The National Association of American Lay Catholics says Bishops did NOT Condemn Ryan Budget


#1

The National Association of American Lay Catholics says Bishops did not condemn Ryan Budget.

"There is a very serious untruth being repeated that the “Ryan Budget” has been condemned as immoral, etc. by the Catholic Bishops aka the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops (USCCB), or even the Catholic Church itself. It was not."

laycatholics.org/2012/08/16/c…aul-ii-letter/

God bless.

-Paul


#2

This needed to be cleared up once and for all. Thanks:thumbsup:


#3

It’s an egregious lie, being spread by entities that carry water for Mr. Obama and want to lead Catholic’s astray in hopes that they will re-elect Mr. Obama in November.

It is absolutely outrageous, and every Catholic should be aware of it.

God bless.

-Paul


#4

Link seems to be broken. Here's one that I found has worked:

laycatholics.org/2012/08/16/catholic-bishops-did-not-condemn-the-ryan-budget-see-canon-law-and-john-paul-ii-letter/


#5

[quote="Suudy, post:4, topic:295471"]
Link seems to be broken. Here's one that I found has worked:

laycatholics.org/2012/08/16/catholic-bishops-did-not-condemn-the-ryan-budget-see-canon-law-and-john-paul-ii-letter/

[/quote]

Hmm...interesting. Thanks for fixing that, I'm not sure what happened. It worked when I first put it up! But thanks!

God bless.

-Paul


#6

There is a myth going around that it was criticised by the USSCB as if it was all the Bishops, it was 2 bishops


#7

[quote="PJD1987, post:1, topic:295471"]
The National Association of American Lay Catholics says Bishops did not condemn Ryan Budget.

"There is a very serious untruth being repeated that the “Ryan Budget” has been condemned as immoral, etc. by the Catholic Bishops aka the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops (USCCB), or even the Catholic Church itself. It was not."

laycatholics.org/2012/08/16/c...aul-ii-letter/

God bless.

-Paul

[/quote]

Ryan’s bishop has come out with a strong defense of Ryan’s Catholic faith. Odd :D that the Georgetown faculty condemned Ryan but welcomed Sebelius, whose own standing as a Catholic is very much in doubt. Maybe the same applies to the Georgetown faculty members who in effect accuse of Ryan of pushing granny over a cliff.


#8

I see two issues:

1) Did the press misrepresent the USCCB in its portrayal of the Ryan project?

2) Is the Ryan Plan a plan that takes into consideration a Catholic perspective about caring for the poor?

I am not entering the debate except to say that question 2 is the question each Catholic should take to prayer before they enter the voting booth. A "yes" answer to question 1 shows 1) either side will use any source to promote their agenda, and 2) the popular press is woefully ignorant of how religious institutions work.


#9

[quote="coachdennis, post:8, topic:295471"]
I see two issues:

1) Did the press misrepresent the USCCB in its portrayal of the Ryan project?

2) Is the Ryan Plan a plan that takes into consideration a Catholic perspective about caring for the poor?

I am not entering the debate except to say that question 2 is the question each Catholic should take to prayer before they enter the voting booth. A "yes" answer to question 1 shows 1) either side will use any source to promote their agenda, and 2) the popular press is woefully ignorant of how religious institutions work.

[/quote]

I would just caution using the Ryan-Wyden Budget as a salient issue to make your choice on in November.

First of all, Mr. Romney will implement his budget, that may borrow from the Ryan-Wyden Plan, but will not be identical.

Secondly, the most important issue, by far is the right to life. A Catholic cannot vote for a pro-abortion candidate, but I digress. Just a reminder. :D

God bless.

-Paul


#10

[quote="_Abyssinia, post:6, topic:295471"]
There is a myth going around that it was criticised by the USSCB as if it was all the Bishops, it was 2 bishops

[/quote]

Just two? The National Association of American Lay Catholics says:

Where did this supposed condemnation come from? It came from a USCCB committee that has no authority (see why below) to carry out authentic acts in the Catholic Church and has been exaggerated by entities outside of the USCCB. This USCCB committee is called the Committee on Domestic Justice and Human Development.

Link

Now they also say this committee has no authority but it is interesting to note its member are:

Most Reverend Stephen E. Blaire
Chairman
Bishop of Stockton

Most Reverend William F. Murphy
Bishop of Rockville Centre

Most Reverend Gregory M. Aymond
Archbishop of New Orleans

Most Reverend Ricardo Ramìrez, CSB
Bishop of Las Cruces

Most Reverend Robert W. McElroy
Auxiliary Bishop of San Francisco

Most Reverend Jaime Soto
Bishop of Sacramento

Most Reverend Gustavo Garcia-Siller, MSpS
Archbishop of San Antonio

Most Reverend David A. Zubik
Bishop of Pittsburgh

Most Reverend Martin D. Holley
Auxiliary Bishop of Washington

Most Reverend Howard J. Hubbard
Ex-Officio Bishop of Albany


#11

[quote="K-McD, post:10, topic:295471"]
Just two? The National Association of American Lay Catholics says:

Link

Now they also say this committee has no authority but it is interesting to note its member are:

Most Reverend Stephen E. Blaire
Chairman
Bishop of Stockton

Most Reverend William F. Murphy
Bishop of Rockville Centre

Most Reverend Gregory M. Aymond
Archbishop of New Orleans

Most Reverend Ricardo Ramìrez, CSB
Bishop of Las Cruces

Most Reverend Robert W. McElroy
Auxiliary Bishop of San Francisco

Most Reverend Jaime Soto
Bishop of Sacramento

Most Reverend Gustavo Garcia-Siller, MSpS
Archbishop of San Antonio

Most Reverend David A. Zubik
Bishop of Pittsburgh

Most Reverend Martin D. Holley
Auxiliary Bishop of Washington

Most Reverend Howard J. Hubbard
Ex-Officio Bishop of Albany

[/quote]

Where are those names from? Letter criticising the budget is signed by Bishop Blaire and Bishop Pates

usccb.org/issues-and-action/human-life-and-dignity/federal-budget/upload/Letter-to-Congress-Federal-Budget-2012-03-06.pdf


#12

[quote="_Abyssinia, post:11, topic:295471"]
Where are those names from? Letter criticising the budget is signed by** Bishop Blaire** and Bishop Pates

usccb.org/issues-and-action/human-life-and-dignity/federal-budget/upload/Letter-to-Congress-Federal-Budget-2012-03-06.pdf

[/quote]

I am deeply embarrassed, I am very sorry to say. :(


#13

[quote="Luigi_Daniele, post:12, topic:295471"]
I am deeply embarrassed, I am very sorry to say. :(

[/quote]

Nothing to be embarrassed about. Where is that list from?


#14

[quote="_Abyssinia, post:13, topic:295471"]
Nothing to be embarrassed about. Where is that list from?

[/quote]

I think it's just a list from the USCCB of who sits on the board. Not a list of who signed the letter...as you've shown.

God bless.

-Paul

EDIT: However, I'm not sure if the point may be that Bishop Blaire's signature holds the weight of every Bishop that sits on that board and thus every Bishop on the board presumably approved of the letter.:confused:


#15

[quote="PJD1987, post:14, topic:295471"]
I think it's just a list from the USCCB of who sits on the board. Not a list of who signed the letter...as you've shown.

God bless.

-Paul

[/quote]

No worries


#16

[quote="_Abyssinia, post:15, topic:295471"]
No worries

[/quote]

I'm not worried :) I'm just trying to ascertain the point of the poster providing us with the names of those who sit on board, aside from pointing out that it creates confusion to the faithful.

God bless.

-Paul


#17

The letter from the USCCB is available at:

usccb.org/issues-and-action/human-life-and-dignity/agriculture-nutrition-rural-issues/upload/Letter-to-House-Committee-on-Agriculture-2012-04-16.pdf

More information on the U.S. bishops stance on the federal budget can be found on the USCCB website at:

usccb.org/issues-and-action/human-life-and-dignity/federal-budget/

The above-mentioned letter reflects not the opinion of one bishop or of one committee, but is written on behalf of the USCCB.


#18

Bishop criticizes USCCB committee’s reaction to Ryan budget

“There have been some concerns raised by lay Catholics, especially some Catholic economists, about what was perceived as a partisan action against Congressman Ryan and the budget

he had proposed,” Bishop Boyea said in reference to the USCCB committee’s opposition to the House budget plan. “We need to be articulate only in principles, and let the laity make these applications … It was perceived as partisan, and thus didn’t really further dialogue in our deeply divided country.”
“I’m not sure that we have the humility yet not to stray into areas where we lack competence, and where we need to let the laity take the lead,” he added. “We need to learn far more than we need to teach in this area. We need to listen more than we need to speak. We already have an excellent, fine Compendium [on the Social Doctrine of the Church].”
...
Echoing Bishop Boyea’s comments, Archbishop Joseph Naumann of Kansas City said that the committee is “at times perceived as partisan” and needs to consider the principle of subsidiarity, which has been “neglected in past documents.” Archbishop Naumann added that solutions that place emphasis in enrolling people in government programs have been “tried for decades” and failed.

“We need to talk about the debt and the real seriousness of that debt,” he continued. “Sometimes we’re perceived as just encouraging the government to spend more money with no realistic way of how we’re going to afford to do this.”

catholicculture.org/news/headlines/index.cfm?storyid=14639


#19

[quote="Alan55, post:17, topic:295471"]
More information on the U.S. bishops stance on the federal budget can be found on the USCCB website at:

usccb.org/issues-and-action/human-life-and-dignity/federal-budget/

The above-mentioned letter reflects not the opinion of one bishop or of one committee, but is written on behalf of the USCCB.

[/quote]

What the page says, and what the bishops in unity represent is, this:

The Catholic bishops of the United States stand ready to work with leaders of both parties for a budget that reduces future deficits, protects poor and vulnerable people, advances the common good, and promotes human life and dignity.

Additionally, the bishops assert the necessity of discerning whether particular budgets will or will not jeopardize the survival of "the most poor and vulnerable." The USCCB, like the rest of the hierarchy and the Pope, does not stand for or against a particular party as a party, a particular politician, or particular proposals. And the bishops have also stated from time to time that irresponsible federal spending also threatens the welfare of the most poor and vulnerable; the bishops have reinforced the need for balance in budget decision-making, precisely because of the future stability of the most vulnerable in the population.

(Just a fact-check. I'm sure you don't mind. ;))


#20

Even IF the USCCB HAD condemned Mr. Ryan's proposed budget,
it would mean really nothing binding,
because the USCCB has NO CANONICAL AUTHORITY on matters of Doctrine or morals or politics (unless they are repeating statements 100% in harmony with the teachings of the Magisterium).

I.e,. the USCCB is NOT the Magisterium,
and very often, "documents" issued by the USCCB are not even written BY
the Bishops themselves, but by "spokespersons" (usually un-named, interesting).

It is also a fact that many people who WORKED FOR the USCCB
in the 2000s, LEFT the USCCB and formed organizations of catholics supposedly
to promote the "common good." These people, interestingly, are NOW MEMBERS
of the current administration (pro-abort and pro-gay-marriage, is this the common good?)
and some of them, the ones who helped FOUND these "common good" catholic
alliances and organizations, lo and behold, have made blaspehemous remarks
such as that gay marriage comes from God and/or revealed that they themselves are
proAbortion. SURPRISE !! Catholic voters in 2008 and 2010 got screwed-over by
these "Catholic" organizations founded by people whose views demonstrate them to be heretics and apostates and their goal was always, always, always to trick Catholics into voting for their proAbortion, pro other Sins, agenda. That was the purpose of founding these "catholic" alliances (allegedly for) "the common good."
PLEASE, Catholics, do NOT be fooled by these wicked people anymore,
no matter what they call their new group,
no matter how much they appeal to "social justice"
no matter HOW stylishly they dress and coiff their hair,
no matter HOW BEAUTIFULLY they apply their expensive MAC makeup
no matter HOW "erudite" they sound at the "Press Conferences"
announcing their founding of their new groups
to promote the common good (sic) and fight "the politics of division."
It's a LIE, and it was ALWAYS a lie, a huge lie, by willful Liars
out to deceive a huge chunk of the Catholic Voting bloc,
which deception in 2008 and 2010 they successfully achieved,
and are GOING TO TRY TO successfully achieve AGAIN this year.
Watch out. They're coming. And just in time for the elections.


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