some say the Church is infested with demons…
just wondering… i tend to think so…
some say the Church is infested with demons…
just wondering… i tend to think so…
I think it is true if only understood in the proper context. The Church is the biggest enemy to Satan, and it is obviously the main target of demonic forces. That is totally different from saying that the Church is demonic, but the Church has been fighting those who infiltrate the Body of Christ, it has always happened, and there are different eras in history where evil has taken larger residence in the Church. The evil is here not because of what the Church teaches, but to lead people away from the Truth of what She teaches. When you hear watered down distorted things among ‘Catholics’ that influence Catholics to being lax about their faith, or when you see abuse and everything else that is just not Biblical or Traditional teaching handed down from Christ, then you know there is demonic activity in the Church.
This is nothing new, many New Testament authors of the Epistles wrote about it concerning their time, and we also read about it in the Acts of the Apostles. And the Early Church Fathers wrote so much about it too. The battle is real!
I think the demons are infest our hearts. We carry them from church to other places and back again, seven-fold in some cases.
I’m not sure what demons actually are, physically, but I like to think of them like nasty little programs that run like software on the computer of your brain. That is, bad thoughts that like to give birth to other bad thoughts, and spread from one person to another. Like memes.
There may be a better metaphysical description of demons, but I’m an engineer not a metaphysicist, so I look at it in terms of how they seem to effect me based on whatever observation and analysis I’ve done.
I wholeheartedly agree.
I coexist will all sorts of bacteria and germs and creepy-crawlies from the surface of my skin to … if you’ll pardon the expression … the depths of my bowels, most of which are very dangerous if they ever get out of control. But nature has ordained that those millions all work together for my good, as is always the case when God is in charge.
So yes, in that sense, the Church is infested with demons, but it’s all for the better.
when seeing the way some priests and bishops act sometimes i think so too, but as far as like the Pope and maybe my bishop specifically, the demons are not there
that is an odd way to look at it…
my thoughts are that “some people say” is about as reliable as saying “in my opinion” in other words, worthless, not even worth a response
anybody who says “The Catholic Church is infested with demons” must continue to say in the same sentence “Jesus Christ is a liar because he promised the gates of hell would never prevail against his Chruch.” The person who believes that is hardly someone you should be wasting time on.
Is OP going to provide some scripture he wishes to discuss in this context?
Christ said that the gate of hell would never prevail against the Church, not that it wouldn’t be able to try (from my own interpretation).
My mum’s priest friend once told her that in Mass, whenever you get a disturbance- for example, lots of people losing concentration, or whispering- it’s the devil trying to distract us. I’m not sure if that’s just an opinion he made up or not.
My thoughts are these: The Church is beset by demons, but that has been the case since the time of Christ. Witness Judas’ betrayal, or Jesus saying to Peter “get behind me Satan”, or read the epistles to the new-found churches and see how hard the devil was working to make them fail. (Romans 16:17, Corinthians 1:11-13, Galatians 4:8 to name but a few). Where God is working in his people, Satan will also be there working against God. But, as puzzleannie pointed out, no matter how much evil rails against the Church, it will not fall. That’s a promise from Jesus and I believe it.
What exactly do we believe about demons anyway? For example, what powers do they have?
I mean like, once I heard satan had three tools available. He could: 1.) tempt, 2.) accuse, or 3.) deceive. Whether that’s right, that’s kind of what I’m looking for – a quick list of demonic cans and can’ts.
From my former mentally ill situation, I know that I had very vivid experiences which seemed very demonic, and often during Mass. It was troubling, but I learned to let them go and let God handle it because the harder I fought those thoughts the stronger they would become. Eventually they went away. Honestly I’m fairly sure they were from my own imagination, but I don’t know. They all seemed to tie into different aspects of my life somehow, so that’s why I think they were probably not demonic. The good news is they went away. Woo hoo!
CCC2849 Such a battle and such a victory become possible only through prayer. It is by his prayer that Jesus vanquishes the tempter, both at the outset of his public mission and in the ultimate struggle of his agony.
We can pray and repeat the words of Jesus, “Get behind me Satan.” I know that when I go to Charismatic prayer meetings at the church, people sprinkle Holy Water around the church and pray for any bad spirits to leave. Any time we are in a spiritual battle, prayer and Holy Water will help. And tell the demons that we are covered by Jesus’ precious blood. He fought the fight, he will fight our battles for us.
Some ecclesial communities, who call themselves a church, permit contraception, abortion, euthenasia, infanticide, divorce, and same sex unions. Is that the “church” you are refering to?
Perhaps you mean the Church that contains within her membership individuals (less than 1%) who have broken their vows to God, harmed others, and disobeyed the Church’s teachings? Does that, in all fairness, constitute “infested with demons”?
[INDENT]:bible1: For in one **Spirit **were we all **baptized **into one body, whether Jews or Gentiles, whether bond or free; and in one Spirit we have all been made to drink. - 1 Corinthians 12:13[/INDENT]+Distracted . . . in all charity and peace . . .
I think you are profoundly confusing life here on earth . . . which topic Father John Corapi discusses at some length below . . . and life in the . . . Holy Body of Christ . . . which is the true . . . Holy Bride of Christ . . . which is our . . . Holy Mother Church . . . and . . . Christ Jesus . . . is absolutely not . . . “infested with demons” . . . *to my heart to even suggest such a thing borders right on blasphemy . . . *
Certainly life on this earth is plagued and affected by Satan and and the fallen angels (demons) . . . whom God had the blessed and holy . . . **Archangel St. Michael **. . . **Prince of the Heavenly Host **. . . and the Holy :angel1: angels . . . battle against and then cast out of heaven . . . and even as our . . . Blessed Christ . . . had to constantly deal with this at times horrific reality of evil and evil forces every day of **His ** Life on earth . . . not for one second was He ever a part of that evil nor was it ever a part of Him . . . plagued by evil forces . . . yes . . . “infested” . . . NEVER . . . and one of His own disciples . . . Judas Iscariot whom . . . ***Jesus *** . . . God Incarnate . . . worked with for the salvation of Judas’ sinful soul . . . right up to the very end of His life here on earth . . . chose evil rather than absolute good . . . even though **God **was right in front of him in the Flesh . . .
The wonder of being God’s children is that we are members of . . . His HOLY Body . . . sheep of His pasture . . . and all the mighty victorious Power of our Holy God and help of the Heavenly Host . . . and powerful holy angels and holy saints of God . . . are all available to assist our lives here on earth as day by day we learn better and better to . . . know God . . . love God . . . and serve God . . . for the salvation of mankind and the world . . . which is the very purpose of the Church’s life on earth . . .
****[size=]. . . :coffeeread: . . . [/size]
The Battle Between Good and Evil
- Father John Corapi
[INDENT]"One cannot understand reality if one brackets out a large portion of reality - the preternatural order ( :angel1: angels and demons). If you try to arrive at valid conclusions concerning reality, but have left out a good part of that reality you are engaged in an exercise in futility. So many things today can only be understood in the light of this spiritual reality. Have you ever wondered why so many apparently educated and intelligent people just don’t get it, especially with respect to such life and death matters as abortion?
There is a battle that goes on in the spiritual order between the forces of God and the forces of Satan, “the adversary.” This battle between cosmic good and evil, between :angel1: angels and demons, has man caught in the crosshairs. Man is an active player in his own salvation. We need the help of our allies the :angel1: angels. To fail to enlist their help is reckless. To fail to realize the reality of the enemy forces, the demonic legions, can be ultimately and eternally fatal.
We are at war and our battle is NOT against flesh and blood, as St. Paul warns us in :bible1: Ephesians 6. The battle between good and evil, truth and lies, life and death involves these angelic legions - good and evil. We are soldiers in God’s army, like it or not, believe it or not. We must be aware of these fundamental teachings, learn them, and live in accordance with them."[RIGHT]- from Father Corapi’s
October 27, 2009 Newsletter[/RIGHT][/INDENT][RIGHT]. . . all for Jesus+
. . . thank You Blessed Lord+
O glorious prince St. Michael,
chief and commander
of the Heavenly hosts,
**guardian of souls,
vanquisher of rebel spirits,
**servant in the house of the
and our admirable conductor,
you who shine with excellence
and superhuman virtue
deliver us from ALL evil,
who turn to you with confidence
and enable us by your gracious protection
to serve God more and more faithfully
. . . thank you Blessed St. Michael+[/RIGHT]
Demons tempt and torment the militant Church, and from that perspective, yes the Church is “infested” in some way. I would like to make an analogy of a pest (ex. lice) that afflicts the body, yet is not part of that body. The Church is the mystical body of Christ, and those that are attached to the Vine may be afflicted in certain ways. If those branches stay strongly attached and bear fruit, the pests can do no harm. Yes it is a spiritual battle, and so St Paul says we must put on the armour of God.
“Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of his might. Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. For we are not contending against flesh and blood, but against the principalities, against the powers, against the world rulers of this present darkness, against the spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places. Therefore take the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand. Stand therefore, having girded your loins with truth, and having put on the breastplate of righteousness, and having shod your feet with the equipment of the gospel of peace; besides all these, taking the shield of faith, with which you can quench all the flaming darts of the evil one. And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.” (Eph 6;10-17)
Here’s a story a friend of mine once told me…
One day an angel appeared to a fellow named Alan and told him that for one day, he would be given the power to see demons. Alan was a bit nervous about the whole idea but the angel assured him he would stay with him. After finishing his coffee Alan decided to test out his supposed power by taking a stroll through town. The first place they passed was a tavern, but there were no demons in sight. Next they passed a casino and again he saw nothing. Alan was sure he would see some demons hanging around the brothel, but to his surprise there were none. He was beginning to think the angel was having a bit of fun at his expense, but as they approached the Church at the end of the street Alan was astonished to see hundreds of demons. They covered the roof and walls of the Church, some were flying around it, and others were standing in front of the entrance. Alan turned to the angel and asked why none of the other places had demons but the Church was being swarmed by them. The angel replied “The demons are pleased when people enter those other buildings, but they do everything that they can to stop someone from entering a Church. Their greatest desire is to separate men from God.”
Interestingly enough, I recently read that there are at least 800 Satanic groups operating in the city of Rome. I wonder what their target is?
People make all kinds of obscure claims like this all the time. But I wouldn’t worry too much, as I’m sure that the Vatican employs a fair amount of parapsychologists equipped with these:
Basically these have mini particle accelerators and you can shoot them at the demons and trap them inside. As far as I know, they work 100% of the time.
Why is this question in the Sacred Scripture forum?
sorry about the way i worded the OP… was in a hurry… but anyhow, one reason i wanted to discuss this is because i have been in certain Churches in particular where the persons belonging to the Church… well, i could FEEL the evil… And their deeds…&/or what they said…didn’t comform to Christain precepts… This is not judging… i am only stating what i FELT… which may seem subjective as all get out to some people… but soemtimes feelings really do convey reality… in other words, if you feel evil, maybe it really is evil… (rather than some psycological quirk within yourself)
well, there is a kind of connection… but honestly i just made a mistake on the forum chosen… i was in a hurry… etc…
but its rather connected cuz… i have seen priests go totally against the Word in their homilies… seen them say exactly the opposite of the readings that had just been read… If that’s not diabolical, don’t know w hat is… changing the meaning of the text to suit their own liberal views… :mad::mad:
Then often, they don’t even talk about the meaning of the readings just read… go off on some tangent of their own choosing… :mad:
i just use the rosary…
the devil is the ruler of this world… as the Bible tells us… so it stands to reason he would even try to go into the Church… & since there are humans there… he has free access…