Three days and three nights in the tomb (Revisited)


#1

JohnR77,
re: “We know that Jesus died on a Friday…”

If by Friday you mean the 6th day of the week, how do you know that that was day that He died?


Question about Matthew 12:40
#2

I believe all four gospels say Jesus died on the day of preparation. For example Mark 15:34
It was Preparation Day (that is, the day before the Sabbath). So as evening approached,
This is the preparation day before the regular sabbath not some non-sabbath feast day.
Grace and Peace,
Bruce


#3

Bruce Killian,
re: “…Mark 15:34 [says] It was Preparation Day (that is, the day before the Sabbath)…This is the preparation day before the regular sabbath not some non-sabbath feast day.”

That the term “preparation day” did not always have to mean the day before the weekly Sabbath is attested to by Rabbi Samuel Lacks who states: "The day of preparation (Greek ‘paraskeue’) equals Friday OR the day before a holiday" - [A Rabbinic Commentary of the New Testament]. Therefore, the preparation day mentioned in your references did not have to be referring to the 6th day of the week.

In fact John 19:14 in the New American Bible says; “It was preparation day for Passover…” So in this particular instance it was referring to preparing for the holiday, i.e., the Passover and not the weekly Sabbath.


#4

The gospels all agree that he died on Friday and rose on Sunday. We see him celebrate a Passover Seder the night before he was betrayed in Mark, Luke, and Matthew. The Crucifixion has great Passover significance, so it’s possible Christ celebrated it early and in a new way, knowing he would not be wake to on the actual Passover. John’s timeline has been receiving increasing significance in the west (not sure of its status in the East, though I have seen it cited as accurate).

This is relevant to the original question because there are various proposals about Christ dying sooner or rising later, but Friday and Sunday are set within the gospels.


#5

Bruce Killian,
re: “Jesus was in the heart of the earth “just as” Jonah was in the belly of the great fish. Jonah was in the hold of a ship sleeping for part of the time and in the inside of a whale for the other part of the time.”

Jonah 2:1 in the New American Bible says; “But the LORD sent a great fish to swallow Jonah, and he remained in the belly of the fish three days and three nights.” His time sleeping in the hold of the ship was not included in the three days and three nights.


#6

Wesrock,
re: “The gospels all agree that he died on Friday and rose on Sunday.”

How do you account for the missing night time?


Question about Matthew 12:40
#7

WELCOME TO CAF FORM, WE’RE GLAD YOU JOINED US :thumbsup:

Numbers in the bible have a meaning of their own based on Hebrew Traditions;
For example the #3 means:

agapebiblestudy.com/documents/the%20significance%20of%20numbers%20in%20scripture.htm

THREE: In sacred Scripture the number three represents that which is solid, real, substantial, and something in its completeness. This number usually indicates something of importance or significance in God’s plan of salvation by identifying an important event in Salvation History. This number operates as a “sign-post” in Scripture study for the reader to “pay attention” to the significance of the next event.

In the Old Testament:
• It is the first of the 4 perfect numbers which are 3 (divine perfection); 7 (spiritual perfection); 10 (ordinal perfection); and 12 (governmental perfection).
• The earth was separated from the waters on the 3rd day [Genesis 1:9-13]
• There were three Patriarchs of the children of Israel: Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob/Israel
• There are three verses in the Priestly Blessing in which the Tetragrammaton, YHWH, God’s holy covenant name, appears three times [Numbers 6:24-26].
• Three times the angelic Seraphim cry “Holy, Holy, Holy” [Isaiah 6:3 and Revelation 4:8].
• After the Great Flood mankind descended from the three sons of Noah: Shem, Ham, and Japheth. [Genesis 10:1-32]
• Three “men” announced to Abraham that his barren wife would bear a son [Genesis 18:14].
• Abraham was commanded to sacrifice his son after a three-day journey to Mt. Moriah [Genesis 22:1-4].
• Baby Moses was hidden by his mother for three months [Exodus 2:1] and the adult Moses requests of Pharaoh that he let Moses take his people on a three-day journey into the wilderness to offer sacrifice to their God [Exodus 3:18].
• There were three divisions of the desert Tabernacle and later the Temple in Jerusalem: the Outer Court, the Holy Place, and the Holy of Holies [Exodus 27:9; 26:1-30, 35-37; 31-34; 38:9-20; 21-31; 40:1-33; 1 Kings 6: 1-37].
• God is mentioned three times in the Shema, the Old Covenant profession of faith [Deuteronomy 6:4] and three times in the priestly blessing [Numbers 6:24-26].
• The three attributes of God mentioned in Exodus 33:18-19 are hen, rachum, and hesed (gracious, compassionate /merciful, and loving kindness).
• Of the seven annual Holy Feasts of the Sinai Covenant, three are “pilgrim feasts” in which every man 13 years or older must present himself before God at His Sanctuary and later at the Temple in Jerusalem. This command is repeated three time in scripture [Exodus 23:14-17; 34:18-23; Deuteronomy 16:16]
• Jonah spent three days in the belly of the great fish [Jonah 2:1]; Jonah took three days to journey across the city of Nineveh [Jonah 3:3]

In the NT the #3 most often is a metaphorical reference to the Blessed Trinity: Father,
Son & Holy Spirit; & it may or may NOT also be literal.

God Bless you, and Merry Christmas

Patrick


#8

The gospels are clear about the day off death and the day of the resurrection. There’s no leeway there. We see examples elsewhere in the Bible that “three days and three nights” or other suggestions of a 72 hour period were used as sayings, the events they were associations with occurred on the third day. We also see elsewhere that Jesus refers to his own resurrection as being “on the third day” multiple times. Therefore, the best understanding of the “sign of Jonah” remark is him using it as a common saying/expression/idiom and not in a literal 72 hour period sense. This one-time saying doesn’t outweigh all the other factors that suggest “on the third day” and Friday through Sunday, especially in context.


#9

PJM,

What is your point with regard to the OP question: “…how do we interpret or explain his prophecy about three nights?”


#10

Wesrock,
re: “We see examples elsewhere in the Bible that ‘three days and three nights’ or other suggestions of a 72 hour period were used as sayings…”

What examples do you have where a daytime or a night time was forecast to be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could have occurred?

re: " We also see elsewhere that Jesus refers to his own resurrection as being ‘on the third day’ multiple times."

But nothing of those times preclude at least a portion of each one of 3 daytimes and at least a portion of each one of 3 night times.

re: “…, the best understanding of the ‘sign of Jonah’ remark is him using it as a common saying/expression/idiom…”

But again, if it was common to say that a daytime or a night time would be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could take place, there would have to be examples in order to say that it was common. I’m not aware of any.


#11

Old thread closed and new thread split here as per forum rules and guidelines…


#12

Any part of a day was reckoned as a complete day.

The Babylonian Talmud (Jewish commentaries) relates . . . .

“The portion of a day is as the whole of it.” (3) The Jerusalem Talmud (so designated because it was written in Jerusalem) says, “We have a teaching, ‘A day and a night are an Onah and the portion of an Onah is as the whole of it.’”(4) An Onah simply means, “a period of time.” . . . .

  1. Mishnah, Third Tractate, “B. Pesachim,” p. 4a
  2. Mishnah, Tractate “J. Shabbath,” Chapter IX, Par. 3.

God bless and Merry Christmas.

Cathoholic


Question about Matthew 12:40
#13

Cathoholic,
re: “Any part of a day was reckoned as a complete day.”

Agree. But when was no part of a day reckoned as a complete day?


#14

rstrats. You said . . .

when was no part of a day reckoned as a complete day?

Please show me what you are alluding to specifically ratrats.

If you are appealing to tradition, please cite it so I can understand what your objection is.

If you are appealing to Sacred Scripture, please cite that for the same reason.


#15

Cathoholic,
re: “Please show me what you are alluding to specifically ratrats.”

The original post was questioning the lack of the 3rd night time of Matthew 12:40 with a 6th day of the week crucifixion/1st day of the week resurrection. I thought you were trying to justify the lack of the 3rd night by suggesting that it was common to forecast that a daytime or a night time would be involved with an event without having to have at least a portion of the daytime or at least a portion of the night time actually occurring in order for them to be counted.


Question about Matthew 12:40
#16

Please rstrats.

Just lay out your objections from original evidence (not someone elses posts).

I admit it. It’s my fault here that I’m still not sure what your objection is.

Sometimes abstracting is fine for someone and their own arguments.

But I can be a concrete thinker who at times need concrete examples.

Explain to me what you think that Christians believe.

Put up the verse(s) you are talking about that develops your objection.

Then please show me how you came to the conclusions you did based upon all of this.

Thank you rstrats.


#17

Cathoholic,
re: “Just lay out your objections from original evidence…”

For the original purpose of this topic, I have no objections. If someone thinks that the crucifixion occurred on the 6th day of the week, and thinks that the “heart of the earth” refers to the tomb, and tries to explain the lack of the third night time forecast in Matthew 12:40 by saying that the verse is employing common Jewish idiomatic/figure of speech/colloquial language of the time, I would simply like to see examples to support the idea that it is common.


#18

I will start this post by saying i am very new to the teachings of Jesus. And know of them from the Bible and by the Grace of the Trinity and Mother Mary.
There are experts in Theology on thie Forum who are well versed on the writings in the Bible.

Now when Jesus was teaching people asked for a sign, as you can imagine. Jesus saying it was a generation of weak faith ( or similar, find it in the Bible) said the only sign would be that of Jonah- 3 days and nghts in the belly of the big sea creature. Jonah’s predicament as mentioned a couple of times.

There are a few Bible passages that say

After 3 days He Rose

( not after 3 days and 3 nights He rose) correct me if I am wrong.

You can see the match with Jonah, both Jesus and Jonah in darkness for an equable time.

My friend in Christ are you getting stuck on what was written in prophecy , and not comparing it with what was written after Jesus rose?


#19

Roseeurekacross,
re: “There are a few Bible passages that say After 3 days He Rose”

That is correct, if by “a few” you mean two.

re: “( not after 3 days and 3 nights He rose) correct me if I am wrong.”

That is correct. The passage actual says; “…so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.”

re: “…are you getting stuck on what was written in prophecy…”

Not that I know of.

Are you a 6th day of the week crucifixion advocate?


#20

Compare the prophecy writing foretelling the event timeline of Crucifixion and Rising again, with the writing of the Gospel after the event, describing the timeline of what happened.
I believe the difference is that of prophecy , or forecast as you say, to reality of what happened. The forecast was almost spot on.
I If we are around for the events of Revelation, will prophecy description 100% match the reality? So for example , a pale horse comes out, its rider is Death, and Hell follows him. Does this literally mean the entire domain of Hell will be attached as a caravan to a car?

I have no idea what you mean by a 6th day of the week advocate.
The Gospel tells me Jesus Rose after 3 days , had a body, taught some more, then went to Heaven.
The timeline is clear too. It was Passover. Jesus was the Passover sacrifice, and was buried before the start of the Sabbath Day. Mary , His mother, and the other Marys had to wait till the day after the Sabbath to be able to attend and care for His body. This was the intention that first day after the Sabbath . Jesus had already risen by the time they got back to the tomb that day.
The Church tells me the days were Friday, Saturday and Sunday, which i defer to , not having much knowledge of Jewish religious practice.


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