Veiling challenge


#310

Hey, are you sitting behind me? :eyes::laughing:


#311

I was describing myself, but…I could be.


#312

Thank you, @SMHW.


#313

Truthfully it has probably described almost every woman I personally know who covers her hair at least once!

I find the argument that because a veil or hat is pretty it means the woman wearing it can’t be modest or humble to be…odd. Maybe next time I’ll wear PJs and a paper bag on my head for penance?

(Or maybe it just fits into the idea of “Sunday best”? I don’t dress ostentatiously, but yes, I do try to wear attractive clothes and have my head covering fit. I don’t stick out. Well, at least not because of the headcovering. Maybe because of the children. :relieved:)


#314

You are welcome.

Of course in the last few years there have been some “language developments” regarding what is or is not a mantilla and whether or not “veiling” is synonymous with “covering”.

:smirk:


#315

I think hats look fine. They do not call undue attention to the wearer even if she’s the only one wearing a hat.

Still, the pastor has the final say about the ministries in his church. If he wants an uncovered head, and the wife of the OP won’t comply, I guess she would have to give up the choir director’s job. She should talk to him privately, and then accept whatever decision they reach.


#316

A mantilla is a traditional Spanish lace or silk veil or shawl worn over the head and shoulders, often over a high comb called a peineta, popular with women in Spain. The shape, design and use are different from an ordinary veil.

“Veiling” is bad enough. I hope no one adds “mantillaing” to our vernacular! :scream:


#317

I’ve actually been thinking about this quite a bit.

My recollection of the veils women wore when I was young is that they had kind of an invisibility cloak nature. I’m not sure I ever saw white ones. The ones I saw growing up tended to blend into the woman’s hair in the front.

There weren’t all that many Hispanic or Italian women in my parish so…

They just didn’t look the same as the ones I see today at Mass or in pictures.


#318

That is definitely different from what I wear and what I’ve seen people calling a mantilla. Are the women you have such repeatedly negative reactions to wearing giant lacey capes with a high comb as pictured in the article you link?


#319

No, just smaller triangular ones, and no comb.

I really don’t care who wears what. I just have a negative reaction, but I’d never insult the woman. Maybe she hates what I’m wearing! LOL And that’s okay.


#320

I just don’t see how I’d be less conspicuous in a hat tomorrow than in some brown lace on my brown hair. I guess we are all having this conversation but we come from all over. So reactions to hats is as differing as reactions to veils.


#321

I guess for me it’s because hats are common in the US culture, and I even come from Brazil, so I’m a Latina (but not a Hispanic).

I see hats all over the US so never think twice if a woman wears one to church.

I can’t speak for anyone else, of course.


#322

Those pictures are what FIRST comes to my mind when I hear the word “mantilla” but I don’t know if I’ve ever seen one outside of the movies, television, and the internet.

I know that’s not what I see women wearing today but it doesn’t stop the initial word image.


#323

The word mantilla really just means “mantle” or cover but it has come to refer to a specific traditional item of clothing. I believe the corresponding word in French word is mantille. French mantilles made from lace seem to be less triangular and more rounded than the Latin mantillas. I think mantille is sometimes translated to English as “shawl” but I never took French in school so…

I think I could accept the word ‘mantling’ more than I could the word ‘veiling’.


#324

One has only to read the early Fathers, examine early art, the Catacombs, examine Eastern cultures and rites that even today take the custom seriously, or even the nuns of pre VatII to discern that the veil that St Paul speaks of in Corinthians is meant to hide all hair and should be opaque not sheer or diaphonous.

A mantilla (dating from C16) and many other vain female “coverings” in the West which, more recently, purport to satisfy this ancient eastern custom re the veil in fact it seems have never seriously done so!


#325

[quote=“BoomBoomMancini, post:297, topic:501056, full:true”]
I mean, I knew you Europeans were liberated but that seems excessive…

Nah, just conservative. Pants are immodest, didn´t you knew? We don´t wear them for this reason. To add, the parish is mostly russian, so bagna culture is all we love :roll_eyes::joy:


#326

Most of the chapel veils or mantillas I see are like this. The color blends into the woman’s hair. I’ve never seen a high comb. When the veil is white or another brighter color, it coordinates with the rest of the outfit. Once out of church, almost every woman slips it down to a scarf or takes it off and puts it in her bag.

Both the OF and EF Masses we attend have a lot of women who cover their heads, with veils, hats, scarves, caps, etc. And a lot of women don’t (even at the EF.) And nobody cares!


#327

I could, too since only religious “take the veil.”


#328

I don’t know if this is true, but I think I remember hearing somewhere that women of…ill-repute…in the olden days didn’t cover their hair and/or wore excessive hair decorations. Maybe the purpose of the head covering was to show a distinction from that sort of thing and be counter-cultural? Again, I don’t know how true that was…but I have a vague recollection hearing/reading that somewhere…


#329

Vain as in vanity or vain as in useless?

At it’s worst my veil can and had become a scruple for me.

At it’s best it made me really feel as I stepped through the door into a church or chapel where Jesus is present in the Eucharist, my popping it on was acknowledging to Our Lord that I knew I was in a special place. Growing in love for His True Presence isn’t useless.

I guess the argument could be made that it is arbitrary. Someone could decide they are going to wear a large wool sock over their left shoe as they enter the sanctuary to honor Our Lord. The person could be sincere in their odd intentions and develop some scruples that make it difficult for them to stop.


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