Thought experiment. What if it was one day proven 200% there’s no God?


Well then we both think differently. I would rather live a life devoted to God (who is love) and his will and then somehow get to heaven.


I feel it is essentially incomprehensible.


After about year 1,000,000,000,143, I sense boredom may ensue.


What’s incomprehensible about it?


Good question. Well first you must understand there are a lot of other religions with a lot of other hells. So it’s totally possible that I as an unbeliever, and you as a believer in Jesus could end up eternally tortured in Islamic hell. You have associated partners with God from the Muslim point of view so that would get you a ticket to hell. I’m an unbeliever so there is my ticket. I’m sure the Muslims could say well Wkj_123 and thecardinalbird both “chose” hell by their actions. I have a feeling you wouldn’t think you chose that hell. See how it works.


Something without a beginning does not seem normal to a human who’s mind has a beginning.


Choosing hell is rejecting God

Well if that is the case then the question is, if pain is what you avoid then why not choose God?

I would rather believe in God, do his will and hopefully go to heaven. Hell is not the only place after death

Probably not because I’d probably be where time doesn’t exist. Also God is there! How could you get bored?


One cannot have faith in all religions. I would rather stick with God because at least there is a chance of salvation for me.


Your totally missing my point. If Islam is correct and you go to their hell would you agree you chose it?



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Whose version of God

Whose instruction manual do we trust?

You can’t choose to believe in God. You either do, or you don’t based on information your mind has.

Seems like a lot of kneeling and worshipping. And also, I would be constantly worrying when he might be inflicting cancer on me or MS, or ALS or something because I might eat from the wrong tree, or say the wrong thing.



But this is not a trouble to do with God as it is our imagination, for we know SOME reality must exist necessarily, or you and I would not be here now…

So again, the question is: What is the nature of this necessarily-existing reality, the first principle of existence? Is it some discreet physical reality within the universe? A collection of physical realities? The entire collection of physical realities (the Universe or Multiverse)? Can it be physical at all? These are the types of questions raised and dealt with by the metaphysical proofs.


The physical could just be eternal, as in always been there, always will.


Ha, your right. :slight_smile:


I would hope that “my” God would not be fooled by that logic.



What is revealed in scripture

Really? People converted from Paganism to Christianity. Was that not choosing to believe in God?

Well than you have a poor understanding of the Christian God


True, but trying to conceive what it would be like to experience such an existence and positing it from reasoned arguments are different. That is, imagining what it would be like and finding that experience incomprehensible does not in itself mean there’s any logical contradiction.


That’s just re-stating the option.

But the proofs show that it can’t be a physical reality, if by physical reality you mean something conditioned by time and space.

But the same proofs show that it cannot be anything so restricted, for that restriction would also require explanation, and then move the question back one step.


I thought you were an atheist?


I’m always open to all options. I am non-theist, because I do not believe in an intervening God, which is the definition of theism.

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