The Power of Music

Lol, I answered this post first because I work right across the street from there!

Unfortunately, daily Mass is during my work hours. I have been wrestling for a year or so with whether or not to make the journey on Sunday.

Thank you for the detective work!

If somebody is thinking of leaving the Church, I doubt the music is the deciding factor, in either direction.

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You are very lucky not to have seen that look on the face of a 12-year-Catholic educated college student.

I call the look I refer to the “Catholics believe what?” look. It’s very polite. I felt it on my face when I was a 32-year-old questioner in RCIA. I’ve seen it on the faces of non-Catholics (friends and strangers alike) when we have an honest dialogue.

I understand and am prepared for those times.

Because, as you note, it seems unbelievable that a 12-year-Catholic-educated college student would have that look (it is similar, also, to what’s called a moment of clarity), it is extremely sad, truly heartbreaking to witness it.

I’m sorry if it sounded like I was contending that they’ve never heard the words. When we share that moment, they have slowly said something like, “Oh, yeah…” and then will quizzically quote part of a creed or the Mass or a song.

It makes me sad in general. It makes me sadder for those specific lambs because they are very kind to this down-on-her-luck old broad despite the fact that their lives are full of anxiety and temptation.

I get to spend time with them now. But for them, I will mostly be a shawdowy memory of an old fogey which kind of makes them feel guilty. I can live with that. I pray it is one of the things (like the creed, the Mass, the songs) which bring them home.

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Yes, thank you! It is probably the #1 parable that I love, that I need, that gives me hope!

The decades since my conversion have been a messy struggle of trying to figure out whether or not something is God’s will or my desire/pride.

One of the gifts of being Catholic is having rubrics. Rubrics help remove preference. I can let go of what I like best or what I sing best and be one with the faithful, spending an hour sacrificing our egos to God. If I let go long enough, I might even grow to love the proscribed rubric. It’s always really cool when obedience and emotion come together. It doesn’t happen often for me.

Unfortunately, I’ve gotta go to work now - so it will be awhile before I can reply to all the points you and other posters have brought forth.

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Ummm…sounds a bit like pride to me.
If you have the brainpower to understand Catholicism then that’s great. Use your gift to help others in some way. Not to feel depressed or look down on those who haven’t reached your level of knowledge.

Plus I seriously doubt that you have compared knowledge with every cradle Catholic out there. There’s probably a good many who know as much or more than you but are quiet about it.

I also question whether the statements you make about “your whole diocese” really pertain to every church in your diocese. Have you been to Mass at every one of them?

I’m sorry, but these type of threads just strike me as a “complain, complain, complain.” And I’m tempted to respond with "Be glad you have Masses available to attend with Jesus at them, which is sort of the Catholic equivalent to “The starving children in Armenia would be glad to have those brussels sprouts, so eat them already.”

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Also, a general question: Why do you, and other people, start these kinds of threads? What are you hoping to gain? A lot of us who are happy in our Catholicism just roll our eyes. Those who, like you, hate contemporary Mass music will join in raving and hating on Marty Haugen. At the end of the day we have the 100000th thread from somebody complaining and it has done nothing productive for the Church except maybe made a few people feel all self-righteous.

What is the point? It’s not providing any new insights. It’s not constructive. It’s just more First World Catholic Problems.

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Ten likes, Tis.

Exactly As De Phil would say “you’re really proud of how you turned out, aren’t you”

Agreed.

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Welcome to the church. Sounds like you have a lot of work to do. When God puts issues like what you outlined on our hearts, we have to pray and find out what the Lord wants us to do. I thank you for your note but you work needs to be in your parish. Also, please see what you can do to lead those lifeguards back to Our Lord. :thinking:

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Well, why do you bother to read and respond? She wants to discuss, gain insight. All you want to do is squelch conversation and discussion. Why not just “let it go” if it bothers you?

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Also, I don’t think the OP said she knows more than ALL cradle Catholics. More like the sampling of cradle Catholics that she knows, through work etc. Why do you have to tear down her experience? She knows the conversations see she has had, no one else here does. If she has been in the Church for decades, it’s possible that she knows a lot more than many many cradle Catholics.

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People who love authentic Catholic church music might enjoy visiting www.musicasacra.com. These people are experts and know their stuff! The forum is super fun and informative. https://forum.musicasacra.com/forum/

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What a novel approach, Bear! :smirk:

Because I thought this poster might actually respond, rather than just take offense as you yourself have done and as most others do. The poster invited debate, even negative debate. She has previously written apologetics for CA, I believe (based on earlier threads she posted) so I thought she might provide me with some insight, which you unfortunately have not done. Bye now.

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Speaking as a cradle Catholic who spent 12+ years in Catholic schools and fell away from the faith for a number of years, I feel extremely blessed that God and the Church welcomed me back without judgment. I wept with my priest at my first confession in 20 years. And he lovingly told me that Christ was rejoicing at my return.

I understand getting irritated with fellow humans and fellow Catholics. I often find myself getting irritated with converts who believe they know the entirety of the faith after a handful of years and capitalize on it by selling books and speaking on lecture circuits. I get irritated with converts who seem to be opportunists. Thankfully, God is far more patient and forgiving than I am. And I can utilize the confessional when my judgments of others become sinful.

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That’s not something he actually said and it doesn’t make sense when you think of it.

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Do you do understand? Isn’t this seeing the most evil of motives in others. You said music is powerful. Perhaps there might be more selfless motives than you are assuming.

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True, singing the Hail Mary is not the same as praying the Hail Mary twice, but it may have twice the effect on the one who sings, or the one who hears.

Your mileage may vary. My old girlfriend used to kid me because music often gives me goosebumps, or brings tears to my eyes, or gets me choked up. She said the only time that ever happened to her was when she heard wedding music. :rofl:

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Ah, but St Augustine, I believe was the one who said “he who sings, prays twice”.

Ah… But St. Augustine didn’t sing “On Eagles Wings…”

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