What are The Differences between a chaste Heterosexual and a chaste Homosexual?


#1

I recently came out with some of my close friends that I am gay, but its been hard accepting the type of lifestyle that my sexual preference calls for being catholic. Im willing to work with it because I know that God's word is true and that I will find true happiness within him. So with my understanding is that I am called to a life of Chastity. What is the differences between a chaste Heterosexual and a chaste Homosexual? What can a chaste Heterosexual do compared to a chaste Homosexual? Are we still able to hold hands, hug each other and even kiss each other on the cheek or a peck on the lips? What is the line that we cannot cross as a chaste Homosexual?


#2

=ckaji15;10038364]I recently came out with some of my close friends that I am gay, but its been hard accepting the type of lifestyle that my sexual preference calls for being catholic. Im willing to work with it because I know that God's word is true and that I will find true happiness within him. So with my understanding is that I am called to a life of Chastity. What is the differences between a chaste Heterosexual and a chaste Homosexual? What can a chaste Heterosexual do compared to a chaste Homosexual? Are we still able to hold hands, hug each other and even kiss each other on the cheek or a peck on the lips? What is the line that we cannot cross as a chaste Homosexual?

Any act intened to be sexually arrousing.

May God grant you all of the graqce you need and deserve my friend!:thumbsup:
Stay close to God and the sacraments.

Granddaddy used to say:

We're alot less likely OT to find trouble IF we don't go looking for it.:)

God's Continued Blessings,
pat/PJM


#3

hello there, i just read your post... I think that you will be given a special grace to live the lifestyle that God wants for you.
I think the best way to think about this is this; when a heterosexual couple have a relationship, (that being not just a friendship)ie they are intent on getting to know one another with a view to marriage. Kissing and any kind of intimacy is really only for marriage. even a small kiss on the cheek is one of the most arousing things if you love that person!! so i don't believe that it would be right or fare to have any 'relationship' with someone of the same sex. Friendship is different, but if you feel you are falling in love then you cant carry on with that friendship. You need to find other guys like you see that chastity is the answer. God will help you to find His peace and love in friendships. If there is nothing wrong with kissing , holding hands then why would it be wrong of me to kiss and hold hands with someone else's boyfriend or husband ? there is a very correct place for affection and Gods plan is only for man and woman to be one, and multiply, Marriage, but 'it is not good for man to be alone'. I have heard that there are networks of people with same sex attraction and a whole support network, please search and find them.

God Bless you and those close to you.


#4

If by "difference" you mean value, worth or dignity, there is no difference between a chaste homosexual and a chaste heterosexual.

A chaste homosexual is bound by the same rules as a chaste heterosexual; if I can't do it with the opposite sex, you can't do it with your own.

Holding hands, hugging etc;. This depends: in some cultures, this is normal behaviour which carries no sexual overtones. French men sometimes kiss on the cheek; Arabs sometimes hold hands, Italians hug each other for dear life. However, I suppose you mean can you do these things sexually, and the answer is no, you cannot.

What is the line a chaste homosexual cannot cross? The same one a chaste heterosexual cannot.

I realize what I am saying sounds very cold and, if you are a young man facing into a life of solitariness, bloody frightening. Bear in mind that you will not be young forever, that upholding your duties as a Catholic will strengthen your spirit as exercise will strengthen your body and, as you grow older, you WILL enter a spiritual upland where what is denied to you in the flesh will not seem anything like the loss it may appear to you now. Many heterosexuals live solitary lives within Catholicism (and not just priests) and it is no harder for them than it is for you.

You can do this, and never allow anyone to tell you that you cannot.


#5

2349 "People should cultivate [chastity] in the way that is suited to their state of life. Some profess virginity or consecrated celibacy which enables them to give themselves to God alone with an undivided heart in a remarkable manner. Others live in the way prescribed for all by the moral law, whether they are married or single." Married people are called to live conjugal chastity; others practice chastity in continence:

There are three forms of the virtue of chastity: the first is that of spouses, the second that of widows, and the third that of virgins. We do not praise any one of them to the exclusion of the others. . . . This is what makes for the richness of the discipline of the Church.

scborromeo.org/ccc/para/2349.htm


#6

There is a good book called "Catholic Sexual Ethics," Second edition by Lawler, Boyle and May and they go into this a little bit. There are good documents about that may give better understanding.

LETTER TO THE BISHOPS OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH
ON THE PASTORAL CARE OF HOMOSEXUAL PERSONS
vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_19861001_homosexual-persons_en.html


#7

[quote="Mustard, post:4, topic:305595"]
If by "difference" you mean value, worth or dignity, there is no difference between a chaste homosexual and a chaste heterosexual.

A chaste homosexual is bound by the same rules as a chaste heterosexual; if I can't do it with the opposite sex, you can't do it with your own.

Holding hands, hugging etc;. This depends: in some cultures, this is normal behaviour which carries no sexual overtones. French men sometimes kiss on the cheek; Arabs sometimes hold hands, Italians hug each other for dear life. However, I suppose you mean can you do these things sexually, and the answer is no, you cannot.

What is the line a chaste homosexual cannot cross? The same one a chaste heterosexual cannot.

I realize what I am saying sounds very cold and, if you are a young man facing into a life of solitariness, bloody frightening. Bear in mind that you will not be young forever, that upholding your duties as a Catholic will strengthen your spirit as exercise will strengthen your body and, as you grow older, you WILL enter a spiritual upland where what is denied to you in the flesh will not seem anything like the loss it may appear to you now. Many heterosexuals live solitary lives within Catholicism (and not just priests) and it is no harder for them than it is for you.

You can do this, and never allow anyone to tell you that you cannot.

[/quote]

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

This is an excellent response to your question. Well written Mustard.


#8

[quote="ckaji15, post:1, topic:305595"]
I recently came out with some of my close friends that I am gay, but its been hard accepting the type of lifestyle that my sexual preference calls for being catholic. Im willing to work with it because I know that God's word is true and that I will find true happiness within him. So with my understanding is that I am called to a life of Chastity. What is the differences between a chaste Heterosexual and a chaste Homosexual? What can a chaste Heterosexual do compared to a chaste Homosexual? Are we still able to hold hands, hug each other and even kiss each other on the cheek or a peck on the lips? What is the line that we cannot cross as a chaste Homosexual?

[/quote]

Morally there is zero difference between a chaste person with same-sex attraction ("homosexual" implies an attive participation in that lifestyle) and any other chaste person (married or single).

Practically, however, I would think a person with SSA striving to live chastely would need to be more restrictive. You wouldn't want to form a close bond with another person with SSA that involved hugging/kissing/holding hands b/c it could be a temptation.

Single people seeking marriage have to put themselves in this state and take the risk, but a priest or religious (for example) should not have that sort of relationship with the opposite sex.

God Bless


#9

I second the comment on social norms. My friend, being homosexual does NOT exclude you from being allowed to form very deep, meaningful, and loving friendships with the same sex. There's nothing sexual or immoral about embracing someone, holding hands. it all depends on context. I'm sorry to say though that it does seem such affection is FAR more accepted between girls, than btween guys, here in the US. It is often recommended, though, to try and form such friendships with people who do not suffer from SSA. It's not a set in stone must, especially as you grow in faith, but it can be less of an occasion of sin


#10

[quote="LittleFlower378, post:6, topic:305595"]
There is a good book called "Catholic Sexual Ethics," Second edition by Lawler, Boyle and May and they go into this a little bit. There are good documents about that may give better understanding.

LETTER TO THE BISHOPS OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH
ON THE PASTORAL CARE OF HOMOSEXUAL PERSONS
vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_19861001_homosexual-persons_en.html

[/quote]

Having read the letter that you've linked, I love the charity and concern that permeate it, I'm in admiration of how well it is written, no aspect of homosexuality has been left unadressed. I think nobody loves the homosexual persons in the truest sense of the word more than the Catholic Church. Charitable and uncompromising. This text is a gem. :thumbsup:, LittleFlower.


#11

Thanks to everyone who has given there time to help me out and not only will this help me but i believe your support will help others like me who are tyring to find their place as a catholic who happens to be homosexual. No matter what age, nationality, or sex that we are, we are all children of God and that comes first. I have an amazing Youth Minister that taught me that the things that we believe is the foundation of our lives can be subject to change. She made us write down things that are true about us. I wrote a big list of my dreams and talents that God has blessed me with. Then she told us to cross off anything that pertained to what she said.* "Cross off anything that will no longer be true after high school"* - I crossed off a couple things. "Cross off anything that will no longer be true due to age, illness or any type of disablement" - I crossed off a lot from that. "Cross off anything that is a statement, an opinion or anything that is unmeasurable" - I no longer was fierce haha. Then she told us to say out loud everything that was left in my list. *"My name is Craig, I am a child of God, I am Filipino." *I realized that everything that I have made so dear in my life could change, but me being a Child of God would never change and thats what matters most. Today I am Homosexual, but that is subject to change. I may realize that the importance of me finding a homosexual relationship may change within a year or 5 years or 30 years. I know that as long as I have God in the center of my life, everything will fall into place.


#12

[quote="ckaji15, post:11, topic:305595"]
Thanks to everyone who has given there time to help me out and not only will this help me but i believe your support will help others like me who are tyring to find their place as a catholic who happens to be homosexual. No matter what age, nationality, or sex that we are, we are all children of God and that comes first. I have an amazing Youth Minister that taught me that the things that we believe is the foundation of our lives can be subject to change. She made us write down things that are true about us. I wrote a big list of my dreams and talents that God has blessed me with. Then she told us to cross off anything that pertained to what she said.* "Cross off anything that will no longer be true after high school"* - I crossed off a couple things. "Cross off anything that will no longer be true due to age, illness or any type of disablement" - I crossed off a lot from that. "Cross off anything that is a statement, an opinion or anything that is unmeasurable" - I no longer was fierce haha. Then she told us to say out loud everything that was left in my list. *"My name is Craig, I am a child of God, I am Filipino." *I realized that everything that I have made so dear in my life could change, but me being a Child of God would never change and thats what matters most. Today I am Homosexual, but that is subject to change. I may realize that the importance of me finding a homosexual relationship may change within a year or 5 years or 30 years. I know that as long as I have God in the center of my life, everything will fall into place.

[/quote]

Let me say this: I'm so proud of you, kabayan. Mabuhay ka! Your sexual preference will be your cross. But do not be afraid, you are not alone in carrying it.


#13

The purpose of any sort of romantic relationship is to lead to (or to discern) marriage and procreation. So a heterosexually inclined person with the intent to stay single should not be engaging in any of the affectionate practices you described as part of a romantic relationship. Of course a faithful Catholic with same sex attraction will also always remain single. So there shouldn't be any romantic relationships, and therefore not the affection that goes along with one.

Technically then, there isn't a difference, except that the heterosexual person can say, "well I MIGHT get married." Practically speaking, most heterosexual single people don't understand what chastity really means, and don't restrict their romantic relationships to marriage discernment, so it feels more unfair to the same-sex attracted person who DOES understand the call to chastity. From a spiritual perspective though, the faithful person with same sex attraction could be better off than the uninformed hetero single, because knowing that the answer is "always no, all the time" makes it easier not to fall into temptation, than the person who thinks of dating as recreation. And I don't mean to minimize the struggle that it must be to be in your position. In practical terms, I know it must be a heavy cross, as was mentioned.

It is inspiring for me to read about people who take their faith seriously enough to to counteract the strong cultural pull. Thank you for being a witness to the Truth! God bless you!


#14

If Jesus was a chaste heterosexual then give me a reason why His heterosexuality--which is ordered--should not be emulated?

Now of course a woman should not emulate Christ's masculinity--but why shouldn't everyone emulate His chaste heterosexuality?

I think emulating just His chastity is a cop out.

If God intended that human's sexuality should be ordered and not disordered--as is the case with homosexuality--shouldn't heterosexuality be emulated in all of us?

In other words heterosexuality involves more than just chastity--it involves the way we relate to the opposite sex in non sexual ways.

Why shouldn't people who have same sex attraction strive to have opposite sex attraction while still being chaste?


#15

[quote="Jerry-Jet, post:14, topic:305595"]
If Jesus was a chaste heterosexual then give me a reason why His heterosexuality--which is ordered--should not be emulated?

Now of course a woman should not emulate Christ's masculinity--but why shouldn't everyone emulate His chaste heterosexuality?

I think emulating just His chastity is a cop out.

If God intended that human's sexuality should be ordered and not disordered--as is the case with homosexuality--shouldn't heterosexuality be emulated in all of us?

In other words heterosexuality involves more than just chastity--it involves the way we relate to the opposite sex in non sexual ways.

Why shouldn't people who have same sex attraction strive to have opposite sex attraction while still being chaste?

[/quote]

...Wooooow. I don't EVEN know where to start with this mess. That is so unchartiable and cruel! Don't you think it's hard ENOUGH for a Catholic homosexual to strive with chastity, already a hard thing for anyone, without pressuring them by saying that's not enough? It IS enough! You can't prove that homosexuality can be "cured" or go away. For every "sucess" story, there are a half dozen failures. And now you're going to make chaste people who have SSA feel somehow lesser-than!


#16

Chastity is misunderstood here.

We are ALL called to live a chaste life, even married people.

A married man can still have sex as a chatse man. A homosexual can't.

A chaste life is living sexually according to one's state in life: married, single, celebrate.

A married man who has sex with his wife in a selfish manner, or even in a mutually selfish way with his wife is NOT living his sexuality in a chaste manner.

Abstinence is a general practice of the virtue of temperance.

Continence (no sex) is a specific practice of temperance, applied to sexual matters.

Married men may at times be required to live a continent life...when away from his spouse, to train or master himself, if he feels his sexual expression and desires are becoming selfish, etc.


#17

Correlating with Edward's post- persons with homosexual attraction can marry members of the opposite sex and engage in properly ordered sexual relations with their husband or wife of the opposite sex even if they still feel a same sex attraction- this may have been more frequent formerly than it is today. Other than this exception, homosexual-oriented Catholics must abstain from sexual relations, period- as must single heterosexual Catholics.


#18

[quote="Jerry-Jet, post:14, topic:305595"]
If Jesus was a chaste heterosexual then give me a reason why His heterosexuality--which is ordered--should not be emulated?

Now of course a woman should not emulate Christ's masculinity--but why shouldn't everyone emulate His chaste heterosexuality?

I think emulating just His chastity is a cop out.

If God intended that human's sexuality should be ordered and not disordered--as is the case with homosexuality--shouldn't heterosexuality be emulated in all of us?

In other words heterosexuality involves more than just chastity--it involves the way we relate to the opposite sex in non sexual ways.

Why shouldn't people who have same sex attraction strive to have opposite sex attraction while still being chaste?

[/quote]

You misunderstand the meaning of chaste. Jesus lived his celibate vocation in a chaste manner. I have lived my married vocation in as a chaste manner as I can.

Chaste doesn't mean no sex...it means living ones sexuality in accord with one's chosen state in life.


#19

unless it is a near occasion of sin for you to hold hands, hug each other, kiss on the cheeks they are fine, French kissing is an absolutely terrible idea become of how it is sexually stimulating.

For a young person Courage doesn’t really help because the people tend to be middle aged or older.

I suppose the good news is that everyone dies eventually

When the Catechims uses the phrase homosexual persons or homosexual tendencies do those imply active participation in whatever lifestyle you are talking about.

That’s actually a fairly recent thing, two cetnuries ago when were a lot more emotionally open.

huh?

The Bible doesn’t make a comment either way on sexuality.

I don’t think you realise how few people suddenly become attracted to the opposite sex.

Why on Earth would they want to?


#20

Not saying they would want to, Dakota. But they can't say they don't have an alternative to a life of single chastity!:)


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