THE TRUTH: We are NOT saved by faith alone


#1

Im posting this thread in response to the other one (with similar title) with the contrary opinion. Every protestant who argues for “sole fide” always uses Romans as their big argument. The big theme in Paul’s letter to the Romans is justification by faith; however never once in that entire letter did St. Paul use the word “alone” to describe the faith which justifies us. Of course we are justified by faith (but not faith alone), If a man was a big philanthropist as his life, but did not have faith, his works mean nothing. We are saved by a living faith in which works are an essential part. We know that St. Paul never used the word “alone” to describe the faith which justifies us; however, St. James, in his epistle argues directly against “sole fide.” The entire subject of James 2:14-26 is about the necessity of both faith and works. James 2:24 “See how a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.” It right there pure and simple NOT BY FAITH ALONE. St. James makes a point of saying faith alone, of course we need faith but not faith alone.This verse is written so plainly, and I cant see how someone with an open mind can interperate it differently unless they are coming in with a predispostion to believe in “sole fide.”


#2

I don’t see how anyone could read the letters of John, James, Jude, Paul, etc. and give works the boot.

Besides, most Protestant Christians do huge amounts of wonderful works.

The “faith alone” schick does a huge dissevice to most of Protestantism. They can’t explain it, and their good works prove otherwise.


#3

As far as I know neither the catholic or protestant faiths have a clue as to what Paul and James were referring to. In a nutshell they were referring to THE SAME THING albeit from a different perspective. Paul refers to Abrahams FAITH. James refers to Abrahams WORKS. They are talking about the same thing.

The key verses that have alluded all institutionalized church’s of men {including yours} for centuries are…

But God said to Abraham, "Be not displeased because of the boy and because of your slave woman. Whatever Sarah says to you, do as she tells you, for through Isaac shall your offspring be named. Genesis 21:12

AND

and said, "By myself I have sworn, declares the LORD, because you have done this and have not withheld your son, your only son,
Genesis 22:16

Do you get it? In 21:12 Christ promises Abraham that through his son Isaac his offspring will be named. In 22:16 Christ does a 180 and commands Abraham to sacrafice that very same son! This takes FAITH and we know Abraham started to act out the command. When Christ stops him what does He say to him??

“because you have DONE this thing…” That is WORKS. Abraham demonstrated **FAITH AND WORKS **and that is what Paul and James bring out in their epistle’s. It is that SIMPLE folks.


#4

Are works of the law and good works the same?

The word “works” is as polarizing as the word “evolution”.

It ain’t that simple folks.


#5

No.

Only to the blind.

Yes it is.


#6

I agree that this is simple in the sense that it is illogical to believe that one can please God without both simple faith and deephearted good works.

Oliver seems to have arrived at a Catholic viewpoint, and that’s a good thing, and uncommon in a Protestant.

But there is a tendency to oversimplify. If it were THAT simple, the Protestants would have gone extinct 400 years ago.


#7

Wow. I had never really noticed the text of James 2 before–well exposited!


#8

Is not!!


#9

The Bible tells us we must have faith in order to be saved (Hebrews 11:6). Yet is faith nothing more than believing and trusting? Searching the Scriptures, we see faith also involves assent to God’s truth (1 Thessalonians 2:13), obedience to Him (Romans 1:5, 16:26), and it must be working in love (Galatians 5:6). These points appeared to be missed by the reformers, yet they are just as crucial as believing and trusting. (1 Corinthians 13:1-3) should be heeded by all it’s certainly an attention grabber.

Paul speaks of faith as a life-long process, never as a one-time experience (Philippians 2:12). He never assumes he has nothing to worry about. If he did, his words in (1 Corinthians 9:24-27) would be nonsensical. He reiterates the same point again in his second letter to Corinth (2 Corinthians 13:5). He takes nothing for granted, yet all would agree if anyone was “born again” it certainly was Paul. Our Lord and Savior spoke of the same thing by “remaining in Him” (John 15:1-11).

Paul tells us our faith is living and can go through many stages. It never stays permanently fixed after a single conversion experience no matter how genuine or sincere. Our faith can be shipwrecked (1 Timothy 1:19), departed from (1 Timothy 4:1), disowned (1 Timothy 5:8) wandered from (1 Timothy 6:10), and missed (1 Timothy 6:21). Christians do not have a “waiver” that exempts them from these verses.

Do our works mean anything? According to Jesus they do (Matthew 25:31-46). The people rewarded and punished are done so by their actions. And our thoughts (Matthew 15:18-20) and words (James 3:6-12) are accountable as well. These verses are just as much part of the Bible as Romans 10:8-13 and John 3:3-5.

Some will object by appealing to Romans 4:3 and stating Abraham was “declared righteous” before circumcision. Thus he was only saved by “believing” faith (Genesis 15:6), not by faith “working in love” (Galatians 5:6). Isn’t this what Paul means when he says none will be justified by “works of law” (Romans 3:28)? No, this is not what he means. He’s condemning the Old Covenant sacrifices and rituals which couldn’t justify and pointing to better things now in Christ Jesus in the New Covenant (Hebrews 7-10). A close examination of Abraham’s life revealed a man of God who did something. In Genesis 12-14 he makes two geographical moves, builds an altar and calls on the Lord, divides land with Lot to end quarrels, pays tithes, and refuses goods from the King of Sodom to rely instead on God’s providence. He did all these works as an old man. It was certainly a struggle. After all these actions of faith, then he’s “declared righteous” (Genesis 15:6). Did these works play a role in his justification? According to the Bible, yes.

The Catholic Church has never taught we “earn” our salvation. It is an inheritance (Galatians 5:21), freely given to anyone who becomes a child of God (1 John 3:1), so long as they remain that way (John 15:1-11). You can’t earn it but you can lose the free gift given from the Father (James 1:17).

The reformer’s position cannot be reconciled with the Bible. That is why the Catholic Church has taught otherwise for over 1,960 years.

ewtn.com/library/ANSWERS/FAWORKS.HTM


#10

A new commandment I leave you, that you love each other as I have loved you.

Works are a manifestation of the love we have for each other. Faith and Works cannot be separated from each other because they complement each other. I cant envision someone who is holy and not do good things for his brother.


#11

I am conversing with a mature adult right? Explain to me why it isn’t simple then…


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