U.S. Senator Disrupts Summit in Washington, Saying Christians are Israel's Ally


#41

People listening to politicians bloviate on completely random stuff tune out.

To hiss and boo when the random subject is Jews is a fair indicator of the underlying prejudice. It was a crowd that Cruz was correct to walk away from. These are not the kind of people that would make effective allies in the global war against Islamist violence and supremacists anyway.


#42

How does one “lose” a place? Did this area fail to exist until 1948?


#43

Probably. He sure laid and egg with that speech. It sound like going out on a date and talking about how wonderful you other girlfriend is.

As to the substance, of course Israel is a valuable ally of the United States in the Middle East, though not the only one and not even the most useful ones at all times. Furthermore, some of what Israel does, is not really in line with what is best for us, or best for peace. This is as it should be, as they are their own country with their own interest.


#44

Israel has its own chronic problems in terms of how Christians are treated. It is part of the problem those people had gathered to discuss. To be accused of hating Jews and the United States for booing the notion that such a State is their best hope is both insulting and untrue.


#45

For the last 50-odd years, some of our fellow Christians have been possibly the most persecuted religious group in the world, and they still are. Some people when I explain this (in my RL anyway) are often surprised by this. Because most of these persecuted Christians don’t live in the West. They are (awfully), too foreign for the right, and a tad too Christian for the left.

But in recent months we have heard about the plight of at least one group of those persecuted Christians, in the Middle East. These communities (many of which date back to the beginning of Christianity) are now facing extinction - and it’s largely happening at the hands of ISIS, currently our Public Enemy No. 1.

So this is the context for Cruz’s indulgent, most cynical and despicable political stunt of the year. The summit at which he was a keynote speaker was about the plight of these ME Christians, but from pretty much the start he was exalting Israel instead, ending, following heckling, with “If you will not stand with Israel and the Jews, then I will not stand with you”, and he left.

We probably ought to keep in mind that many Christians in the ME are ethnic Arabs who live under Israel’s in the West Bank, and therefore might have negative feelings about Israel. Of course there are also plenty of ME Christians who support Israel and even serve with distinction in the IDF.

The transcript shows that Cruz’s audience was happy to applaud his support for Israel - only turning against him when it was clear he was launching into a rah-rah pro-Israel stump speech.

I’m not a Cruz-hater. I’m a nominal supporter of a lot of what the Tea Party has tried to do (if sometimes in awful ways), and if nothing else it’s reinvigorated the Republican Party. I also support Israel.

But we have to be clear about what Cruz was doing - using one of the world’s most beleaguered minorities for his own self-aggrandizement.

Why would he do this? We can only speculate, but perhaps Cruz, (a Southern Baptist whose father is a fundamentalist Baptist preacher), was subtly pandering to a segment of fundamentalist Christians who do not believe that ME Christians are “real” Christians. To a serious undercurrent of American (and definitely British) fundamentalism, the Catholic Church is the Antichrist that has been oppressing the “true” Church for millennia, and anything that looks vaguely Catholic, with ordained priests and ornate liturgies, is equally evil. Of course, this is bunk: ME Christians were Christians (with their priests and liturgies and incense and icons) for 1,800 years before the fundamentalists invented their revisionist history.

This much, however, is clear: Cruz attacked one of the most powerless and beleaguered minorities in the world, solely for personal political gain. He was speaking truth to the powerless. He was strong against the weak.

What was most striking about Cruz’s tirade was the last phrase: “If you will not stand with Israel and the Jews, then I will not stand with you.” Cruz was literally standing in a room with his fellow Christians. As we all will recognize, Biblically, the idea of the fellowship of Christian believers is a very important one. To break fellowship is to put oneself outside the community. What Cruz was saying was that agreeing to his views on Israel was more important as a badge of fellowship than believing in Jesus Christ.

There are many things Christians disagree about, but one of the things we MUST agree on, is that Jesus Christ, the Son of God, is more important than anything, and certainly more important than any political cause, as good as that cause may be.

That is Christianity. Obviously, whatever Ted Cruz believes in, it’s apparently, to judge from this, something else. I hope that Christians who are registered to vote in Texas realize it.


#46

I find it highly inappropriate to question the one’s self-proclaimed Christianity, besides being contrary to the rules here. You stated, “There are many things Christians disagree about, but one of the things we MUST agree on, is that Jesus Christ, the Son of God,”. As Senator Cruz did not deny this, there is no basis for doubting his faith. Not all Christians need agree with us for them to still be faithful.


#47

And nonone has spoke up more than Cruz about this, thats a fact. Who else? Oddly the point is avoided.

Despicable? And right the “heckling” started…“despicable” for well learned individuals and with an agenda also, and if you read the thread you would know.

.

Of course they are, and thats an excuse for the despicable “heckling”? It was outright rude. I expect much more than that from “Patriarchs”. Not high school drama.

This is distortion and after two incorrect comments I have to believe you didn’t read the thread nor follow the incident. A Cruz assault? The crowd didn’t turn against him, a “few hecklers” acting inappropriate did, in fact.

Great, I don’t follow the tea party, the rep party the dem party or any “team”. Helps keep an open mind, and in my mind I don’t see anyone but Cruz speaking up for the persecuted Christians, its refreshing.

Ridiculous, perhaps the educated hecklers used Cruz.

The hecklers, by your estimation because they had an agenda.

And you speculated into the hecklers having an agenda.

Not worth a response, I apologize for your narrow minded thinking and further persecution of Christians. What a double standard, remarkable.

Nonsense and pure fantasy. Who is speaking for those persecuted Christians except Cruz and a very limited few. In fact I have heard after this event he plans on making it part of 2016 run, no one else has the heart or spine to speak up. We need more Teds, I find the agenda to silence him, question his faith and integrity despicable.

Oh please, this out of touch with reality now.

This is way out of line and utter nonsense and insulting.


#48

Definitely not, I understand the Patriarchs feelings, but the behavior is unacceptable, and the inability to sit through a short address regardless if you agree or not is highly telling and questionable.

In fact most hecklers are evicted when rudely disrupting invited speakers. Thats what should have been done. Then perhaps Cruz wouldn’t have had to walk off the stage. Clinton speaks and they physically drag hecklers out of the room.


#49

“He does not agree or stand with those who do not believe that Israel has the right to exist as a Jewish state,” “But that does not change his passion and priority for standing with persecuted Christians across the region and across the world.” Frazier on Cruz

Its really that simple. The incident was inappropriate on both side’s. The final remarks with Cruz acting of his feelings may have been wrong but they were honest emotions that resulted from the heckling. The heckling appeared calculated, inspiring a mob mentality which fortunately the majority didn’t buy into. And probably because they didn’t agree.


#50

I agree with your statement that Cruz was trying to score political points. I also wonder why the Jewish faith, and the Jewish people are always condemned for the politics of the State. This seems to me to be a racist, bigoted view of the people of Judaism. Do you agree with everything Obama does? Is the country run by Rabbis, Iran is, so why do They not condemn them.

One last thought for Christians, Jesus was a Jew, all the Apostles were Jews, our Blessed Mother was a devout Jew, St. Joseph was a Jew. Judaism gave us Jesus. I don’t always agree with the State of Israel, but I stand with the religion founded by Abraham, Judaism.

God Bless you, sorry if I offend you , I say it all the time at the end of a conversation. What matters is what is in the Heart, not it’s place in a statement.

One last thought, do Jews ever wonder, did we miss the boat with Jesus?


#51

Maybe, and maybe what they should have did is what we all do in America, listen and then articulate a response and rebuke the points of contention, this way free speech and exchange could have transpired and reason would have prevailed and been the final analysis.

Thats how we were taught and in “high school” never mind those with multiple degrees from a institution of higher learning. How can we talk about refined in such a case. You can’t because it is a glaring and unacceptable double standard, mob mentality in fact. I expect this in Ferguson, but with educated Patriarchs? Unacceptable.


#52

What were they supposed to do? The idea that Christians are in league with the Israelis (just like the idea that Christians were in league with the Crusaders) is one of the justifications used by the Muslim extremists to persecute them. If they sat there and simply accepted Cruz’s insensitive remarks that Israel is the best ally of Christians in the Middle East (which it most certainly is not), then it would’ve added fuel to the fire by giving the appearance that his remarks were uncontroversial and widely accepted by Middle Eastern Christians. They are the victims here, the victims of persecution at home and of a man’s sick political ambition here in the states. We should not be excusing the inexcusable actions of a self-aggrandizing senator by trying to blame the victims of his actions.


#53

The very small group of obtrusive hecklers should have behaved in a responsible manner like everyone else present.

This idea is yours alone.

Who is the Christians “best” ally in the region since you seem to have someone in mind.

I’ll wait for the statistical breakdown on middle eastern Christians so your point can be proven.

I’ll also wait for the list of other US Reps in the US who have spoken on this aside from Cruz, I’m positive you’ll have that shortly as it seems illusive on this thread. I have “all” by Cruz on file. I cant see where any US Rep has spoken so brilliantly or consistently as Cruz.

This is opinion and you wouldn’t like it if I called the hecklers sick now would you?

And we shouldn’t be excusing the actions self-aggrandizing individual hecklers who forgot how to act either and in fact created the dilemma. So by your own standard Cruz is the victim of their actions. I agree.


#54

Israel is no friend to Christians in the Middle East, never has been. Christian Arabs are treated the same as Muslim Arabs are by Israel-horribly.

Cruz is grandstanding for his evangelical crowd. The man loves a good bluster, all he really does really…


#55

Yes Hobbes42 we have entered the twilight zone of Putin relativism again, you presence was expected. I’ll wait for you to prove your point instead of making grand incorrect and wrong btw statements as usual. The not so stellar argument in relation to muslim treatment should be interesting. Whom should we compare Israel to in the region? Egypt? Syria? Iraq? Lebanon? Iran? SA? Who? Who is the par-excellence in comparison. No-one is the answer.

Ah back to the unproven point of evangelicals, must be short of factual information so by all means lets rise to triumphant speculation. The usual and frankly expected.


#56

With such heavy problems, this event cannot be identified as Middle East Christian conference. In fact it has become a Dhimmi conference at the service of Iran, Assad and Hezbollah.

google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CC0QFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Faugustafreepress.com%2Firan-assad-hezbollah-using-christian-persecution-isis-hijack-minorities%2F&ei=UWgUVMKCNuHD8AGa04HIAw&usg=AFQjCNHmWKepT6pgHLJVKnMHBORKtjttEw

However, while the narrative of IDC is directed at ISIS violence, the conference, is profiting the Iranian and Syrian regimes and Hezbollah. Here are the facts


#57

Cruz showed his true colors.

He has no clue about the ME Christians living in harms way and how his remarks could be deadly for them.

I hope people realize the ideologue Cruz is and how damaging his form of rhetoric and distortions are to Christianity and the United States.

Jim


#58

“Ideologue”? Please explain. Can a person who believes in the Constituional principles of limited government be an ideologue? Rob :cool:


#59

What are his true colors? That he speaks for persecuted Christians including Catholics as linked when the Democrats response has been Hobby Lobby and the Sisters of the Poor, thrown under the bus, when Isis is separated and deemed not Islamic.

And the idea anything as deadly, sure has a good deal of deafening silence and acceptance of the Iranian and Syrian regimes and Hezbollah. You don’t speak up to those persecuting you I suppose. Fortunately some, few to none in fact like Cruz are speaking up.

I fail to see how anything is more damaging to Christianity than those especially in the USA politics whose fear has silenced them into submission. Like the Democrats and ultra conservative republicans.

If Cruz is damaging for Christianity then the rest of the luke warm to cold pretenders are nailing the coffin shut. :wink:


#60

His true colors are that he believes that the world revolves around American neo-conservativism and that Southern Baptist Fundamentalism is the center of true Christianity.

Jim


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