The Gospel at the Tridentine Mass

I have worshiped at two Tridentine Masses. Both were a Missa Canta, the Epistle was murmered like usual, but the Gospel was Chanted so that everyone could hear it, is this the norm???

Yes. Also, in many parishes, the Gospel is repeated in english before the sermon.

I don’t know about other places but our priest reads the Epistle in English and after the Sequentia sancti Evangelii secundum… he moves to the lectern and reads the Gospel using the microphone.

[quote=Eileen T]I don’t know about other places but our priest reads the Epistle in English and after the Sequentia sancti Evangelii secundum… he moves to the lectern and reads the Gospel using the microphone.
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Interesting how liturgical abuses don’t only belong to the Novus Ordo.

The priest should read the Epistle in Latin, not any other language. After this, the Gradual and Tract/Alleluia are sung, during which the missal is moved to the gospel side of the altar, where the gospel is read/sung in Latin. At the beginning of the homily, a good many priests will generally read the gospel in English and sometimes the Epistle as well, but this up to the priest and is considered part of the homily.

Adam

[quote=NetNuncio]Interesting how liturgical abuses don’t only belong to the Novus Ordo.
[/quote]

Indeed.

Note that I am a full supporter of the Tridentine Mass and I understand that such abuses are very minimal and are dwarfed by some of the unthinkable, almost desecratory acts in Novus Ordo parishes.

Both were read in Latin, but the Epistle was murmured, the Gospel was chanted. Yes the Preist would re-read them in English at the beginning of the Homily. I have this smart allac in my RCIA class who likes to take any stab he can at the Tridentine Mass. Tonight I am teaching about the mass so I want to make sure I don’t give this guy any avenues to get up on a soap box. Yes, I admit the Tridentine Mass is not perfect, but so is the Novus Ordo. And that is the message I want to get across, I want my students to have an even critique so they can draw their own conclusions. This guy seems to think I’m dumb for prefering the older liturgy, when I talk about the liturgy with him, he always finds a way to take a stab. Some of it is very dumb such as saying having the Sequence chanted before the gradual/Gospel acclimation (the way it is done in the N.O.) is better then having it chanted after the gradual (as it is done in the Tridentine Mass.) COME ON HERE!

I am also going to mention the Eastern Liturgies, at the end I am going to encourage my students to experience on of the other Liturgies of the Church (Tridentine or Eastern).

[quote=NetNuncio]Interesting how liturgical abuses don’t only belong to the Novus Ordo.

The priest should read the Epistle in Latin, not any other language. After this, the Gradual and Tract/Alleluia are sung, during which the missal is moved to the gospel side of the altar, where the gospel is read/sung in Latin. At the beginning of the homily, a good many priests will generally read the gospel in English and sometimes the Epistle as well, but this up to the priest and is considered part of the homily.

Adam
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This isn’t a Tridentine abuse for this is common in Europe now and before Vatican II. I encountered the Epistle and Gospel in the vernacular at an FSSP Mass in Europe. I personally liked it and thought it was an abuse but after I asked the MC of the Mass about it, he said it was normal in those parts to do that.

[quote=Polvskoy]This isn’t a Tridentine abuse for this is common in Europe now and before Vatican II. I encountered the Epistle and Gospel in the vernacular at an FSSP Mass in Europe. I personally liked it and thought it was an abuse but after I asked the MC of the Mass about it, he said it was normal in those parts to do that.
[/quote]

Were the readings at the altar or the pulpit? If it was at the altar then wouldn’t it almost guaranteed be an abuse, however common?

Properly speaking, at a Sung Mass the epistle should also be chanted in Latin.

If the Epistle was being ‘murmured’ it most likely means you have a Reader or Sub-deacon who is not all that familiar with Latin.

[quote=pm1853]Were the readings at the altar or the pulpit? If it was at the altar then wouldn’t it almost guaranteed be an abuse, however common?
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Yes, it was from the altar, facing the people for the readings.
No, it was allowed before the Council to do this and was quite common in France and Germany, especially.

It IS NOT CALLED THE Tridentine Mass IT IS CALLED THE TRADITIONAL LATIN MASS!!!

The council of Trent only codified the EXISTING liturgy!!!

**geez **

[quote=OrthoCath]It IS NOT CALLED THE Tridentine Mass IT IS CALLED THE TRADITIONAL LATIN MASS!!!

The council of Trent only codified the EXISTING liturgy!!!

**geez **
[/quote]

Officially it is called neither, so relax. Either name is acceptable for this type of forum.

The last gospel was appended as part of the Tridentine missal.

At the indult Tridentine Mass here in Phoenix, AZ, the Epistle and Gospel are read in Latin at the altar.

When the priest reaches the podium to give his homily, he reads both the Epistle and Gospel again in English and then delivers the homily.

I fail to see how this could be an abuse as he is essentially incorporating the Scripture into his homily.

I usually read the Scripture in the missal while he is reading it in Latin. I then just listen when he reads it again in English. The practice is very beneficial.

I went to the Tridentine Missa Canta yesterday, and the same priest was celebrating. When it came time for the Epistle he said the first few words audibly and then they were reduced to an inaudible murmur. Is this normal for the epistle? I know it is for the Last Gospel, but I see some people here say that the epistle is read audibly, what is the official stance?

[quote=OrthoCath]It IS NOT CALLED THE Tridentine Mass IT IS CALLED THE TRADITIONAL LATIN MASS!!!

The council of Trent only codified the EXISTING liturgy!!!

**geez **
[/quote]

Wow … a little hot under the collar. Isn’t it funny … that even this correction is not correct.

[quote=Psalm45:9]I went to the Tridentine Missa Canta yesterday, and the same priest was celebrating. When it came time for the Epistle he said the first few words audibly and then they were reduced to an inaudible murmur. Is this normal for the epistle? I know it is for the Last Gospel, but I see some people here say that the epistle is read audibly, what is the official stance?
[/quote]

At a Missa Cantata it is preferably chanted according to the epistle tone or it can be read but always audibly.

There is no “official stance.” The rubrical ideal is to read the epistle and gospel aloud in Latin at a Low Mass. They should be chanted in Latin at a Sung Mass and at a Solemn Mass they are chanted by the subdeacon and deacon, respectively. Reading them in the vernacular afterward is at the discretion of the celebrant.

However, in days of yesteryear and at indult Masses today, it does not always happen that way. The arrangement that you describe (epistle in a low voice, followed by gospel aloud) is fairly common. Another practice from yesteryear that is still observed in some places is the readings being read in a low voice by the priest, while they are concurrently read aloud by a lector in English. This is my least favorite arrangement, but all of the above are permitted by the pontifical commission Ecclesia Dei, which oversees application of the indult.

[quote=Chatter163]Another practice from yesteryear that is still observed in some places is the readings being read in a low voice by the priest, while they are concurrently read aloud by a lector in English. This is my least favorite arrangement, but all of the above are permitted by the pontifical commission Ecclesia Dei, which oversees application of the indult.
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Yes, the doesn’t sound very good to me either. This priest re-reads the lectionary in English at the pulpit before he begins his homily. However, if I’m not mistaken, when I first attended a Tridentine Missa Canta two years ago; it was celebrated by the same priest. But that time he chanted both the Epistle and Gosple. The last two Masses I’ve been two he reads the epistle as I have described and then he chants the gospel. It makes me wonder about what brought about this change in him?

I have observed that some priests who are not musically inclined are at times intimidated by singing the readings in Latin. Over time they tend to resort to these other sorts of arrangements. :frowning:

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