Tubal Ligation (?)


#1

I have a friend who is just broken to pieces because his wife wants to have her tubes cut so she can’t have any more children. They have only two. He says that she said she wanted 4 before they were married, and that he wanted 10, but he compromised with her on 5. He is distraut because he says she wont listen to him. She claims it is her body and her mind that are stressed by demanding, relentless, misbehaving children all day, and she is just going to go down and have the simple operation done and not tell him about it. He says, what about the promiss she made him before they were married? What about learning how to shape and raise children so the chaos isn’t so intense? But he says she wont listen to him. He is destroyed and desperately seeking a way to resolve this. What should I tell him? I don’t want to give him any non-Catholic advise, but he is clearly wrapped up in emotional turmoil over this. Any suggestions?

Thanks. God Bless,

Craig Guadagnolo


#2

I don’t know what advice you could give him other than to pray. Not just so that she will change her mind, but for her forgiveness if she does get it done and to remove any bitterness from him that might result from it.


#3

[quote=Craig Guadagnol]I have a friend who is just broken to pieces because his wife wants to have her tubes cut so she can’t have any more children. They have only two. He says that she said she wanted 4 before they were married, and that he wanted 10, but he compromised with her on 5. He is distraut because he says she wont listen to him. She claims it is her body and her mind that are stressed by demanding, relentless, misbehaving children all day, and she is just going to go down and have the simple operation done and not tell him about it. He says, what about the promiss she made him before they were married? What about learning how to shape and raise children so the chaos isn’t so intense? But he says she wont listen to him. He is destroyed and desperately seeking a way to resolve this. What should I tell him? I don’t want to give him any non-Catholic advise, but he is clearly wrapped up in emotional turmoil over this. Any suggestions?

Thanks. God Bless,

Craig Guadagnolo
[/quote]

First of all, I’d point out it is not a “simple” operation. Secondly, I would suggest that they use NFP to postpone a pregnancy indefinitely until she doesn’t feel so overwhelmed. Perhaps pointing out that she might feel differently when the kids are a little older and that something “permanent” might be a regret later would help.

I highly recommend your friend visit www.omsoul.com, they have a ton of great info on sterilization, contraception, NFP, etc.


#4

This sounds like more than what it appears to be, the wife seems to be using this to hurt the husband for some underlying cause and until that cause can be found there is going to be problems in this marriage. There may be way more problems than an outsider knows about and this might be the wifes way to get a reaction from the husband. Pray for them and suggest to your friend that he and his wife get some help from a pro-life, pro-family christian therapist so they can work out what is really at the heart of this.
I’ll pray for them too.


#5

Is she Catholic, also? I believe her “change of heart” could be considered an impediment of consent (possilble grounds for annulment). Perhaps she is just completely overwhelmed right now, and will reconsider later. I think your friends would both benefit from an NFP course. And keep praying!


#6

Can I advise an annulment? How should my friend handle his wife so as to make things better? What other thing might be going on here, if there is really something else going on that we don’t know about? If his wife is really mentally, emotionally, and physically worn out and at the end of her rope as she claims to be, what can I advise my friend to do?

Thanks for the advise so far, and God Bless,

Craig Guadagnolo


#7

[quote=Craig Guadagnol]Can I advise an annulment? How should my friend handle his wife so as to make things better? What other thing might be going on here, if there is really something else going on that we don’t know about? If his wife is really mentally, emotionally, and physically worn out and at the end of her rope as she claims to be, what can I advise my friend to do?

[/quote]

Advise an annulment? Oh, heavens, NO! It could be grounds for one, but they are still married, they should do everything to stay together for SO many reasons.

Is there anyway that they can get away for awhile? Is there any way for the husband to offload her work some? If she is really as worn out as you say, she needs some help. Maybe they could get some councelling, go to a marriage encounter weekend. Maybe they can look at their life and see where they could simplify something. NFP is a good start, if nothing else it gets both spouses working together (when done right), but if she is overwealmed, then the first place to start is why is she overwealmed, and what can be done to help her.

Just my $.02

John


#8

This couple needs to find a good christian therapist, if they already have children then divorce or annullment is not the answer because that it not putting those children’s feelings first.
I know that I went through a deep depression with anxiety and I felt overwhelmed each day and it felt like the world was caving in on me and that I could hardly take care of the children that I had and my husband was not doing his share of helping. Some men do there share and more and some do not, you don’t know what is really going on in this family as not all families want you to know their deepest, darkest secrets. If this came on all of a sudden then this isn’t really about a tubal ligation, its so much deeper than that and right now this husband needs to show hiswife that he loves her, is very worried about her and wants to be there for her to help her. Divorce is never the answer, she is very obviously in need of help and right now that is the first thing that needs to happen.


#9

As an individual who has gone through the anullment process, yes, this is definitetly grounds for an anullment. I would rather suggest that you encourage your friend to speak to his wife about NFP. The rate of success is better than using contraceptives and has no side effects. Many Catholics don’t realize that this is a sin either.

Good Luck and God Bless:amen:


#10

They have two children, so now these kids have to go through a big custody battle if the parents get an annullment because annullment is pretty much a divorce and these kids are going to be wanted by both these parents, annullment is not the answer.
We don’t know what this guy is really like, this woman doesn’t want more kids for a reason that we don’t know, if my husband expected me to do everything and didn’t help with anything as in kids, house, etc. I would not want more kids either, this woman is trying to exert some control over her life because she is overwhelmed, a husband who loves his wife with all his heart will get her some help and stand by her side and if that means putting on hold having more kids then that is what you do, he needs to show her that if she will wait on the tubal and seek help he will not get her pregnant on purpose and if that means abstaining then so be it, if she is mentally ill she needs help and her husband annulling their marriage could send her over the edge, we need to be very careful what we say, there are children already involved in this marriage and they must come first and foremost :thumbsup:


#11

His wife is probably feeling completely overwhelmed and does not want to consider having anymore children EVER. He needs to be understanding of that attitude and gently suggest to her that they use NFP to avoid pregnancy, rather than some surgical procedure that, like all surgical procedures, involves health risks.

He should avoid the idea that “with NFP we can have more kids later.” She doesn’t want to hear that now because she has all that she can handle and cannot imagine a time when that will change.

Perhaps, if he approaches her in agreement as to the goal of no more kids, he can get her to agree to NFP as the means instead of tubal ligation.

Also, a GREAT number of women suffer from post-partum (or other) depression. So, she may be in need of medication which is (again) why they should both speak to a good Catholic psychiatrist. I know women who have been “overwhelmed” and deathly afraid of having another baby - so afraid that they would consider doing anything to avoid it. With proper medication and support from her husband, she will feel far less desparate.

Above all, pray!


#12

I was simply stating a fact about obtaining an anullment, not pushing this man to do so. Please re-read my statement:

I would rather suggest that you encourage your friend to speak to his wife about NFP. The rate of success is better than using contraceptives and has no side effects. Many Catholics don’t realize that this is a sin either.

First of all, no one knows better than me what divorce does to a child, secondly, this woman is being very selfish no matter what the circumstances and the bottom line is that she will put herself into a grave sin with the church if she mutiliates her body this way; thirdly, how can a man get his wife pregnant on purpose? That is ridiculous!:frowning:


#13

Obviously, we can’t know for sure, but as I mentioned in my previous post it sounds to me as though there is a much deeper problem. This does not sound like a woman who just suddenly decided to be selfish. Mothers can and do get overwhelmed to the point where the thought of another baby can actually make them suicidal. Mental illness affects a GREAT number of people. And many of these people are good holy people who need help. Depression can drive people to do things that they would not ordinarily do.


#14

If this is a mental problem, then this man needs to get some professional help for his wife. If she is sane, she needs to be told the consquences of tubal ligation (both spiritual and physical). Bottom line—tubal ligation is a grave sin. If the wife is not competent, it is her husband’s responsibility to step in. This is not just a Catholic’s opinion, but the teachings of the Church. Craig, can you respond to this?


#15

I would also suggest that she or her husband read the book by Kimberly Hahn, Life Giving Love. She has such a wonderful view on how children should be looked at, as a gift from God, not something to deal with for 18 years and then push out the door.


#16

The poor woman is exhausted and stressed. It doesn’t mean she has mental problems! I’ll bet this guy is no saint either! Even two kids can be a lot for some people, especially in today’s society where all the moms have jobs and there is no neighborhood anymore. I’d advise this guy to quit looking at this desire for a tubal in a vacuum, and start treating his wife with the utmost care and respect. It sounds like she’s at the end of her rope.

This couple needs counseling. And, to throw away the marraige over the issue of birth control is missing the whole point of the spiritual life. How can anyone say that? If this woman goes ahead with the tubal that’s between her and God. It gives her husband a golden opportunity to show compassion and forgiveness.

Maybe, though, he can lovingly offer to practise NFP, fully accepting the fact that his wife at this time cannot handle any more children and might never be able to. Also, he can start doing all he can to make her life easier, since he loves his children so much and might end up with only two. He can compliment her for being a good mother and be grateful for what he has.


#17

[quote=Craig Guadagnol]Can I advise an annulment? How should my friend handle his wife so as to make things better? What other thing might be going on here, if there is really something else going on that we don’t know about? If his wife is really mentally, emotionally, and physically worn out and at the end of her rope as she claims to be, what can I advise my friend to do?
[/quote]

Thanks for the advise so far, and God Bless,

Craig Guadagnolo

I was simply answering the man’s question. I didn’t advise him to get an anullment, but that it was grounds for one. I suggested that he speak to his wife about using NFP since it is a morally acceptable teaching of the church and it has no side affects unlike ABC’s and the rate of success is much better than ABC’s. Please people, read the whole post before passing judgment.

People who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones.


#18

The poor woman will only find herself needing a hysterectomy or being told she does shortly after a tubal ligation…been there done that. BIIIGGG mistake. Bigger sin.

I hope you can have your buddy get her to view some of those links folks gave befroe she damages herself physically and spiritually…

Love in Jesus,
Shelby Grace


#19

Shelby Grace,
Due to medical nessessity I had a tubal ligation and have had no problems at all so you can’t make a statement that she will have medical problems. Does that mean she should have one? NO, I’m not saying that but that is a bogus statement. My mom had a hysterectomy when she was 33 years old and she did not have her tubes tied she had periods that lasted weeks and was anemic.
My aunt had her tubes tied 30 years ago (she is not Catholic) she has never had any problems at all. I had the most worst periods of my life and I’m talking miserable as in go to bed for a week the pain and etc. were awful and after my tubes being tied that has all ended. Who knows.

I think this thread is about what should this guy advise his friend and that is what should be stuck to.

I’ve stated it before and will again that an annullment when children are involved is never the answer, maybe it could be considered if there were no children involved but think of those two children, how awful for their parents to divorce over this.
I think this gal needs help and this is her way of crying out for help, I pray to God that her husband will love her so much he will put everything else aside and just love her and help her through this, for better and for worse are the vows we make and right now this is one of the not so better times but you have to stay in there and fight. Peace :thumbsup:


#20

Kamz:

Now I understand why you are siding with the wife. Personally, I’m siding with the church’s teaching on this subject. No! to tubal ligation. Yes to life!

Puppy


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