I nearly believe that the catholic church is the church that Jesus originally founded [Matt. 16:18 “on this rock I will build my church”], but isn’t it possible that after over 2000 years, some wrong teachings could have gotten in?
There are leaders that have misled the flock, this is quite clear as I debate in the evolution thread. It’s when the world is replaced with the word, this is what you must look out for. Always stick to the rock, always keep in alignment with the word and know Jesus is the light and the truth and the way, and do not be swayed by others that tell you contrary.
If you believe it is the true Church founded by Christ, I would expect nothing less than perfect teaching, and so should you.
No, Jesus promised to be with it until the end of days, not just for a couplea hundred or a couplea thousand years. And He promised that the gates of Hell would NEVER prevail against it, not that after a few hundred or a few thousand years they’d at least start to prevail.
Let’s get one thing straight - the Church that Jesus originally founded was His body, no more no less. Today’s Church, being the same that He founded, which is evident through its Apostolic Succession, is no less His body.
Why would He, who is Truth itself, shoot His own body in the foot by allowing it to teach error?
And if the Catholic Church ISN’T the Church He founded, then which one is? You’d better be sure, whatever your answer may be, that they’ve also been in existence since the time of Christ and that no error has crept into their teachings either, for Christ’s Church certainly would be one that has preserved His one perfect and unchanging Truth since Apostolic times.
Some bad practices have developed, like not reading the Old Testament at Mass (outside of the Easter Vigil I think) but not doctrine.
Only if you are willing to call God a liar.
Christ said the Church would not fail, He would remain with His Church and that the Holy Spirit would guide the Church until the end.
If your willing to say The Church has failed, Christ abandoned His Church and the Holy Spirit has misguided Her.
The Holy Spirit is with us constantly leading us and our leaders to the proper path. As an analogy I am constantly telling my children what to do and how to live their lives the proper way. My kids don’t always listen. Likewise some individuals in the church occasionaly do not listen to what the Holy Spirity and the rest of the church are telling them. This is individual error not error of the church.
We do need to add some scripture to kick off this thread:
Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.” – John 14:6
“For the Father judges no one, but has committed all judgment to the Son, that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him.” – John 5:22,23
The rest of the verse reads: “and the gates of Hell will not prevail against it”.
There is no middle ground with this. Jesus was either correct in His prophecy, or He didn’t know what He was talking about.
Isn’t it possible that some wrong teachings could have gotten into the bible?
Saying that on THIS forum is like asking are you sure the Pope is Catholic. These folks are hard core right wing Catholics. Everything is as it has always been. The Church has never made a mistake, albeit its’ leaders may have, but somehow that has never been considered wrong teaching!
Quoting from a Protestant bible of all things! LOL…i rather suspected as much.
No. The RCC was established by Jesus himself. If God made it our authority, how could it have sin in it? God made the BVM sinless, he has done the same for His Church.
Just the same as the human mind’s problem comprehending eternity, so it is with the comprehending of infallibility. We know something has very little to no chance of being true without divine intervention. We just can’t take it on faith. We trust our eternal soul on faith, but we don’t think God is big enough to protect His instrument to teach and administer grace and save us? Of course the RCC is perfect. As to the others, well, that’s why I am Catholic.
I have two of them, they are easier to read then the King James version, they are based upon it, they say the same thing, why would you put me down in this area for this? The bible I reference daily has been put through more use and abuse then you can imagine, the pages are falling out, the cover is tatered, it’s been with me for quite some time. I have another one, it’s huge, I use that on occassion as well, I also use the web equally for quotes.
Let me give you a little background here, I was not attending mass for quite some time, I opted to find fellowship with protestants for the most part during that time, I learned much, but when push finally came to shove, where they told me to renounce my Catholic faith, I stood my ground and was treated very badly. I stood up for my Church, I extended the olive branch, only for it to be trampled upon over and over again, yet I persevered and I fought the good fight.
So, yeah, I have been exposed to these other denominations, my perspective was for unity, yet in the end, they would have nothing to do with it, it’s sad when it comes down to it. This is why I’m able to relate to these protestants in a way you cannot. Do you explain to these about Mary, about the saints, about the Pope, do you try to dispel their perspectives which are clearly flawed about them? I have done my best to do so, and I won a few over to our side in the process, planting seeds that may some day come to fruition.
1 Corinthians 9:19 read it some time, I won’t offend you quoting from a protestant bible, les I receive additional mockery.
Both are protestant bibles and do not include the full text that Catholics use. Furthermore the KJV is one of the worst translations around and is full of errors. Your posts suggest very strongly that you are fundamentalist in orientation, and I suspected that you picked this up in fundamentalist sects outside the Catholic Church. Fundamentalism is not approved within the church and iis not an acceptable orientation. Your views of evolution I suspect stem from your involvement with protestants of a fundamentalist nature. Such is not taught in Catholicism. You seem to be quite confused, as to exactly where you belong, given that your beliefs certainly don’t square with the Church. Both JPII and Benedict have made clear statements indicating the accept evolution as the model God chose for his universe.
You may read whatever you wish of course. I just don’t see how you reconcile your choices of creationism and the KJV which are fundamentalist teachngs with catholicism.
If it is any consolation, my next bible will be a traditional Catholic one, and I’m going to cross reference everything I know about mine, with it and see just how different they are, especially if one contradicts the other. If the latter happens, I’ll have to rely upon those of you that have also studied both for illumination. I only recently came back to the Catholic church, cut me some slack here, I have defended the church tooth and nail and was treated harshly by the protestants by doing so, so I guess I earned a little respect in regards to standing firm in my faith in the Catholic church.
Kind of a broad generalization…especially since you are a member of the forum and therefore part of “these folks.” You don’t seem “hard core right wing Catholic” to me.
I also want you to read this in regards to evolution.:
If you read it in full, take note, it says “may have” more then it sais it has, that you are still able to believe in creationism, that evolution is not a mandate from the church at all, it’s nuetral on the subject.
Also, why am I being trolled on this subject in this thread that was put in place not to even discuss this matter, why do I have to continue to be questioned along the evolution subject no matter where I go?
Thanks everyone for your replies.
I just wanted to say that, IMO there is nothing really wrong with reading other translations of the bible (and its even good to do so, to find out what exactly they are like) The only real difference I know of between protestant and catholic bibles is that the catholic one has the apocrypha, and the protestant one does not. Just because the verses are a bit differently doesn’t make it entirely bad. All of it basically says the same thing. (although there are some translations, like the message - which really isn’t a translation at all, but a paraphrase, that I dislike a lot) If you want to be sure about the meanings of verses, you can always refer to different translations and the teachings of the catholic church, as well as ask someone who would know.