Today's Mass readings (Abram commits adultery / Jesus says [to Christians] Depart from me, you evildoers)

Th (6-25)

Genesis 16:1-16:

Abram’s wife Sarai had borne him no children. She had, however, an Egyptian maidservant named Hagar. Sarai said to Abram: “The Lord has kept me from bearing children. Have intercourse, then, with my maid; perhaps I shall have sons through her.” Abram heeded Sarai’s request. Thus, after Abram had lived ten years in the land of Canaan, his wife Sarai took her maid, Hagar the Egyptian, and gave her to her husband Abram to be his concubine!!]. He had intercourse with her, and she became pregnant. When she became aware of her pregnancy, she looked on her mistress with disdain. So Sarai said to Abram: “You are responsible for this outrage against me. I myself gave my maid to your embrace; but ever since she became aware of her pregnancy, she has been looking on me with disdain. May the Lord decide between you and me!” Abram told Sarai: “Your maid is in your power. Do to her whatever you please.” Sarai then abused her so much that Hagar ran away from her. The Lord’s messenger found her by a spring in the wilderness, the spring on the road to Shur, and he asked, “Hagar, maid of Sarai, where have you come from and where are you going?” She answered, “I am running away from my mistress, Sarai.” But the Lord’s messenger told her: “Go back to your mistress and submit to her abusive treatment. I will make your descendants so numerous that they will be too many to count. Besides,” the Lord’s messenger said to her, “You are now pregnant and shall bear a son; you shall name him Ishmael, for the Lord has heard you, God has answered you. This one shall be a wild *** of a man, his hand against everyone, and everyone’s hand against him; in opposition to all his kin shall he encamp.” Hagar bore Abram a son, and Abram named the son whom Hagar bore him Ishmael. Abram was eighty-six years old when Hagar bore him Ishmael.

St Mt 7:21-29:**

Jesus said to his disciples: “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of Heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father in Heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name? Did we not drive out demons in your name? Did we not do mighty deeds in your name? Then I will declare to them solemnly, ‘I never knew you. Depart from me, you evildoers.’ Everyone who listens to these words of mine and acts on them will be like a wise man who built his house on rock. The rain fell, the floods came, and the winds blew and buffeted the house. But it did not collapse; it had been set solidly on rock. And everyone who ***listens to these words of mine but does not act on them ***will be like a fool who built his house on sand. The rain fell, the floods came, and the winds blew and buffeted the house. And it collapsed and was completely ruined.” When Jesus finished these words, the crowds were astonished at his teaching, for he taught them as one having authority, and not as their scribes.

*It seems that Sarai and Abram could not (no, Would not) wait on God to give them children…

… can’t blame them, seeing as how they were WAY beyond child-bearing age, :eek: but still, God had spoken to Abram and promised… seems they (like all of us :(… or me nayway… ) have a very hard time trusting God.

Still, God does’t seem to hold this against them… and why should He? The consequences of their sin were readily manifested…

Sarai was a “bigger woman than I” as it were, because there’s no way i would share my husband with anyone… :ouch::hypno::dts:

In the last psg, The gospel today implies that not everyone who cries out to the Lord (has a “relationship with” Him?) is going to Heaven, but only those who DO the Word of God…

Now i know why i always felt so uncomfortable when a non-Catholic (usually) would go on and on about “personal relationship with Jesus”… seemingly to the exclusion of all other spiritual concepts…

and in seeming accordance with his/her belief or apparent belief in OnceSavedAlwaysSaved…

which is the most unbibilical belief i’ve ever heard of… :rolleyes: . so when people say they believe in osas, i automatically know one thing about them: They really don’t know the Word…*

To accuse Abram of adultery is unjust. The idea of a solely monogamous marriage developed over time. In Abram’s time, polygamy would have been practiced regularly and would have been considered a morally good act.
What it does show us is: Our faith and what we believe developed over time. This includes Biblical times. So to apply our understanding to Abram is unjust. We have to judge his actions according to the law and understanding of God’s will as it was understood in HIS time.
It is quite some time yet before monogamy became the norm–e.g. How many wives does Solomon have?

Wrote on today’s reading, would love your opinion. Check it out at

  • Michael

If anything, today’s bible reading shows why polygamy doesn’t work. Reading between the lines, Sarah goes insane with jealously over Hagar’s conception. What I don’t get is that it seems okay for Sarah to beat a pregnant woman. The messenger of the Lord even tells Hagar to go back and submit to her abuse!

And if you read on, I don’t recall anywhere where Sarah is repentant of this.

objectively speaking, he committed adultery. Truth does not change. Yes human being’s understanding of God and his will DOES evolve over time… because we are weak and selfish and ignorant… but when i said he committed adultery, i was speaking from the point of view of God’s absolute law (objective truth). Nobody was judging anyone…

yeah, for sure… .

This thing about hagar submitting is a good argument (i think :o) for the Catholic way of “offering up” sufferings, accepting them… not running from the Cross… although it does seem kind of odd… to submit to someone’s abuse… esp when it was Sarai who told Abram to have sex w/ Hagar in the 1st place. She seems to be the main trouble-maker (my opinion) … Hmm… weird… but i guess its like most sin… we don’t know how awful it is until after we do it… (and esp after we know God’s way of looking @ things… )

I think the writer of the account just left out some details… maybe it wasn’t all that relevent to the main idea of the story whether Sarai repented or not… ??

i think this story shows how when humans are left to their own devices (and this WAS before Christ and hIs Church, given to guide us)… how terribly awry things go… Sarai thought she was doing the right thing having hagar sleep w/ her husband & get pregnant… thought she was fulfilling God’s promise (?) only to find that she couldn’t handle the result…


don’t have time to puruse the whole site right now…

can you summarize its main theme?

Its the second article called merit… It would take me too much time to summarize when its already summarized.

Take care.

  • Michael

i like what you say about hte Church… agree w/ all you say.

i don’t know why a person would choose a “new church” (so called) over the One that has been around since the time of Christ…

i guess just because they don’t think of things that way… dont know histoyr… have heard too many bad things about the RCC… mostly distorted or totally un-true…

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