Ugandan president signs anti-gay bill, defying the West


#1

And the insanity continues.

reuters.com/article/2014/02/24/us-uganda-gaybill-idUSBREA1N05S20140224

hrw.org/news/2014/02/24/uganda-law-rolls-back-basic-rights


#2

Indeed. Looks like it’s time to cut all of their military and economic aid.


#3

Amazing… the media is not so concerned about the egregious human rights violations such as sexual slavery in other countries but we are furious that a sovereign nation writes into law that having sex with minors or by spreading HIV you will go to jail. Is that such a bad thing? Also isn’t the law on hold while waiting for scientists to demonstrate being a homosexual is genetic?

Like the big kerfluffle over Putin’s gay propaganda comments, much ado about nothing. We have far more serious issues in the world than whether Bob and Joe can get it on. People are dying in Kiev and in Caracas but golly what if Suzy and Sally get a ticket for playing kissy face in public. The obsession over homosexuals’ sex lives truly baffles me. Dead people seem a lot more important. Let’s focus on those African countries where Christians are being slaughtered before wasting ten seconds on this trivia.

Lisa


#4

President Museveni said in a statement released on Friday that countries ‘should relate with each other on the basis of mutual respect and independence.’

‘Africans do not seek to impose their views on anybody,’ Museveni said in the statement, which was published in the government-controlled New Vision as a response to U.S. criticism of the bill.

’We do not want anybody to impose their views on us. This very debate was provoked by Western groups who come to our schools and try to recruit children into homosexuality. It is better to limit the damage rather than exacerbate it.'

and…

The bill has been championed by Christian clerics and politicians in Uganda who say it is necessary to deter Western homosexuals from ‘recruiting’ Ugandan children.

The above quotes were from dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2566425/Ugandas-president-sign-anti-gay-bill-Monday.html but I’ve spotted similar in pretty much every “mainstream” media article so far.

What does that mean exactly? What is he saying? The groups from “The West” were coming into their schools and molesting/drawing children into homosexuality?

What groups were these? Was it foreign aid groups that many of us have been sending $$ to for the past 40 years or so (with little to no real material improvements)?

What’s going on here? I think there’s a lot more going on under the surface that we’re pretty naïve about. I also think that Museveni is about to get “spanked” by the newly Unchristian West. Whether that means a lot of poison press rolling out about him, or civil unrest, who knows.


#5

:clapping::clapping::dancing::clapping:


#6

Sorry but I waited too long and now can’t edit my above post to add this nugget:

cnn.com/2014/02/24/world/africa/uganda-homosexuality-interview/

Museveni also told CNN that the West should not force its beliefs onto Ugandans.

“Respect African societies and their values,” he said. “If you don’t agree, just keep quiet. Let us manage our society, then we will see. If we are wrong, we shall find out by ourselves, just the way we don’t interfere with yours.”

He also said Westerners brought homosexuality to his country, corrupting society by teaching Ugandans about homosexuality. The West has also helped make children at schools homosexual by funding groups that spread homosexuality, he said.

What does this mean? Is this just crazy finger pointing to feed the Ugandan public and stir up anti-west feelings or just what the heck was going on with Western aid groups?


#7

While I doubt if Uganda had NO homosexuality before we came to “help” out the Ugandans, I believe that the militant pro abortion, pro contraception and pro gay “rights” secular Left has promoted normalization of homosexuality as with its other genitalia obsessions. For the Left it seems like sex Uber Alles. They are far more interested in protecting sexual activity than life. Christians and other non Muslims are being slaughtered in the most gruesome ways and not a peep from POTUS. But any hint that a sovereign nation wishes to set its own standards and the UN and other Leftists start screaming about withholding funds. Same response to African countries that want to promote abstinence instead of condoms or want to restrict access to abortions. If they don’t kowtow to the secular Left, well off with their heads…

Lisa


#8

Good evening, gracepoole,

Thanks for posting.

It’s high time the West’s obsession with homosexuality was defied. God bless that president, these are my remarks to the first link.

The second links title screaming about rights misses the marks. Other than between one man and one woman in holy wedlock, there are no such things as sexual rights. The gays, our president and his followers and the western media are hyperventilating about an illusion, to put it politely, when the carry on about gay rights.

God loves you and may His Truth prevail,
Don.


#9

First, if you think the only result of this bill is criminalizing the spread of HIV, you should read the HRW statement I linked in my OP. Second, this isn’t a choice between those trafficked and those oppressed through the criminalization of homosexuality – one can actually be outraged by both. Let’s not inject a red herring into the conversation. Third, the Church has previously stated that it opposes the criminalization of homosexuality (see below). It’s somewhat baffling, then, that Catholics here are championing this kind of bill.

According to AsiaNews, Cardinal Gracias, a member of the Council of Cardinals advising Pope Francis on Curial reform, said “the Catholic Church has never been opposed to the decriminalisation of homosexuality, because we have never considered gay people criminals.”


‘Gay People Are Not Criminals’, Says Cardinal Gracias


#10

Sexual rights are very real. What consenting adults do together is no ones business but theirs.


#11

Talk about a red herring Gracepoole…

Anti-sodomy bills and laws are quite ineffective but I see no reason to tell a sovereign nation it cannot set its own standards regarding behavior of its people. Even if these laws go into effect, I doubt if homosexuals who are engaging in sexual activity are going to be dragged from their bedrooms and put in jail. OTOH if the laws have some teeth and a minor is preyed upon or if someone with active HIV engages in sexual activity knowing that he/she is positive than I’m all for the laws that put these evil predators in jail.

Further my main point is the rabid hysteria that occurs whenever there is the slightest verbal or legal objection to homosexuals publicly proclaiming their “pride” or engaging in sexual displays or not wanting this infesting our kindergarten classes. Yet as you might know the world is currently experiencing the most gruesome attacks on Christians in Africa, Iraq, Syria and other nations. This barely results in a “meh?” from POTUS, from the media, from the pop culture elites. Perez Hilton and Rachel Maddow are far more concerned with whether Joe and Steve get a wedding cake than whether people are being HACKED TO PIECES by radical Islamists.

I think their priorities are perverted.

Lisa


#12

76crimes.com/76-countries-where-homosexuality-is-illegal

Do you mean you this is the right solution ??

So , you agree with discrimination is ok ??

So , discrimination is perfectly alright ??

Discrimination is a sin and a hate crime !!
18 U.S. 245
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_crime#United_States

ewtn.com/expert/answers/ten_commandments.htm

I say , leave the gay-society , let them live !!
Just as you don’t love it they bash catholics , stop bashing homosexuals !!
They are humans beings , just as us , hetero-sexuals !!


#13

MODERATOR NOTICE

Please charitably discuss the issues, not each other


#14

Third, the Church has previously stated that it opposes the criminalization of homosexuality (see below). It’s somewhat baffling, then, that Catholics here are championing this kind of bill.

Is the law criminalizing homosexuals or homosexual ACTIVITY? There’s a difference. Admittedly I haven’t read the entire law that was signed, just the bits about “homosexual acts with a minor, a disabled person or someone infected wth H.I.V.” but I’m sure consensual sodomitic acts between consenting adults are also penalized under this law. One could argue the manifest health issues and concern for public safety on that one.

How does one criminalize a homosexual orientation anyhow? It would be impossible to prove wouldn’t it (unless one confessed openly to it). And would absolutely be anti-Christian. But homosexual activity is an entirely different animal.

I’m not sure what I think of this law yet and will have to peruse the bill in its entirety first. I can see how this can turn into a “witch hunt” and an easy way to target enemies.

While I doubt if Uganda had NO homosexuality before we came to “help” out the Ugandans,

Right, I think that’s wishful thinking on his part (if he actually believes it). But…there’s something to all of this. It seems to be a foot stomping by an African president saying “enough” to western influence and calling out what that influence has been over the past few decades and this is really the first time we (the people of the west) are hearing this. It’s stunning actually. The Big Rich West Running To The Aid Of Poor Africa might actually have had ugly, sinister, underlying motives? And we may have contributed financially to this by donating to a variety of groups? That’s what I want to find out more, what were these non-profit groups really up to?

Also note the media is doing its best to throw in “Evangelical Christian Groups” as being the culprit (of the anti-gay laws and sentiment).

In the meantime, more blurbs from the mainstream media:

nytimes.com/2014/02/25/world/europe/ugandan-president-to-sign-antigay-law.html

While Western gay-rights campaigners have accused American evangelical Christian groups of promoting antigay sentiment in Uganda, Mr. Museveni accused “arrogant and careless Western groups” of seeking to draw Ugandan children into homosexuality.

and

The country’s Parliament approved the law in December, saying it was aimed “at strengthening the nation’s capacity to deal with emerging internal and external threats to the traditional heterosexual family.”

and

According to Amnesty International, homosexuality is illegal in 38 of 54 African countries, but Western opposition to such measures is frequently criticized as akin to imperialism.

washingtonpost.com/world/africa/ugandan-leader-signs-harsh-anti-gay-bill-despite-warning-from-obama-administration/2014/02/24/88486066-9d63-11e3-878c-65222df220eb_story.html

“There’s now an attempt at social imperialism, to impose social values. We’re sorry to see that you [the West] live the way you live but we keep quiet about it,” he said, according to the Reuters news agency.

Discussing Western pressure to not sign the bill, Museveni said: “We Africans always keep our opinions to ourselves and never seek to impose our point of view on others. If only they could let us alone.”

It seems pretty clear that the line has been drawn in the sand and foreign aid/assistance (manna) is not worth it, they find the traditional family structure worth fighting for. Or this could all just be some political game playing out with objectives we’re not aware of yet.

I don’t know much about Uganda and whether or not it has the necessary financial and political stability to withstand the western withdrawl of funds.


#15

I don’t think we’re using the same definition of “red herring”…

Again, I’ll reiterate that it’s possible to have outrage simultaneously for various international problems. But those other problems aren’t what’s at issue here.


#16

Here are some choice excerpts:

“touching” includes touching—

(a) with any part of the body;

(b) with anything else;

© through anything;

(1) A person commits the offence of homosexuality if—

© he or she touches another person with the intention of committing the act of homosexuality.

  1. Promotion of homosexuality.

(1) A person who—

© offers premises and other related fixed or movable assets for purposes of homosexuality or promoting homosexuality;

(d) uses electronic devices which include internet, films, mobile phones for purposes of homosexuality or promoting homosexuality; or

(e) who acts as an accomplice or attempts to promote or in any way abets homosexuality and related practices; commits an offence and is liable, on conviction, to a fine of five thousand currency points or imprisonment of a minimum of five years and a maximum of seven years or both fine and imprisonment.

“serial offender” means a person who has previous convictions of the offence of homosexuality or related offences;

  1. A person commits the offence of aggravated homosexuality where the—

(f) offender is a serial offender;

(2) A person who commits the offence of aggravated homosexuality shall be liable, on conviction, to imprisonment for life.

Don’t speak out too loudly or too much against this law in Uganda; you might find yourself imprisoned for life.


#17

It may not be the* best *solution but it is certainly a better solution that what we have seen in many countries, including the US.

So you agree with discrimination is ok ??

Yes, most forms of discrimination are not only “ok” but good. Discrimination against immoral behavior is not only “ok”, it is required of Christians.

So , discrimination is perfectly alright ??

You are repeating yourself.

Discrimination is a sin and a hate crime !!

No, it isn’t. As far as sin goes, only unjust discrimination against people is sinful.

Hate crimes only cover certain forms of discrimination, the definition of which changes at the whim of the courts. A good example is that discrimination against Catholics or violence against heterosexuals is not covered under hate crime legislation although both are much more immoral than laws against homosexual activity or propaganda.


#18

76crimes.com/76-countries-where-homosexuality-is-illegal

Discrimination is a sin and a hate crime !!
18 U.S. 245
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_crime#United_States

ewtn.com/expert/answers/ten_commandments.htm

I say , leave the gay-society , let them live !!
Just as you don’t love it they bash catholics , stop bashing homosexuals !!
They are humans beings , just as us hetero-sexuals !!


#19

Bravo! Hats off to President Museveni!

Blasted Western cultural imperialism…


#20

It seems to me the Ugandans are saying to the active homosexuals:

Leave our kids alone!!

Leave our people alone!!


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