I was reading some statements of Jesus and wondering how he could say
“No one has ascended into heaven, but He who descended from heaven: the Son of Man.”
It may not, but it coud also be a direct reference to His ascension, before it happened.
Also, there are this passages:
And** I am no longer in the world**, but they are in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, keep them in your name, which you have given me, that they may be one, even as we are one. 12 While I was with them, I kept them in your name, which you have given me.
So, if He speaks of Himslef as already ascended, can we begin to search in the direction of events in the Gospel of John being understood both in time and in eternity, more than clearly pointing out Jesus’ devinity?
Also, John 8:
57 So the Jews said to him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have you seen Abraham?” 58 Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I am.”
Not only a reference to the Name of God (“I AM”) but also to an understanding apart from time as we experience it.
And there is another interesting thought that just occurs to me, on the Mount of Transfiguration, when Moses and Elijah appear talking with him: Are they experiencing this “in their own time”, but Peter and James and John experiencing the “NOW” of “I AM” that transcends time? just a thought; I don’t know the implications for both Time and Space, since the earth moved many billions of miles between Abraham, Elijah, and Jesus.
Yes, but my question is: was that intention of the Evangelist, to explicit such a truth?
The example of the Ascension id clear. Jesus talks about future events as already happened. Does anyone have any contributions about this way of writing in the Gospels?
Ver. 13. No man hath ascended—but he that descended from heaven, the Son of man, who is in heaven. These words, divers times repeated by our Saviour, in their literal and obvious sense, shew that Christ was in heaven, and had a being before he was born of the Virgin Mary, against the Cerinthians, &c. That he descended from heaven: that when he was made man, and conversed with men on earth, he was at the same time in heaven. Some Socinians give us here their groundless fancy, that Jesus after his baptism took a journey to heaven, and returned again before his death. Nor yet would this make him in heaven, when he spoke this to his disciples. (Witham)
Ver. 11. And now I am no more in the world: that is, I am now leaving the world, as to a corporeal and visible presence: yet St. Augustine takes notice, that Christ saith afterwards, (ver. 13.) these things I speak in the world: therefore he was still for some short time in the world. And as to his true invisible presence with his Church, he gave us this promise, (Matthew xxviii. 20.) Behold I am with you all days, even to the end of the world. — Keep them in thy name, whom thou hast given me. Christ, as man, says St. Augustine, asks of his Father, to preserve those disciples whom he had given him, who were to preach the gospel to the world. — That they may be one, as we also are. These words cannot signify an equality, nor to be one in nature and substance, as the divine persons are one, but only that they may imitate, as much as they are able, that union of love and affection. See St. Chrysostom, St. Cyril, and St. Augustine on these words. (Witham) — Here Jesus Christ prays especially, that the apostles and his Church may be kept in unity of religion, and free from schism.