The Catechism is stupid; Canon Law is stupid


#1

Ok, how do I respond to stuff like that? I just had like a 2 hour conversation with a protestant friend of mine, who loves to be very offensive saying stuff like “rome craps on the scriptures” and calling stuff heresy. I just get so discouraged. And he never changes his mind about anything, even when i explain stuff really thoroughly. He says I believe in works-based-salvation, even when I explain that we can’t even do good works unless we’re “saved” first. He thinks I’m walking a very fine line. And he fears for my salvation. It’s just so frustrating. Can he really not see how logical Catholicism is??


#2

Try not to let it get to you. When he says wacky stuff, just let it go right through you and say, “that’s an interesting viewpoint” without either feeding it or arguing against it. Let him talk himself into a logical corner. Either way, detach your own emotional responses from his triggers because I suspect he wants to be controversial and important at least as much as he wants to be right.

Alan


#3

I would not argue with him at all. He is not receptive to God’s graces. He will not hear what you say. Let example speak for you.


#4

Yes. Pray for him, he is obviously closed to any truth of the Holy spirit.
Let him Know how comfortable and at Peace you are in the Holy Roman Catholic Church, and let him know who it was that put the Bible together…The Catholic Church!!!
Walk away, shake the dust from your sandals, he does not want to hear …Yet!


#5

Have you considered that this guy isn’t much of a friend if he says this kind of stuff about something as sacred to you as your religion?
He probably thinks he’s being cute, but I suggest that you tell him one time that he’s way outta line (since I hope you don’t do the same to him!) and if he doesn’t knock it off then just cease hangin’ out with him. If he calls or comes by wanting to know what the deal is… Then just tell him honestly that you don’t care to hear all his anti-Catholic trash and if he can’t have the common courtesy to show you that simple respect then you 'd prefer not to be around him. All this is contingent upon how you know he’ll handle any of this. If he’s a jerk…well…what have you got to lose? There are good Catholics out there that will be glad to have you around.

None of us HAVE to take grief for being Catholic… If we show respect for others’ religions we have a right to a share of that same respect in return. That’s one reason that A/C posters here get bent outta whack when I answer their questions. They wanna free pass to disparage the faith, but if I (GOD FORBID) point out their lack of respect or honesty then I’m are being “uncharitable” or “unchristian” or “harsh”, when we have a right to have our faith and beliefs respected as well. By and large Catholics do not attack other religions…We will talk about them and learn what we can, but as for disparaging them…that’s just really not us…
If he won’t quit badmouthing your faith…Walk away and don’t even look back. See Matthew 10:14, Mark 6:11, Luke 9:5 and 10:11, and Acts 13:51 and the context of those passages for the whole deal on that.
Pax vobiscum,


#6

[quote=grandadmiralboo]Ok, how do I respond to stuff like that? I just had like a 2 hour conversation with a protestant friend of mine, who loves to be very offensive saying stuff like “rome craps on the scriptures” and calling stuff heresy. I just get so discouraged. And he never changes his mind about anything, even when i explain stuff really thoroughly. He says I believe in works-based-salvation, even when I explain that we can’t even do good works unless we’re “saved” first. He thinks I’m walking a very fine line. And he fears for my salvation. It’s just so frustrating. Can he really not see how logical Catholicism is??
[/quote]

Tell him to put his money where his mouth is and come on here, if he refuses, shake the dust from your shoes, don’t cast your perils before swine.


#7

God always answers prayers. Pray to the Holy Spirit for his faith, and after that be his friend. He will be led back.


#8

[quote=grandadmiralboo]Ok, how do I respond to stuff like that? I just had like a 2 hour conversation with a protestant friend of mine, who loves to be very offensive saying stuff like “rome craps on the scriptures” and calling stuff heresy. I just get so discouraged. And he never changes his mind about anything, even when i explain stuff really thoroughly. He says I believe in works-based-salvation, even when I explain that we can’t even do good works unless we’re “saved” first. He thinks I’m walking a very fine line. And he fears for my salvation. It’s just so frustrating. Can he really not see how logical Catholicism is??
[/quote]

Someone I know once said that we are called to simply love others and speak the truth. If they argue then it is just not their time. And it sounds to me your friend is not going to be ready anytime soon with such intense viewpoints. Then again, we have a God of miracles - so who knows. He is the only one that can change hearts, not us.

Usually, when people argue that intensely, it may be because somewhere deep down they know it is or might be true and are fighting it for whatever reason. Pray that God reveals why he is so adamantly opposed.

I have the same issues with family members. It is hard and very frustrating. My cousin actually said something about Jesus on the cross that was so rude I cannot even repeat it. He comes from an almost (but not sure) agnostic position. We all face it but sometimes all that is left is praying for them. When they do ponder the truth, they will know who to ask when they are ready and God will use you then.

Britta


#9

[quote=(Joshua)]Tell him to put his money where his mouth is and come on here, if he refuses, shake the dust from your shoes, don’t cast your perils before swine.
[/quote]

Another old saying is that you can’t argue with an idiot. If he has no respect for you, or your church, then he’s not much of a friend anyway. Dump him, and pray for him.


#10

Thanks, everyone, your input is greatly appreciated. I don’t know why I got so upset last night. I did do things like point out when he was being childish, “the catechism is stupid”. I was just like.
“um, ok, why is the Catechism stupid?” I actually frustrate him a great deal. He claimed i was giving him ulcers, that’s before i started actually getting upset. And that I don’t listen to what he says, when I listen to everything he says. It’s just that statements that make no sense to me, i may seem to ignore. Or when I’ll explain a point of Catholic faith, and He’s like “that’s not true.” I’ll just be like. “Ok, you’re entitled to your own position.” It’s just when he accuses me of blasphemy and starts to really attack the things I hold dear, i start getting hurt i guess. And when he accuses me of things like being illogical, and stuff. He accuses me of making “making non-logical equivalencies.” It just sounds like an insult to my intelligence. He thinks Catholicism is so ridiculously unreasonable, like that no point of Catholic doctrine that differs from “protestant” doctrine even has evidence in the bible. “If there was then protestants would believe those things.” He also has a tendency to laugh at a lot of things I say, as if there was something really funny about it. I dunno, He is my friend, and I’d never abandon him, that’s not an option. I just wish that when the Catholic issue comes up he wouldn’t be so offensive. I’ve never been that way with him. If he treats everyone he’s trying to “convert” this way, i don’t see how any “fruit” could come from it. Anyway, I ramble. Thanks for all your input, from the bottom of my heart.


#11

Protestants “****” on the Scripture. Why? Because Sola Scriptura is incompatible with the Scripture.

You know, to err is human. With faulty premises, one will always arrive at faulty premises. But Sola Scriptura is quite obviously self-contradicting.

Canon Law is not much different from their own ecclesiastic rules except our Pope and bishops have apostolic succession and are real priests and bishops with proper authority of governance while their pastors are contracted workers. Binding and unbinding and the stone on which the church is built. How much of that remains in Protestant ecclesiastic bodies? And yet they make rules. So why can’t we?


#12

A person who says the catechism is stupid has not read the catechism. This statement says more about your friend being stupid than the catechism.

A person who says canon law is stupid has not read canon law.
Again - your friend reveals his ignorance and unwillingness to look at someone else’s point of view.

There are a few folks who have shown up on this forum with similar tactics - similar attitude.

I’ve noticed it doesn’t matter how much scriptural and historical evidence is presented to refute their position - they won’t budge.
Why won’t they budge?

In my personal opinion - it is pride.
They enjoy to think these things of catholics. They enjoy to belittle and ridicule.
But most of all I think they enjoy their imagined superiority.
That they have it “in” with God - and catholics are…well…“stupid”


#13

frustrating when people do that, isn’t it? but, as can be seen in his statements, he’s not ready/able to discuss these things logically, let alone theologically. my two cents: pray for him, think of this as an exercise in patience, treat him the way Jesus would want, and offer it all up to God. when he starts his nonsense again, don’t say anything; just smile oh-so-mysteriously. :stuck_out_tongue:


#14

Why do you even bother with people like this? This guy doesn’t sound like any “friend” I’d want to have. I know we’re supposed to love our enemies and stuff, but trying to reason with a brick wall won’t make any difference. Go about your life as best you can, and pray that they change.


#15

[quote=grandadmiralboo]Ok, how do I respond to stuff like that? I just had like a 2 hour conversation with a protestant friend of mine, who loves to be very offensive saying stuff like “rome craps on the scriptures” and calling stuff heresy. I just get so discouraged. And he never changes his mind about anything, even when i explain stuff really thoroughly. He says I believe in works-based-salvation, even when I explain that we can’t even do good works unless we’re “saved” first. He thinks I’m walking a very fine line.** And he fears for my salvation.** It’s just so frustrating. Can he really not see how logical Catholicism is??
[/quote]

:wave:** " he fears for my salvation"… not usually true…** he is** insecure…**if you are correct than he is wrong. Since the Holy Spirit is his guide this is not possible in his mind !!

:tsktsk: "Rome craps on the scriptures " is the hight of disrespect for the beliefs of another :frowning: It does not sound like the Holy Spirit is close to him but another spirit definately is !!

One that you should stay away from. Pray for Him. Friends do not speak to you in that manner and never allow anyone to **degrade **the beliefs that are sacred to you. Never allow them to speak disrespectful of other people either :nope: . Silence is always the best policy and teacher **after **some one has been put on notice regarding this kind of behavior. Speak to him about his attitude. If he wants to keep you in his life than he will make a sincere effort to change. If not let him go.

God Bless You,
Shalom,
Catherine


#16

[quote=exoflare]Why do you even bother with people like this? This guy doesn’t sound like any “friend” I’d want to have. I know we’re supposed to love our enemies and stuff, but trying to reason with a brick wall won’t make any difference. Go about your life as best you can, and pray that they change.
[/quote]

:thumbsup: Love does not mean liking or even relationship. We do treat people with care, concern and respect butsometimes…** as you said**… all that we can do is pray for another person !

Shalom,
Catherine


#17

[quote=exoflare]Why do you even bother with people like this? This guy doesn’t sound like any “friend” I’d want to have. I know we’re supposed to love our enemies and stuff, but trying to reason with a brick wall won’t make any difference. Go about your life as best you can, and pray that they change.
[/quote]

:thumbsup: Love does not mean liking or even relationship. We do treat people with care, concern and respect but sometimes…** as you said**… all that we can do is pray for another person !

Shalom,
Catherine


#18

If he’s really your friend then you should be able to be upfront with him about this and tell him honestly that he’s offending you and that you’d appreciate it if he’d keep his opinions of your faith to himself. Point out that many of the things that he says about the faith are wrong and that if he isn’t interested in hearing what Catholics really believe and why, then don’t bring it up. Tell him that your religion is off the table as a topic for discussion if he can’t respectfully discuss it.

You need to realize that this guy may be the first casualty of your commitment to the truth. Not that you’d abandon him…but that he may just bail on you…

Pax vobiscum,


#19

If you still want him as a friend, then always return the ball to his court. When he says ridiculous things like, “the Catechism is stupid,” ask him for a quote or a paragraph number to illustrate his point. Do the same with canon law or any other outrageous statement he makes.
He obviously wants to get a rise out of you. Remain absolutely calm, even if you’re boiling inside. As St. Paul says, “Heap burning coals upon his head,” by remaining calm and friendly, but put the onus on him to back up his claims.


#20

[quote=Lorarose]A person who says the catechism is stupid has not read the catechism. This statement says more about your friend being stupid than the catechism.
[/quote]

Maybe they could read some of the catechism…what better source than Rome.

Catechism of the Catholic Church

Maybe they could read parts of Code of Canon Law.

Code of Canon Law

WELL SAID. :thumbsup: This poor soul should be more worried about their soal, and maybe take the chance to learn something. Even is he disagrees with the church, at least he will actually know what he disagrees with.

Just my 2 :twocents:

Peace and God Bless,
Lance


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