The Doors to Ecumenism


#1

What It Takes to Help Ecumenism Along
Interview With Father J. Puglisi, Minister General of Franciscans of the Atonement
VATICAN CITY, JAN. 25, 2005 (Zenit.org).- Father James Puglisi, director of Rome’s Pro Unione Center, recalls the words of his professor, Yves Congar, on ecumenism.

The famous theologian used to say: “We can pass through the door of ecumenism only on our knees.”

Thus, prayer is the condition for Christian unity, explains the priest, who is minister general of the Franciscan Friars of the Atonement, in this interview with ZENIT…"

Q: Is there any particular sign to celebrate this Week of Prayer for Christian Unity with more optimism than ever?

Father Puglisi: Yes. I think that in many respects we can see more collaboration among Christians because of the world situation in which the churches live.

What Cardinal Kasper has called a “dialogue of life” is clearly seen as going forward as Christians to respond to situations such as the recent natural disaster in Southeast Asia, to the situation of Christians in Iraq, the Holy Land and places like Sudan.

These represent human needs that the Gospel calls us to witness to with charity. There has been a tremendous outpouring of charity, regardless of denomination or religion. This is how the spirit of the beatitudes counters the spirit of the world, as seen and understood in Johannine terms.

On the theological level we must admit that things are moving more slowly, and we might say cautiously.

We have arrived at a critical point in our discussions and dialogues where we need to stop and evaluate both from the point of view of theory – theological agreements – and practice – how these realities and agreements are being lived out in practice.

"… Père Congar always told us in his class that “We can pass through the door of ecumenism only on our knees.”

Immediately, the image of the door at the Basilica of St. Paul’s Outside the Walls comes to mind, when three church leaders were on their knees, in supplication, knocking at the door/gate that is Christ. This, in fact, is the reason for the Week of Prayer for Christian Unity.

**Q: From your particular point of view, why is there still hostility toward ecumenism?

Father Puglisi: The “hostility” that we observe is more like fear. What we are dealing with at this time is a request for systemic change, [a] conversion of churches and their structures including the Catholic Church. **

We know that historically the structures of the Church have evolved according to the needs, the challenge, that the world put to the Church which, under the guidance of the Holy Spirit, had to respond to these in each generation. This is how the Church fulfilled its role in society…"

“…As long as we maintain a rigid division and separation – and we might say opposition – between clergy and laity, then the process of secularization will continue to progress rapidly in a world which is in rapid social and cultural change. The Gospel needs to be spoken to each generation, to each culture, in terms and with symbols that can articulate its very message to each culture for the life of the world…”

Code: ZE05012503
Date: 2005-01-25


#2

Please, dont insult the intelligence of those who really know what Ecumenism is, there is no fear of Ecumenism, the only fear weof those opposed is the damage it has done to the church, and quoting Congar and Kaspar really puts the nail into that coffin

[quote=HagiaSophia]What It Takes to Help Ecumenism Along
Interview With Father J. Puglisi, Minister General of Franciscans of the Atonement
VATICAN CITY, JAN. 25, 2005 (Zenit.org).- Father James Puglisi, director of Rome’s Pro Unione Center, recalls the words of his professor, Yves Congar, on ecumenism.

The famous theologian used to say: “We can pass through the door of ecumenism only on our knees.”

Thus, prayer is the condition for Christian unity, explains the priest, who is minister general of the Franciscan Friars of the Atonement, in this interview with ZENIT…"

Q: Is there any particular sign to celebrate this Week of Prayer for Christian Unity with more optimism than ever?

Father Puglisi: Yes. I think that in many respects we can see more collaboration among Christians because of the world situation in which the churches live.

What Cardinal Kasper has called a “dialogue of life” is clearly seen as going forward as Christians to respond to situations such as the recent natural disaster in Southeast Asia, to the situation of Christians in Iraq, the Holy Land and places like Sudan.

These represent human needs that the Gospel calls us to witness to with charity. There has been a tremendous outpouring of charity, regardless of denomination or religion. This is how the spirit of the beatitudes counters the spirit of the world, as seen and understood in Johannine terms.

On the theological level we must admit that things are moving more slowly, and we might say cautiously.

We have arrived at a critical point in our discussions and dialogues where we need to stop and evaluate both from the point of view of theory – theological agreements – and practice – how these realities and agreements are being lived out in practice.

"… Père Congar always told us in his class that “We can pass through the door of ecumenism only on our knees.”

Immediately, the image of the door at the Basilica of St. Paul’s Outside the Walls comes to mind, when three church leaders were on their knees, in supplication, knocking at the door/gate that is Christ. This, in fact, is the reason for the Week of Prayer for Christian Unity.

**Q: From your particular point of view, why is there still hostility toward ecumenism? **

**Father Puglisi: The “hostility” that we observe is more like fear. What we are dealing with at this time is a request for systemic change, [a] conversion of churches and their structures including the Catholic Church. **

We know that historically the structures of the Church have evolved according to the needs, the challenge, that the world put to the Church which, under the guidance of the Holy Spirit, had to respond to these in each generation. This is how the Church fulfilled its role in society…"

“…As long as we maintain a rigid division and separation – and we might say opposition – between clergy and laity, then the process of secularization will continue to progress rapidly in a world which is in rapid social and cultural change. The Gospel needs to be spoken to each generation, to each culture, in terms and with symbols that can articulate its very message to each culture for the life of the world…”

Code: ZE05012503
Date: 2005-01-25
[/quote]


#3

[quote=CrusaderNY]Please, dont insult the intelligence of those who really know what Ecumenism is,
[/quote]

I think there is no danger of that at all.

[quote=CrusaderNY] there is no fear of Ecumenism, the only fear weof those opposed is the damage it has done to the church, and quoting Congar and Kaspar really puts the nail into that coffin
[/quote]

I suspect there are others here who when they see the reams of SSPX and “other” sites quoted see a few other nails.


#4

[quote=HagiaSophia]I think there is no danger of that at all.

I suspect there are others here who when they see the reams of SSPX and “other” sites quoted see a few other nails.
[/quote]

HAgaiSophia, From reading just a few posts of yours, am I correct to say that you are head over heels for just about any form of Ecumenism? Am I correct that you do oppose any and all SSPX Masses?

Do you have a comment on a Theological level of what has been done within the R. Catholic Church to advance Ecumeninism?

I want to hear all sides of this Movement. Thanks.


#5

Ditto…

[quote=Exporter]HAgaiSophia, From reading just a few posts of yours, am I correct to say that you are head over heels for just about any form of Ecumenism? Am I correct that you do oppose any and all SSPX Masses?

Do you have a comment on a Theological level of what has been done within the R. Catholic Church to advance Ecumeninism?

I want to hear all sides of this Movement. Thanks.
[/quote]


#6

Ditto…

[quote=Exporter]HAgaiSophia, From reading just a few posts of yours, am I correct to say that you are head over heels for just about any form of Ecumenism? Am I correct that you do oppose any and all SSPX Masses?

Do you have a comment on a Theological level of what has been done within the R. Catholic Church to advance Ecumeninism?

I want to hear all sides of this Movement. Thanks.
[/quote]


#7

[quote=Exporter]HAgaiSophia, From reading just a few posts of yours, am I correct to say that you are head over heels for just about any form of Ecumenism?
[/quote]

I am a pragmatist. The world has changed as we have moved into modern times and post Vatican II. The church, two popes and its bishops, set forth aims and objectives during that council. This pope was elected based on his commitment to it. Ecumenism is really “here” - it remains for us to work out how it is to be implemented. Whether one fears it, welcomes it, appreciates it, abhors it, it is a “given”. I try and read and digest what the popes and bishops say about it. I would rather be a part of the “construction” than I would of the “resistance”.

[quote=Exporter] Am I correct that you do oppose any and all SSPX Masses?
[/quote]

I am irrevocably in the corner of the pope; I absolutely do not travel with those who claim sede vacante, church in apostasy or call the Eucharist offered in John Paul’s church worthless cookies, challenge the ordination of post council bishops and priests (I refer you to the my post #215 in the Ecumenism: Why the Euphoria…" thread) for quotes from one of these “sites”.) They should curl the hair of any Catholic worthy of the name.

I do my best not to confuse my personal preferences with validity of liturgy. I have certain preferments, I work towards seeing that these remain in the church for those who want them, but I recognize and hold with the pope that he is as much a pope as any of his predecessors, that he has the same authority, the same charisms and since he recognizes various liturgical practices, I assent.

[quote=Exporter]Do you have a comment on a Theological level of what has been done within the R. Catholic Church to advance Ecumeninism?
[/quote]

This is a thread all unto itself which would run to untold postings…:smiley: In order to understand some of what is happening not just within the Ecumenical movement, the inter-religious dialogues, but many other things with regard to Vatican II - a friend and I purchased an armload of books two summers ago to refresh ourselves on what was said and done at the council, why and how its been implemented - we read both pro and con - all of them filled with information to think about, analyze and dissect. We were able to do this together via the internet and when we were done, we both found ourselves, more committed, and more affirmed in this pope. There are works of great scholarship by people on both sides, well worth the reading. ( They do not however include the low level stuff I’ve seen posted) Once we had done that we were both much better able to “hear” Vatican pronouncements with a different ear, see it with different eyes, we knew who was in what faction, what the agenda is vs. what they say and altogether found it quite helpful.

For basics, Irefer you to the thread:
forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=35288

Kaspar: Ecumenism Must Be Faithful To Christ
"…we need a solid foundation and a common point of reference," the cardinal said.

“…Cardinal Kasper said he believes ecumenical progress will come from greater attachment to the Scriptures, a commitment to living the Christian faith and an increased love for the church as the body of Christ…“The best ecumenism consists in reading and living the Gospel,” Cardinal Kasper said.”

[quote=Exporter]I want to hear all sides of this Movement. Thanks.
[/quote]

Then I suggest three things: familiarize yourself with the Vatican Ii documents concerning them and commentaries on them.

Read at least 7-8 books (both pro and con) on Vatican II and how these things developed, and were signed off on.

Realize that we are still dealing with problems and questions from Vatican I which were never resolved, particularly with regard to the papacy as viewed in the ecumenical world and also realize that the poor implementaton, the excesses, the egregious affronts to faithful Catholics by many of the far right and the far left have poisoned the well of understanding and must be confronted, refuted and dealt with.

I can honestly say that during my time in working with the ecumenical groups I have never met anyone or had to assent to anything which caused me to lose my faith in my own Church…
The Greek Orthodox, the Russians, the Jews, the Easterns, and many of the Protestants were delightful people, thrilled at an opportunity to dialogue not just with us but with others and want a better understanding of us all. Are there nuts and kooks? You bet - find a goup without them…are there rabid leftists and rightists…you bet and in every group They as one rabbi put it are necessary to every church - because the far left and the far right tell the rest of us where the middle is, and that’s where most of us want to be.


#8

Bishop Kasper was a Methodist “convert”, I dont trust him with dealing and negotiating with any of the other religions, it is like having a former Communist negotiate with Russia on arms negotiations, it just goes to show the naive nature of our leadership on this subject, it has nothing to do with loyalty as I am sworn behind my Pope and you can throw that sede garbage around all you want, but was it and is in not the liberal agenda to question authority and that never comes into question? There is and will be a return to traditionalism, or else there will be more church closings, more pedophiles, more destructiona and more loss in the church, and maybe it will be St Pius X group that will one day become the real church if the Vatican keeps defecting and changing the church to suit these other false faiths that you are so enamored with

[quote=HagiaSophia]I am a pragmatist. The world has changed as we have moved into modern times and post Vatican II. The church, two popes and its bishops, set forth aims and objectives during that council. This pope was elected based on his commitment to it. Ecumenism is really “here” - it remains for us to work out how it is to be implemented. Whether one fears it, welcomes it, appreciates it, abhors it, it is a “given”. I try and read and digest what the popes and bishops say about it. I would rather be a part of the “construction” than I would of the “resistance”.

I am irrevocably in the corner of the pope; I absolutely do not travel with those who claim sede vacante, church in apostasy or call the Eucharist offered in John Paul’s church worthless cookies, challenge the ordination of post council bishops and priests (I refer you to the my post #215 in the Ecumenism: Why the Euphoria…" thread) for quotes from one of these “sites”.) They should curl the hair of any Catholic worthy of the name.

I do my best not to confuse my personal preferences with validity of liturgy. I have certain preferments, I work towards seeing that these remain in the church for those who want them, but I recognize and hold with the pope that he is as much a pope as any of his predecessors, that he has the same authority, the same charisms and since he recognizes various liturgical practices, I assent.

For basics, Irefer you to the thread:
forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=35288

Kaspar: Ecumenism Must Be Faithful To Christ
"…we need a solid foundation and a common point of reference," the cardinal said.

“…Cardinal Kasper said he believes ecumenical progress will come from greater attachment to the Scriptures, a commitment to living the Christian faith and an increased love for the church as the body of Christ…“The best ecumenism consists in reading and living the Gospel,” Cardinal Kasper said.”

Then I suggest three things: familiarize yourself with the Vatican Ii documents concerning them and commentaries on them.

Read at least 7-8 books (both pro and con) on Vatican II and how these things developed, and were signed off on.

Realize that we are still dealing with problems and questions from Vatican I which were never resolved, particularly with regard to the papacy as viewed in the ecumenical world and also realize that the poor implementaton, the excesses, the egregious affronts to faithful Catholics by many of the far right and the far left have poisoned the well of understanding and must be confronted, refuted and dealt with.

I can honestly say that during my time in working with the ecumenical groups I have never met anyone or had to assent to anything which caused me to lose my faith in my own Church…
The Greek Orthodox, the Russians, the Jews, the Easterns, and many of the Protestants were delightful people, thrilled at an opportunity to dialogue not just with us but with others and want a better understanding of us all. Are there nuts and kooks? You bet - find a goup without them…are there rabid leftists and rightists…you bet and in every group They as one rabbi put it are necessary to every church - because the far left and the far right tell the rest of us where the middle is, and that’s where most of us want to be.
[/quote]


#9

From Catholic World News, giving out our Lords body is supposed to be given only to persons who are in good standing with the church and not in mortal sin. Cardinal Kasper, as in Catholic World News (he is a former Methodist) wants to give it to Non-Catholics, calling it, check out this liberal phrase “Eucharistic Hospitality”. Is that for real???

***Cardinal Kasper backs “Eucharistic hospitality” ***

Vatican , Jun. 18, 2004 (CWNews.com) - Cardinal Walter Kasper (bio - news), the president of the Pontifical Council for Christian Unity, has said that “Eucharistic hospitality” is licit in some circumstances.

Speaking at a major conference of German Catholics in the city of Ulm on June 18, Cardinal Kasper said that “there are circumstances when a non-Catholic can receive Communion at a Catholic Mass.”


#10

CrusaderNY wrote, “Vatican , Jun. 18, 2004 (CWNews.com) - Cardinal Walter Kasper (bio - news), the president of the Pontifical Council for Christian Unity, has said that “Eucharistic hospitality” is licit in some circumstances.”

The President of the Pontifical Council for Christian Unity said , ( my paraphrase) , " It is acceptable, it is to be done and it is alright to hand out the Eucharist to people who should not be recieving it when the spirit moves you"

Some of these illicit people are:

  1. Politicians who vote for ABORTION.
  2. Catholics with known impediments to recieve the Eucharist.( Divorced, criminals Catholics married outside the Church).
  3. Protestants or Muslims who smile a lot.
  4. Intellegent Jews.

#11

[quote=CrusaderNY]Bishop Kasper was a Methodist “convert”, I dont trust him with dealing and negotiating with any of the other religions, it is like having a former Communist negotiate with Russia on arms negotiations
[/quote]

CrusaderNY,

For once I disagree with you. I would have left out the word “former”.


#12

[quote=HagiaSophia]I think there is no danger of that at all
[/quote]

Hi HagiaSophia,

Would you mind reading this encyclical, and telling me what you think?

dailycatholic.org/mortaliu.htm

It deals with a false form of ecumenism, which is precisely what is being practiced today. True ecumenism seeks to convert non-Catholics, and thus bring them into the Catholic Church. False ecumenism, which is what is taking place today, seeks to “unite” with those of other religions without their converting to the Catholic Church.

The former brings other into the Church founded by our Lord, the later brings about a One World Church.

“…the great movement of apostasy being organized in every country for the establishment of a One-World Church which shall have neither dogmas, nor hierarchy, neither discipline for the mind, nor curb for the passions, and which, under the pretext of freedom and human dignity, would bring back to the world (if such a Church could overcome) the reign of legalized cunning and force, and the oppression of the weak, and of all those who toil and suffer.”
Pope Saint Pius X, “Our Apostolic Mandate,” 1910

“I saw many pastors cherishing dangerous ideas against the Church. . . . They built a large, singular, extravagant church which was to embrace all creeds with equal rights: Evangelicals, Catholics, and all denominations, a true communion of the unholy with one shepherd and one flock. There was to be a Pope, a salaried Pope, without possessions. All was made ready, many things finished; but, in place of an altar, were only abomination and desolation. Such was the new church to be, and it was for it that he had set fire to the old one; but God designed otherwise.”
*–from Life and Revelations of Anne Catherine Emmerich, Vol. 2, pp. 352-353 *

“Such attempts can nowise be approved by Catholics, founded as they are on that** false opinion which considers all religions to be more or less good and praiseworthy**, since they all in different ways manifest and signify that sense which is inborn in us all, and by which we are led to God and to the obedient acknowledgment of His rule. Not only are those who hold this opinion in error and deceived, but also in distorting the idea of true religion they reject it, and little by little, turn aside to naturalism and atheism, as it is called; from which it clearly follows that one who supports those who hold these theories and attempt to realize them, is altogether abandoning the divinely revealed religion.” Pope Pius XI, Encyclical Mortalium Animos, par. 2


#13

Vatican , Jun. 18, 2004 (CWNews.com) - Cardinal Walter Kasper (bio - news), the president of the Pontifical Council for Christian Unity, has said that “Eucharistic hospitality” is licit in some circumstances.

Speaking at a major conference of German Catholics in the city of Ulm on June 18, Cardinal Kasper said that “there are circumstances when a non-Catholic can receive Communion at a Catholic Mass.”

As says the both the Pope and Katherine!!


#14

[quote=Exporter] Muslims who smile a lot.
4. Intellegent Jews.
[/quote]

Please cite for me any Jew or Muslim approaching the Eucharist-- Where? When? Who gave it to them?


#15

[quote=HagiaSophia]What It Takes to Help Ecumenism Along
Interview With Father J. Puglisi, Minister General of Franciscans of the Atonement
VATICAN CITY, JAN. 25, 2005 (Zenit.org).- Father James Puglisi, director of Rome’s Pro Unione Center,

**Q: From your particular point of view, why is there still hostility toward ecumenism?

Father Puglisi: The “hostility” that we observe is more like fear. What we are dealing with at this time is a request for systemic change, [a] conversion of churches and their structures including the Catholic Church. **
[/quote]

Can anybody help us understand the Catholic fear of ecumenism? It is unwilling to participate in any of the major bodies created for ecumenical purposes. Although it has been asked many times to join the World Council of Churches it refuses.

Also the Catholic Church declines to participate in the Council of European Churches. This is not only an ecumenical body for inter-Christian dialogue but it is instrumental in preserving the Christianity of Europe in face of the increasing secularisation promoted by the EU.

What are the reasons that the Catholic Church stands aloof from ecumenism? Is it as Fr Puglisi says, fear or is it something else? Just curious.


#16

That is amazing, thank you Siscoe

[quote=RSiscoe]Hi HagiaSophia,

Would you mind reading this encyclical, and telling me what you think?

dailycatholic.org/mortaliu.htm

It deals with a false form of ecumenism, which is precisely what is being practiced today. True ecumenism seeks to convert non-Catholics, and thus bring them into the Catholic Church. False ecumenism, which is what is taking place today, seeks to “unite” with those of other religions without their converting to the Catholic Church.

The former brings other into the Church founded by our Lord, the later brings about a One World Church.

“…the great movement of apostasy being organized in every country for the establishment of a One-World Church which shall have neither dogmas, nor hierarchy, neither discipline for the mind, nor curb for the passions, and which, under the pretext of freedom and human dignity, would bring back to the world (if such a Church could overcome) the reign of legalized cunning and force, and the oppression of the weak, and of all those who toil and suffer.”
Pope Saint Pius X, “Our Apostolic Mandate,” 1910

“I saw many pastors cherishing dangerous ideas against the Church. . . . They built a large, singular, extravagant church which was to embrace all creeds with equal rights: Evangelicals, Catholics, and all denominations, a true communion of the unholy with one shepherd and one flock. There was to be a Pope, a salaried Pope, without possessions. All was made ready, many things finished; but, in place of an altar, were only abomination and desolation. Such was the new church to be, and it was for it that he had set fire to the old one; but God designed otherwise.”
*–from Life and Revelations of Anne Catherine Emmerich, Vol. 2, pp. 352-353 *

“Such attempts can nowise be approved by Catholics, founded as they are on that** false opinion which considers all religions to be more or less good and praiseworthy**, since they all in different ways manifest and signify that sense which is inborn in us all, and by which we are led to God and to the obedient acknowledgment of His rule. Not only are those who hold this opinion in error and deceived, but also in distorting the idea of true religion they reject it, and little by little, turn aside to naturalism and atheism, as it is called; from which it clearly follows that one who supports those who hold these theories and attempt to realize them, is altogether abandoning the divinely revealed religion.” Pope Pius XI, Encyclical Mortalium Animos, par. 2
[/quote]


#17

I trust Pope Pius IX on this before I will trust Cardinal Kasper, if Pope Pius IX encyclical can be thrown out the window by the present day Vatican, then who knows what else is being negotiated behind the lay persons back? It is fear…it is fear of what the church is and what it stands for that we fear, we dont fear the unknown or somebody of a different faith, heck I live in New York and I have and befriend them each day, but I will not sell out my faith, and I dont expect or see them selling out theirs.

Pope Pius IX on Ecumenism in his encyclical:
Let us fervently pray that perhaps, through the grace of God, we may return to the Catholic principle of Pope Pius XI who in his no-nonsense 1928 Encyclical Mortalium Animos,(ON FOSTERING TRUE RELIGIOUS UNITY) left no room for doubt:

“lt seems opportune to expound and refute a certain false opinion on which that complex movement by which non-Catholics seek to bring union of Christian Churches depends. They add that the Church, in itself, or of its nature, is divided into sections, that is to say, that it is made up of several churches or distinct communities, which still remains separate, and although having certain articles of doctrine in common, nevertheless, disagree concerning the remainder; that these all enjoy the same rights; and thus, in their contention, the Church was one and undivided from, at the most, the Apostolic age until the First Ecumenical Council. Controversies, therefore, they say, and longstanding differences of opinion, which have kept asunder till the present day members of the Christian family, must be entirely put aside, and for the remaining doctrines a common form of faith drawn up and proposed for belief, in the profession of which all may not only know but feel that they are brothers… They go on to say that the Roman Catholic Church also has erred, and has corrupted the original religion by adding and proposing for belief certain doctrines , which are not only alien to the Gospel, but repugnant to it… meanwhile, they affirm that they would willingly treat with the Church of Rome, but on equal terms, that is, as equals with an equal… This being so, it is clear that the Apostolic See cannot on any terms take part in their assemblies, nor is it lawful for Catholics to support or to work for such enterprises; for if they do so, they will give countenance to a false Christianity, quite alien to the one Church of Christ… Who, then, can conceive a Christian Federation, the members of which retain each his own opinion and private judgement, in matters which concern the very object of Faith, even though they may be repugnant to the opinion of the rest? …Unity can arise only from one teaching authority, one law of belief, and one faith of Christians… the union of Christians can only be furthered by promoting the return to the true Church of Christ of those who are separated from it, for in the past they have unhappily left it.”

This traditional teaching on Christian unity (ecumenism) was set forth, again, in the Instructio de Motione Oecumenica*(Instruction of the Ecumenical Movement, A.A.S., 31 January 1950)* published by the Holy Office on 20 December 1949, which emphasizes the teaching of Pius XI in his encyclical Mortalium Animos

[quote=Fr Ambrose]Can anybody help us understand the Catholic fear of ecumenism? It is unwilling to participate in any of the major bodies created for ecumenical purposes. Although it has been asked many times to join the World Council of Churches it refuses.

Also the Catholic Church declines to participate in the Council of European Churches. This is not only an ecumenical body for inter-Christian dialogue but it is instrumental in preserving the Christianity of Europe in face of the increasing secularisation promoted by the EU.

What are the reasons that the Catholic Church stands aloof from ecumenism? Is it as Fr Puglisi says, fear or is it something else? Just curious.
[/quote]


#18

Father Ambrose, I do not have an answer from the Vatican, but what I do have is a statement from The World Council of Churches. I can see two items listed there that would make the Roman Catholic Church remain a nonmember.
wcc-coe.org/wcc/who/index-e.html

"What is the World Council of Churches?
The World Council of Churches (WCC) is the broadest and most inclusive among the many organized expressions of the modern ecumenical movement, a movement whose goal is Christian unity.

The WCC brings together more than 340 churches, denominations and church fellowships in over 100 countries and territories throughout the world, representing some 400 million Christians and including most of the world’s Orthodox churches, scores of denominations from such historic traditions of the Protestant Reformation as Anglican, Baptist, Lutheran, Methodist and Reformed, as well as many united and independent churches. While the bulk of the WCC’s founding churches were European and North American, today most are in Africa, Asia, the Caribbean, Latin America, the Middle East and the Pacific.

For its member churches, the WCC is a unique space: one in which they can reflect, speak, act, worship and work together, challenge and support each other, share and debate with each other.

  1. Worship together?
  2. Debate each other?

#19

[quote=Exporter]For its member churches, the WCC is a unique space: one in which they can reflect, speak, act, worship and work together, challenge and support each other, share and debate with each other.

  1. Worship together?

  2. Debate each other?
    [/quote]

  3. After some ghastly incidents when Orthodox delegates were trapped into weird things like having to walk through pagan smoke and listen to a Korean Methodist minister expound on the worship of Kuan Li, and after being beaten up verbally and publically by the Secretary General Reizer because they refuse to give Communion to non-Orthodox or to take it from non-Orthodox, the Orthodox all got together at a meeting in Thessalonica and laid down guidelines for their participation. Basically they will attend the worship of other Churches at WCC meetings but with no participation - which is what they have done all along anyway.

  4. Debate together? Well, why not. How else will the Western Christians learn of the Orthodox faith and its claims and its self-understanding? The Orthodox signed up with the WCC from its inception for just this reason - to acquaint the other member Churches of a tradition of which most of them are unaware - or were unaware, back in those days of the early 20th century.


#20

[quote=HagiaSophia]Please cite for me any Jew or Muslim approaching the Eucharist-- Where? When? Who gave it to them?
[/quote]

Still waiting…


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