The Last Thread Ever Needed On Mormonism


#1

Due to the volumous amount of threads about Mormons and the Mormon religion, I thought it might save some time for those of us who are constantly fighting the fight against the lies of the Mormon church to just put up the end-all-be-all thread and be done with the topic, or at least have something to quick-reference for when the Same Song Second Verse posts appears on these boards.

Typical Thread on Mormonism

Non-LDS person:

I don't understand [weird and untrue] doctrine of LDS church. Can someone explain it to me?

"Kind" LDS Person:

There's a very logical and doctrinally sound explanation for that. [Presents explanation]

Ex-Mormon Catholic:

Okay, that is totally not true/ only part of the story/ a complete lie. This is why. [Presents explanation]

"Kind" LDS Person:

Oh, but you didn't take into account [some pro-LDS doctrine or website or theory]

A different Ex-Mormon Catholic:

Yes we did, and [Presents explanation of why that is completely false]

http://dansideas.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/beat-a-dead-horse.jpg?w=500

There's probably a topic about any Catholic/Mormon topic that you could think of asking, just do a quick search.

For Catholics/non-Mormons:

Mormons will say that they "prayed about it" and got a "burning of the bosom" and this is how they know that the Book of Mormon is true. Mormons will then ask you pray about it and let you make the choice for yourself.

This is a lie. Do not believe it.

This is the beginning of what is called the "Double Bind", an argument style that is used frequently by members of the Mormon faith. It goes something like this: In the Book of Mormon, it says to pray to get an answer on its truthfulness. If you get an answer, than it's true. If you don't get an answer, well, that's a problem with you and it's your fault. It will eventually get to this point: If you believe with out questioning, then you have faith. If you question and begin to have doubts, then you are at fault because you allowed Satan to influence your belief. This will mess with your mind, as any ex-Mormon on this board will attest to. If you allow yourself to be sucked inot the lies, you will end up fighting this battle in your head years after you leave the church. Trust me on this.

Mormons will deny certain historical facts about their religious heritage.

This is a lie. Do not believe it.

The historical facts can easily be found with a Google search about such things as the early leaders of the church being an unapologetic racists, the Masonic origins of the LDS temple ceremonies, and the complete disproval of the Book of Abraham "Translations".

Long story short, it doesn't matter what you believe about the Catholic Church, it doesn't change the fact that the LDS church is based on the lies of Joseph Smith and perpetuated to this day by the leadership of the church.

For Mormons:

You say, read the Book of Mormon, and pray about it and get an answer. I make you this challenge. Walk into any Catholic church. Find the tabernacle (the gold box with a red candle next to it). This is where the Blessed Sacrament resides between Masses. Go to a pew in front of the tabernacle, kneel on the kneeler, and pray. It doesn't matter what you pray. Just pray.

You will probably not be bowled over by any "burning of the bosom" experience that you may have had as a Mormon. But you might. You might not feel anything at all. You might be very nervous just being around the crucifixes and other foreign religious objects. That's okay, and normal. But just pray. If you need help to pray, bring your Bible, and read in the Gospels. I highly recommend meditating on Luke 22. Sit there, for 10, 15, 30 minutes, in the peacefulness, and ponder the words of God. Even if you don't believe that He's really there in the tabernacle, ponder on His words in your heart as Mary did during her life. Just medidate on who and what God really is, and how He resides in you. Think about being His creations, and His love for you. Spending this time simply keeping God company and letting Him love you will bring you many graces.

And think about how the pain he suffered on the Cross was because He loves you. Because He does. He loves you and wants very much to be united to you in your heart. He wants nothing more to spend Eternity loving you, and for you to be loving Him for eternity. He wants you to strive to do everything you do for love of Him. Can you imagine the freedom, the joy, of living solely for Love? You open that door for love of God, you drive your car for love of God, or as Brother Lawrence famously said, you flip your little omelette in the pan for love of God. Truly loving God is doing for Him what you used to do only for yourself. When you do all for love of God, fear is replaced with peace, anxiety is replaced with confidence, pride is replaced with humility. St. Augustine also said "My heart is restless, Lord, until it rests in Thee."

I pray every day for members of the LDS church to receive the grace to see God as He really is, not as Joseph Smith made him to be. While I may not always have peace and quiet, I finally have that peace of resting in God. I pray that you can find that peace, and be happy in this life and the next.

Consolatrix afflictorum, Ora pro nobis.


#2

I'm gonna take you up on this.

:D


#3

Very good, though I still think there can be value in some of the threads on Mormonism.

For example, I started one in which I asked about LDS forms of communal worship, both on Sundays and in their Temples. The answers followed the same basic pattern, but I learned a lot from both the LDS and ex-LDS posters, who seemed to ultimately disagree on very little factual information, though of course they differed in tone and in their interpretation of whether the practices were good and authentic or not.


#4

Reminds me of Sorcery, I can't stand them,
I feel like I'm going to get hit by lightening
if I continue talking with them.

I don't carry a book of good arguments,
and these 2 guys approach you and debate
with you when you are unprepared, it's not fair.

I don't care how much they preach to me,
I'm not leaving Catholicism, once I just walked
off on two cause they would not shut up.
They were a bit pushy too.


#5

A pretty simplistic approach. Sadly, as long as LDS post stuff, we will respond. The truth must be told. A cookie cutter thread will not fix the problems.


#6

Catholic_Prime:

Formatting a post
In what appears to be a style
Like a short poem

Brings tranquility
To what could be a stressful post
And mired responses.

I propose a rule.
Anyone respondng to
A Mormon themed thread

Must share responses
Only in Haiku verses
Five - Seven - Five style.

Writing Haiku style
Forces the mind to slow down
As well as keystrokes.


#7

I can't agree to post that way
No matter what you do or say
We struggle hard to fight the fight
Because we know that we are right

I know that we are sometimes scoffed at
by those who follow a false prophet
But I believe if we fight and pray
Some will soon be in RCIA


#8

:rotfl:


#9

Come on. This is grossly inappropriate and wholly uncharitable. You are welcome to respectfully disagree with members of the LDS faith, but calling them liars is uncalled for and I honestly expected more.:tsktsk:


#10

[quote="Conor7, post:9, topic:284552"]
Come on. This is grossly inappropriate and wholly uncharitable. You are welcome to respectfully disagree with members of the LDS faith, but calling them liars is uncalled for and I honestly expected more.:tsktsk:

[/quote]

But the truth is that the leaders of the Mormon church are liars. There were no people on the American continent that descended from Jews and lived here for years. The temple ceremonies in the LDS church were not dictated by God but liberally borrowed from the Masons. God did not appear to Joseph Smith as a "Perfected" man standing next to his son, who the Mormon church teaches is our brother. All of these things are lies, and all of these things are foundations of this religion.

My goal is not to be charitable to Mormons (and I also doubt it it the goal of the ex-Mormons who continue the good fight), although I do pray for Mormons every day. My intention is to make sure that not one soul is lost by the misinformation presented as truth by Mormons who frequent this board. Period. We [ex-Mo Catholics] know that the Catholic Church is the church of God, and we also know how easily it is to be deceived by the culture and the recruiting techniques of the Mormon church.

It can be an occasion of scandal when an LDS person says "I find Family Home Evening to be enriching and a worthy practice" or "I love how my family will be forever through the ceremonies of the Temple" or "I went to the Temple tonight and it was so beautiful." These things can tempt unknowing Catholics to research more into the religion and even to believe what is being taught as truth by the Mormon church. My heart breaks every time I hear that someone is converting, for I know their road and it is not going to be an easy one.

We ex-Mormons cannot gain back the time wasted on temple work and Institute classes and roadshows and all those other activities that were distinctly Mormon, what we can do is pray and work effortlessly to make sure that no Catholic on these boards falls into the wickedness and snares of the devil under the guises of the Mormon church.

This is not a matter of not being "ecumenical". This is a matter of saving souls.


#11

[quote="HonoraDominum, post:10, topic:284552"]

We ex-Mormons cannot gain back the time wasted on temple work and Institute classes and roadshows

[/quote]

Roadshows weren't a waste of time. :D

I was out, long before I could get involved in wasting my time of temple work and institute classes.

Atheism is the fruit of Mormonism. So many who leave it, including myself, became/become so burned out on lies being presented as truth, that it's just easier to say, "to hell with it all". How can you know what is true and what is false when you were so sure before, and then come to discover how gullible and duped you are?

If the lies are exposed up front, then hopefully a person won't spend their life, or a large portion of it, immersed, only to have the house of cards fall. To be left standing there wondering how a just and loving God could ever let this happen.


#12

This is why I like the Catholic Church. If I ask a question, I'm not going to get different answers.


#13

I caught an EWTN show with Fr Pacwa some time ago. And this topic came up through an E-Mail.

I still see him in my mind stating "There were no Horse's in North America in the period Joe Smith describes". :shrug::D Course he went on to futher elaborate. That snap-shot in my mind of the good Father has remained.

The Archaeological evidence pretty much deflates the Mormon arguement for me. From here I see no sense in entertaining the Scriptual debate. :shrug: It just further declines in factual deterioration.

However, this "is" the fastest growing religion in the USA with Islam close behind. Unfortunate as it I do believe we will have to continue these dialogues, as futile as they as they often seem. Someone see's the truth, somewhere. Who? I do not know.

Peace


#14

Not dissimilar to how ex-Baptists are treated:

Non-Baptist person:
I don't understand the doctrine of Baptist church. Can someone explain it to me? Are they really anti-Catholic?

"Kind" Baptist Person:
No. they are not anti-Catholic.

Ex-Baptist Catholic:
Ah...yes they are, here is my experience.......

"Kind" Baptist Person:
You must have been in a radical group, most Baptists believe.......

A different Ex-Baptist Catholic:
I have been in several Baptist churches, and they preach.....

"Kind" Baptist Person:
You could not have possibly have been in a Baptist church....Baptists believe (doctrines of butterflies and ponies :cool:)

First Ex-Baptist Catholic:
Are you saying we are liars or were hallucinating?

"Kind" Baptist Person:
You sound pretty bitter, maybe you had a bad experience......


#15

That is exactly how that thread started and ended....JustaServant. I remember it. I was one of the ex-non-bitter-Baptists. :D

Over the years I've been friends with a number of Mormans.
1. One didn't believe a thing the church teaches but wouldn't leave b/c that's all she knew, they showed her a lot of love and she didn't want to be shunned by her family.

  1. Another became an alcoholic atheist. She was very bitter and hated the LDS.

  2. There are 2 LDS families in my life. One from my professional side and one from my personal. There are 9 children between the two. I feel for the children b/c they are going to believe what they were taught growing up. The adults should be able to look at the evidence and see the truth.

I wish this could be the last thread needed. I'd rather see thread after thread if it keeps one person from becoming LDS or it encourages one LDS member to leave and come to Truth.


#16

[quote="maltmom, post:15, topic:284552"]
That is exactly how that thread started and ended....JustaServant. I remember it. I was one of the ex-non-bitter-Baptists. :D

Over the years I've been friends with a number of Mormans.
1. One didn't believe a thing the church teaches but wouldn't leave b/c that's all she knew, they showed her a lot of love and she didn't want to be shunned by her family.

  1. Another became an alcoholic atheist. She was very bitter and hated the LDS.

  2. There are 2 LDS families in my life. One from my professional side and one from my personal. There are 9 children between the two. I feel for the children b/c they are going to believe what they were taught growing up. The adults should be able to look at the evidence and see the truth.

I wish this could be the last thread needed. I'd rather see thread after thread if it keeps one person from becoming LDS or it encourages one LDS member to leave and come to Truth.

[/quote]

I guess my point is that it is the same in any extreme fundamentalist type religion. They will try to re-write the history and teaching of the group and if the formers expose the truth they are "bitter" or 'misinformed' or impied to be outright liars.


#17

At least the number of Mormon-related threads on the first page has decreased markedly.

I think that to preserve faith for those poor deluded creatures, the best approach is to demonstrate to them that the LDS church is in apostasy from the best of the BoM, and that the best of the BoM was plagiarized from the Bibe, and truly Christian writers (like Shakespeare and Clavigero). Too many, who were born into that faith, become atheists or agnostics when they exit.


#18

[quote="Eric_Hilbert, post:2, topic:284552"]
I'm gonna take you up on this.

:D

[/quote]

Eric, no please no. :D


#19

There are a lot of unfair and rather hurtful statements on this thread. I don’t know what to say…


#20

[quote="Conor7, post:9, topic:284552"]
Come on. This is grossly inappropriate and wholly uncharitable. You are welcome to respectfully disagree with members of the LDS faith, but calling them liars is uncalled for and I honestly expected more.:tsktsk:

[/quote]

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D true that !


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