TLM Question

I attended a Saturday morning Mass at a TLM chapel in south Denver recently, and I was surprised that not only were the prayers in latin, but the readings were in latin as well!

Was this the norm for the Tridentine Mass?

I serve at the TLM so I think I will be able to answer your question. The Epistle and Gospel are both read in Latin. However, it is customary for the priest to read them again in English. These are read in English prior to the announcements and homily. The priest there didn’t happen to be named Fr. Byrne was he?

[quote=aaron_brown99]I attended a Saturday morning Mass at a TLM chapel in south Denver recently, and I was surprised that not only were the prayers in latin, but the readings were in latin as well!

Was this the norm for the Tridentine Mass?
[/quote]

Yes, Also notice that the Gospel is read North, it is read North for a very good reason.

[quote=Iohannes]Yes, Also notice that the Gospel is read North, it is read North for a very good reason.
[/quote]

I don’t know what that means…

@marine

I’m not sure of the priest’s name, but I was sure worried he would collapse from old age during the Mass…

Overall, I was less “moved” than I thought I would be at the TLM. While I understand completely that emotion is beside the point, and that my “participation” is irrelevant since Christ’s presence is what matters, I had heard many people talk about how moving, beautiful, and inspiring the TLM was.

I found that it was (much to my consternation) exactly how my Grandmother described it–the priest up at the altar celebrating Mass, and the people sitting in the pews looking bored and uninvolved. I know, I know, the people are there to worship and receive Christ, not “participate,” but as a convert and someone “brought in” with the Novus Ordo, I enjoy the responsive nature of the Novus Ordo Mass.

Maybe I need to find a Latin Novus Ordo community…does such a thing exist?

[quote=aaron_brown99] Maybe I need to find a Latin Novus Ordo community…does such a thing exist?
[/quote]

Absolutely! Across the country you will find fairly famous parishes which have become well known for their reverent celebration of the Novis Ordo in Latin. In Chicago we have both a religious order and a parish named St. John Cantius, where Latin is used for both the Tridentine Mass and the Novus Ordo. In St. Paul, Minnesota, the Church of St. Agnes is famous for its Latin Novus Ordo. The Cathedral of the Madelaine in Salt Lake City also has NO in Latin I think. If you are in Denver, you might know that beautiful old parish church that has a high rise skyscraper partially built over it. I can’t think of the name, but I am pretty sure that church was famous for its liturgy including Latin Novus Ordo.

Maybe you don’t need to FIND a a Latin Novus Ordo community–maybe you could CREATE one! Become friendly with priests who are interested in “bringing back” some Latin–there are more every day. Learn the Mass parts in Latin (Agnus Dei, Sanctus, Pater Noster, etc) and try to get an acapella choir together. The beauty of Latin is that you do not need a lot of talent to sing Latin well–plainchant has a noble simplicity no matter how bad of a singer you might be. Three or four people willing to chant the parts of the Mass in Latin could create a renewal across a parish and even a diocese!

The Traditional Latin Mass needs a lifetime to figure out. It is not temporary like the NO Mass. Sir please take tome to attend the Traditional Latin Mass for a month or two each Sunday[or whenever you can] and then make your judgement. Sorry aaron but have you been to a sung or High Mass? At those you respond more than at a NO.

Gospel is read North because, the North represent coldness and darkness wear the Gospel needed to be spread.

Also if you do have a chance, attend a High Mass.

Overall, I was less “moved” than I thought I would be at the TLM

I too was not entirely “moved” the first time I attended the TLM, although I appreciated it. Looking back, I probably wasn’t completely moved the second time either. It took a while. Now I’m a regular. I agree with Eagle that High Mass is much richer than the Low Mass.

While I agree with people who say the TLM is “the most beautiful thing this side of heaven,” one who hears this and attends for the first time may expect perfection itself, or to see choirs of angels in front of the altar. Sadly, there is no perfection on this earth. There will always be some forms of irreverence and boredom at any mass, anywhere. To expect otherwise is unrealistic.

I hope you give the TLM another chance or chances. God Bless!

Or at least a Sung Mass (Missa Cantana)!

[quote=Brian Crane]I too was not entirely “moved” the first time I attended the TLM, although I appreciated it. Looking back, I probably wasn’t completely moved the second time either. It took a while. Now I’m a regular. I agree with Eagle that High Mass is much richer than the Low Mass.

While I agree with people who say the TLM is “the most beautiful thing this side of heaven,” one who hears this and attends for the first time may expect perfection itself, or to see choirs of angels in front of the altar. Sadly, there is no perfection on this earth. There will always be some forms of irreverence and boredom at any mass, anywhere. To expect otherwise is unrealistic.

I hope you give the TLM another chance or chances. God Bless!
[/quote]

I have heard good choirs and and bad choirs singing for Mass, the last Solemn High Mass I attended, blew me away, it included a priest, deacon, subdeacon, Masters of ceremony 12 altar servers with a professional choir. It was heaven on earth. All my friends I took along who had little experience with the Traditional Latin Mass were blown away too.

Wait till you hear Missa Papae Marcelli by Palestrina being sung during Mass.

The Traditional Latin Mass needs a lifetime to figure out. It is not temporary like the NO Mass. Sir please take tome to attend the Traditional Latin Mass for a month or two each Sunday[or whenever you can] and then make your judgement. Sorry aaron but have you been to a sung or High Mass? At those you respond more than at a NO.

Catholic Eagle, I agree whole-heartedly with what you have said. The first time I attended the TLM (at age 7) I was kind of ‘borded’ also. Looking back though, I am so attached to the Old Mass its amazing.

“The priest there didn’t happen to be named Fr. Byrne was he?”

If it was at the FFSP Church in Littleton it was more likely Fr. Salgado, otherwise it may have been an SSPX chapel.

Deogratias,
It’s good to know I’m not the only one who knows Fr. Byrne(FSSP). He was ordained last June and is a good friend of mine.

I also know Fr. Salgado who is the Pastor - actually I lived in Colorado Springs where Fr. Fritchen, FSSP is the Pastor but now I am in Phoenix Diocese.

the traditional latin mass is the embodiment of true catholicism please persevere in attending it - especially sung or high masses, which are truly the best thing this side of heaven

[quote=Iohannes]I have heard good choirs and and bad choirs singing for Mass, the last Solemn High Mass I attended, blew me away, it included a priest, deacon, subdeacon, Masters of ceremony 12 altar servers with a professional choir.
[/quote]

What is a Master of ceremony???

Panis

??? what does the correct nomenclature for EMHC’s have to do with the response to Johannes post?

In the TLM EMHC’s are not used.

[quote=Panis Angelicas]What is a Master of ceremony???
[/quote]

The Masters of Ceremony is the director of the liturgy and is in charge of the movements of the altar boys.

If you have seen recent Masses by Pope JPII, the guy with the red Cassock and white surplice behind Pope John Paul II is the Masters of Ceremony.

[quote=deogratias]Panis

??? what does the correct nomenclature for EMHC’s have to do with the response to Johannes post?

In the TLM EMHC’s are not used.
[/quote]

Nothing at all. Look carefully. It is his sig.

James

If you really want to go to a better TLM, go to some of the European countries. Maybe they do it better.

From what I heard in the United States pre-vatican II, there was a Low Mass mentality among Catholics, particulary the Irish Americans. For the most part, the Irish have the most influence on the liturgy across America.

The Low Mass mentality probally came from the persecution of the English where they had to do constant Low Masses and if anything sounded too celebratory, it sounded too anglican.

Why Can’t Catholic Sing by Thomas Day theorizes it.

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