We must be sticklers for correct terminology. As words mean things.
So, it is very difficult for some women to wear a veil, hat, scarf or anything on their head today at Mass, no one likes to stand out or be a despised center of attention, so using it to try to impress others, is way not how it is. It is their desire to please God. When talking to alot of women that do cover, you more than likely will hear how difficult it is but they want to obey.
God bless. I think I have expressed more than my share of comments, so I think I will try to bow out of this thread.
I still have my mother’s mantilla (veil) from the 1960’s.
Yes, for some.
I beg to differ.
I don’t think you are trying to impress me. Impress isn’t the right word.
I used to think this. I did this. I no longer think so after so many discussions about “veiling.”
Methinks they dost prosesteth too much.
When did you stop veiling? (just curious)
I think that’s a little long and obstructive for a choir director, though the style is pretty similar to what women wear at my parish. Most of them stop at the shoulder though. We have some older ladies (I suspect Philippino possibly?) who wear a mantilla that is long enough that they wrap it completely around their head and around their necks like a scarf, and the rest lays on their shoulders. I think that would be pretty distracting while directing a choir. (worrying about it falling off, etc)
If no one judged a veiled woman to be singular or an unveiled woman to be a modern feminist, we’d all be happier people.
No, it is not a generalization, it is my lived experience. Not one of my female relatives or friends who is old enough to remember when it was the rule that it is was anything but a “rule”. There was no talk of “spiritual benefits”. It was a custom and rule that has been changed, in Church and in society.
And again, this is why so many people are so fed up with the whole topic. If you are a woman and want to cover your head, fine, have at it. But please, stop romaticizing the whole thing.
This is really unpleasant judgmental commentary.
It may be, but that does not mean it is not truthful in some cases.
I would never say anything like that about a woman who doesn’t veil and even better I would never even think it.
I am not a woman, but if I was and I was in the position your wife is in I think I’d tell him politely that I wasn’t prepared to do that and if it meant I would have to leave the music ministry as a result then so be it.
Just some random thoughts.
Thinking of St. Augustine’s reply of “humility, humility, humility…” - well, it was somebody’s answer, any way, but it applies to all of us, from parishioners to priests.
Then I think I’d write to the Bishop after letting the priest know once again how I felt & if he insisted that the veil’s got to go, but that’s just me. Don’t think I’d want to be in a parish where the priest has a problem with something like this, instead of appreciating someone trying to be holy. Does this priest really have a problem with the veil or was it just a passing comment? Also wondering, from the OP’s wife, if the priest really understands how important the veil is to her.
If there are problems in parishes like irregular marriages, slackening attendance, the poor, young people leaving the church, decreasing attendance at confession, people taking communion unworthily, a general loss of faith and overall lukewarmness, cafeteria Catholics (like those who think they can contracept & still be Catholic), I think it’s odd that any practicing Catholic, especially in U.S. society, would have a problem with someone trying to be as holy as they can. What are the priorities in the Catholic faith?
Knowing that we all need to love God with all our heart, then ourselves & neighbor, how does wearing a veil/not wearing a veil in our society figure?
But then again, I’ve been treated by some Catholics as holier-than-thou because they let me know I wasn’t as good as they are.
Just some thoughts, thanks for listening.
I have no negative memories of having worn head coverings in the past. I likewise have no memory of the good sisters giving us any reason why we should cover our heads other than, " because St. Paul said so."
I would have been, and still am today, puzzled by the concept that the hats, headbands, scarves, and school beanies I regularly wore to cover my head could be considered, “veiling.” They most certainly were not veils, even in the abstract.
I never ‘veiled’, although I regularly covered my head, occasionally --though very rarely-- with an 8-inch diameter beige chapel cap.
I’m pretty sure most people don’t. I see women at Mass all the time who wear a mantilla. I don’t give it a thought. It’s when women talk about “veiling” as if that was ever a thing. It wasn’t and it isn’t—not for lay women.
And, @donruggero pointed out so well, wearing a head covering of any kind is not a ‘calling.’ It’s a pious practice that is completely voluntary—and in no way does it indicate the person doing it is more reverent or humble than one who doesn’t.
And in this case, the OP’s wife can hardly claim an act of disobedience due to a personal preference is an act of humility.
So very much this. We didn’t veil, we covered our heads. Often with Kleenex when we forgot our beanies.
Years ago, the retreat house I went to had a basket of mantillas on the flight of steps down to the chapel. Above the basket was a sign:
ALL WOMEN AND GIRLS MUST COVER THEIR HEADS IN THE PRESENCE OF THE BLESSED SACRAMENT.
I am a little rattled by it too. Do you hear mercy in this commentary, love of neighbor? Stick with the veil is my advice - seems to be working if you catch my drift.
It’s a devotion that I was called to BECAUSE I’m not perfect. LOL. For me personally I believe God called (yes, called) me to do it because I have a real problem with vanity and when I wear my little hats they do obscure my face and hide the things I am ‘vain’ about, like my hair. At mass, especially, I feel it’s important to do this one little thing that is humbling.
I by NO MEANS think women who don’t cover are less holy… I figure they must be LESS vain than me if God hasn’t put this devotion on their heart. LOL
Oh, I like hats - on others - even if only one person is wearing them. I. myself, don’t like to wear them.
I went to mass in Italy and Spain a lot. There, the women wearing the lace mantillas were at least 80 and widowed. Most of them were terribly mean. Younger women did not wear them unless going to a funeral. So, I associate them with elderly, nasty widows and death. (There is nothing at all wrong with being elderly. I hope to be elderly myself some day. It’s the nastiness I didn’t like.)
The white chapel rounds look sweet on little girls.