The Church is dying and will die


#1

It is true. You just have to look around to see it. Churches closing everywhere, lack of priest, immorality of the priesthood, lack of unity within the hierarchy, no condemnation of errors and heresies, incredible decline in attendence and memberships, legalization of homosexual marriage, legalization of abortion, eutanasia, etc.

The plague of modernism has taken The Church by storm and while The Church has dealt with previous heresies and has survided them. This time around it is The Church that won’t survive.

A crucial factor is going to be the separation of Church and State, back then, The Church had the state to support it, but now it doesn’t, so it is more vulnerable and it is showing, she now can’t supress heresies or silence attacks against it. She can’t ban books or burn them, but people are free to publish anything they want about The Church even lies about it like the Da Vinci Code. Anybody now mocks and ridicules, questions the Pope. No less than 100 years ago, the Pope was respected and so were priests. But now, they are seen as corrupt people and the pope as a dinosour.

It won’t belong till it happen. Islam is also going to take over and conquer finally Catholicism after so many attemps, and then Catholicism will wither and die.

The conflic will then be between Islam and Modernism, that will bring some pain ot the world.


#2

This is nothing new, the Church has been under attack since day one, from the outside and the inside. The gates of Hell will not prevail. Even if the Church does “die,” it simply means Christ is on His way back. Two things to think about (from a saint and the CCC):

[font=Verdana]Even if Catholics faithful to Tradition are reduced to a handful, they are the ones who are the True Church of Jesus Christ."
*~St. Athanasius *

**677 **The Church will enter the glory of the kingdom only through this final Passover, when she will follow her Lord in his death and Resurrection.578 The kingdom will be fulfilled, then, not by a historic triumph of the Church through a progressive ascendancy, but only by God’s victory over the final unleashing of evil, which will cause his Bride to come down from heaven.579 God’s triumph over the revolt of evil will take the form of the Last Judgment after the final cosmic upheaval of this passing world.580

[/font]


#3

Matthew 16:18 et al… The Church will survive IN SPITE OF the attacks of Satan and the problems he introduces into his world.

Jesus Christ is His Church… and He will never die.


#4

Also, wanted to add. Another thing is the theory of evolution. It completelly destroys the Adam and Eve along with Original Sin story and weakens, in fact completelly debunks the fundations of Catholicism.


#5

hehe,

Just call it a hunch … but I seriously think that God is a little bigger than these very minor issues. This is a alot of secular assumption that speaks as if God can’t keep his word. On the opposite side of this secular view I think that as the world becomes more and more evil more people are looking for God. The Holy Spirit is not limited like we are.

-D


#6

It is not the Church that is about to die… …

Your comments are seriously wrong. It appears that someone has introduced these wacky notions to you and you have been unable to reply. Stay here on the forum and you will get a lot of good information, factual, that will be of much help to you. In the meantime, I suggest you present your dilema in the form of questions, not in the form of statements (which you will see will be in error).


#7

I try my best not to call Jesus a liar. :nope:


#8

I would posit that it is your faith that is suffering rather than the Church dying. Pray for the grace of conversion.


#9

[quote=MrS]It is not the Church that is about to die…
[/quote]

Really? Then why do we see this happening everywhere?

Why do we see it’s message being repudiated and ignored? It is only growing in those less developped countries. But that is just because those countries have not reached the same stage as Europe and USA, hell it is starting to die in South America already. Just as the country gets more technologically advanced and gains more knowledge and as science advances Catholicism is eroded, withers and dies. The example is clear in those two countries and in Canada as well.

It is as if knowledge destroys Catholciism.


#10

Same thing was said around 1800. Many people thought the Church was dead/outdated and there was no need for a new pope after Pope Pius VI.

Actually when the State got involved in trying to control the Church, the Church was weaker. The more independent the Church is of the State the better.


#11

As long as one Catholic draws breath, the Church survives.


#12

[quote=salival]Also, wanted to add. Another thing is the theory of evolution. It completelly destroys the Adam and Eve along with Original Sin story and weakens, in fact completelly debunks the fundations of Catholicism.
[/quote]

When the church is at its darkest … greater saints emerge! That is fact, that is historical.

You seem very angry. :frowning:


#13

[quote=salival]It is true. You just have to look around to see it. Churches closing everywhere, lack of priest, immorality of the priesthood, lack of unity within the hierarchy, no condemnation of errors and heresies, incredible decline in attendence and memberships, legalization of homosexual marriage, legalization of abortion, eutanasia, etc.

The plague of modernism has taken The Church by storm and while The Church has dealt with previous heresies and has survided them. This time around it is The Church that won’t survive.

A crucial factor is going to be the separation of Church and State, back then, The Church had the state to support it, but now it doesn’t, so it is more vulnerable and it is showing, she now can’t supress heresies or silence attacks against it. She can’t ban books or burn them, but people are free to publish anything they want about The Church even lies about it like the Da Vinci Code. Anybody now mocks and ridicules, questions the Pope. No less than 100 years ago, the Pope was respected and so were priests. But now, they are seen as corrupt people and the pope as a dinosour.

It won’t belong till it happen. Islam is also going to take over and conquer finally Catholicism after so many attemps, and then Catholicism will wither and die.

The conflic will then be between Islam and Modernism, that will bring some pain ot the world.
[/quote]

…oh ye of little faith… remember the words of JPII… “be not afraid”… and remember the words of Christ shortly before he accended to heaven…“I will be with you till the end of time”… and remember what he told Peter… “The Gates of Hell would Not prevail against his church”…

Hang in there bub… keep fighting the fight, keep running the race and for God’s sake… keep the faith… we all need each other…

I wish you peace…:thumbsup:

sometimes you just got to fight, even though the odds are not in your favor…

http://www.usfvideocollectibles.com/Space_Ghost_using_Power_Bands.jpg


#14

Look not on the faults of the people and ministers but rather on the faith of the church.

The Catholic Church, no doubt, has had and will have many problems. The churhc has many detractors and many that take delight in bringing to light the faults of the church. BUT the faith of the Church remains strong, the teachings of the Church remain strong, and the traditions remain string and intact - despite attacks, controversy and the faults of members, lay ministers and ministers.

God the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit are indistructable. Faith - Faith - Faith is the foudnation of our Church and will withstand attacks.

And finally, focus on the good rather than the evil.


#15

I take it youre not catholic then.

Catholicism is on its way down? Of course it is.

In this secular modern society focused on self admiration and promotion of self the very notion of God itself is rejected. The biggest problem with such immoral behaviour is that if God does exist, they can’t do it because he wouldnt want them to do it. Thus modernism is born, all are equal and free to do whatever they please, as long as it doesnt harm anyone, its okay. :mad:

You enjoy your fancy sports car, and live in comfort till death, but then who will you turn to?

In fact, many prophecies were written concerning this period in time, about its immorality, with precise information, it facinates me that God told us in advance people like yourself (or the image you are portraying to me) who are completely decieved by the devil.

Catholics are very robust, we have survived thousands of heresies, attacks, criticisms etc… but then again its not surprising, we had God WORD on it!

Before you attack us for being outdated, beaten by technology, etc… do some research on what you are attacking, what you believe to be wrong, and why.

Why do we see it’s message being repudiated and ignored? It is only growing in those less developped countries.

We do not preach an easy way to heaven, thats why, we tell the Truth, straight from God, sorry but we dont adapt to modern society, when God tells us something, we stick by, no protesters here. In less developed countries corruption is rare when things like not dying become central to daily life, when life is similar to how God would love us to live ours, people find Him. I hope you do too.

In Christ.

Andre.


#16

A crucial factor is going to be the separation of Church and State, back then, The Church had the state to support it, but now it doesn’t, so it is more vulnerable and it is showing, she now can’t supress heresies or silence attacks against it.

Look what happened to the regions that supported “the church” at a state level… people moved here to avoid religious persecution and flourished with a seperation of church and state, becoming the leading super power over these other nations.

She can’t ban books or burn them

Thank God! There is no telling what knowledge we might have if it were not for this ridiculous practice of burning texts that did not fit catholicism. You might remember the priests who burned the incan (toltec?) religious texts and civiliztional history, to punish them for a heresy. This one offense alone is inexcusable, but there are more.

She can’t ban books or burn them, but people are free to publish anything they want

Not free press!!! What is the world coming to when EVERYONE is entitled to an opinion? I blame the schools.

It won’t belong till it happen. Islam is also going to take over and conquer finally Catholicism

I think they have a void in the leadership, I say this because they kill more muslims than christians every year.

Also, wanted to add. Another thing is the theory of evolution. It completelly destroys the Adam and Eve along with Original Sin story and weakens, in fact completelly debunks the fundations of Catholicism

Actually no it doesn’t. Man I hate telling this story but here goes… Scientists have recently unlocked the human genome. Basically that means they have mapped all of the pairs of genes that compose our physical makeup. Most of our genes can be accounted for in some evelutionary sense, that is to say that they can be traced back to the creatures that those gene pairs originated in. Before the experiment it was known that a common bacteria has roughly 9,000 gene pairs, so it was suspected that human beings would have hundreds of thousands of gene pairs. We have 30,000 as it so happens. At this point you could say that we are roughly only 3 times more complex than bacteria, or the optimist view which is that very few genes make a huge difference. Both are true. While almost all of the pairs could be accounted for there were 236 pairs that defied the logic of the whole evelutionary system, because we aquired them laterally, that is to say all at once, and not in progression. Not only that, we are the creature of origin, meaning no other creature has these genes. All other pairs were aquired one or two pairs at a time but human beings recieved 236 pairs all at the same time. What does this mean? Well We are roughly 1% different than chimps on a genetic level. It is that 1% that divides humans from the rest of the animal kingdom. 1% of 30,000 is 300 or roughly 236 gene pairs. Therefore based strictly on the evidence one could conclude that BOTH are in fact true. How’s that for an agnostic response? :wink:


#17

This is nothing new… “…many of his disciples turned away and no longer followed him…”

Isn’t is awesome that the Church has survived in spite of all these big problems? We know it will because Jesus will allow the weeds to grow with the wheat. He will separate them at the end, not now. Further we are told that these evil things should be used to help us realize a GOoD thing when we see it. Look for the good, and don’t permit the (d)evil to take over your life


#18

When has the Church’s message ever NOT been repudiated and ignored? She’s been persecuted from without and torn from within from the very beginning. She has, however, Christ’s firm promise that “the gates of hell will not prevail” against her. She’s His spotless Bride, she’ll be ok.


#19

The Church has survived centuries without the active support of secular governments and even with the active repression of secular governments. We have out lived them all.


#20

I wouldn´t worry about this :smiley:
Sure, a few protestant churches opening here and there but the Catholic Church IS NOT dying anywhere, especially in Latin America LOL

Now, why is it that you sound like you wish the Catholic Church would die, is that what you want?


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