truth.

PnP

Thank you for expounding on this PnP. Your comments are helpful.

As you may (or may not) know, Muslims are instructed to believe in all Divine Revelations - It is one of the six pillars of Islamic faith. From those revelations is what we call the Injeel - or gospel of Jesus -peace be upon him. Others are the Torah of Moses and Psalms of David.

If I may ask, does Catholicism teach that Jesus himself was sent with a Scripture?

I understand that the 4 Gospels include sayings of Jesus, however these are recollections and accounts of his life and works.

Thank you for your consideration.

Katie

Katie,

Per the Catechism of the Catholic Church, paragraph 81. This includes both the Old and New Testaments.

“Sacred Scripture is the speech of God as it is put down in writing under the breath of the Holy Spirit”

The Son, the second person of the Trinity (Father, Son and Holy Spirit), spoke through the Old Testament scriptures before becoming incarnate. So when Jesus quotes the OT, he is quoting himself, that which God was the author as we believe both the Old and New Testament are the inspired and infallible Word of God.

PnP

Oky note taken. Pardon me, but I was totally unaware of this teaching. I’ll do the research myself as to how the Catholic Bible OT and NT was collected - if you or anyone else has a link for me on that I would appreciate it. Thanks!

I thought you already knew how the Bible cam together: :slight_smile:

catholicapologetics.info/apologetics/protestantism/wbible.htm

Thanks for the link - I have a basic understanding of the compilation of NT but not much on the OT except that it contains four different versions (Y E P and one more cant remember). And nothing about this bit of info PnP passed along .

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