What Comes Around goes around - Amazing Thread


#1

Dear CAF,

      Ever since I was very little, I had an awareness of the consequences of our actions.  What comes around goes around.  What we reap is what we sow.  I had a very close friend (let's call her Anna).  Then there was another girl (let's call her Stephanie).  Anna then stole the husband of Stephanie (let's call him Bob).  Then, Anna and Bob had a baby together after being married.  The baby was born handicapped.   Although the names of these people are not real, the entire story did actually happen.  When my parents reflect upon what happened between Anna, Bob, and Stephanie, my parents instinctively comment that the child was born handicapped because Anna stole the husband of another woman.  At first, I did not believe my parents' commentary, but then I remembered the bible verses, "**Every penny shall be paid. . . . What you reap is what you sow."  **What do you guys think about this entire situation?  

      I did not initialy believe my parents because I thought that they were just being superstitious, but I really don't know what to think.

*Do you guys remember what happened to King David's son after he committed adultery with Bathsheba and killed her husband? *


#2

:(

I don't think being "handicapped" is a punishment. I especially don't believe God punishes babies (or their parents) by creating them with handicaps/disabilities/developmental differences.


#3

[quote="Truly_Beloved, post:2, topic:204102"]
:(

I don't think being "handicapped" is a punishment. I especially don't believe God punishes babies (or their parents) by creating them with handicaps/disabilities/developmental differences.

[/quote]

Yeah, I totally agree with you - but this question has puzzled me for so long and it still remains a mystery to me because I cannot forget what happned to King David's son after he had an affair with Bathsheba and killed Bathsheb'as husband.


#4

[quote="NguyenKimPhat, post:1, topic:204102"]
Dear CAF,

      Ever since I was very little, I had an awareness of the consequences of our actions.  What comes around goes around.  What we reap is what we sow.  I had a very close friend (let's call her Anna).  Then there was another girl (let's call her Stephanie).  Anna then stole the husband of Stephanie (let's call him Bob).  Then, Anna and Bob had a baby together after being married.  The baby was born handicapped.   Although the names of these people are not real, the entire story did actually happen.  When my parents reflect upon what happened between Anna, Bob, and Stephanie, my parents instinctively comment that the child was born handicapped because Anna stole the husband of another woman.  At first, I did not believe my parents' commentary, but then I remembered the bible verses, "**Every penny shall be paid. . . . What you reap is what you sow."  **What do you guys think about this entire situation?  

      I did not initialy believe my parents because I thought that they were just being superstitious, but I really don't know what to think.

**Do you guys remember what happened to King David's son **after he committed adultery with Bathsheba and killed her husband?

[/quote]

Am I misinterpreting these bible verses? Am I taking them out of context?


#5

[quote="NguyenKimPhat, post:3, topic:204102"]
Yeah, I totally agree with you - but this question has puzzled me for so long and it still remains a mystery to me ...]

[/quote]

What question, exactly, has been puzzling you? Why the baby was born with a developmental difference? I promise, there are lots of beautifully "different" babies born to folks who don't covet someone's spouse or commit adultery :) ; and there are plenty of folks who cheat on their spouses who have "normal" children.

Or does that specific Bible verse puzzle you?


#6

Regardless of how we view babies and their handicapps, we CANNOT overlook the REALITY that in the Old Testament, God punished King David's son because King David committed adultery and killed Bathsheba's husband.

This is reality - inside the Old Testament, God punished a child for the sin of the child's father.

Now the question - Does this still happen today? Does God still punish children for their parent's sins? God did so in the Old Testament - Would he still do that now?


#7

[quote="NguyenKimPhat, post:6, topic:204102"]
Regardless of how we view babies and their handicapps, we CANNOT overlook the REALITY that in the Old Testament, God punished King David's son because King David committed adultery and killed Bathsheba's husband.

This is reality - inside the Old Testament, God punished a child for the sin of the child's father.

Now the question - Does this still happen today? Does God still punish children for their parent's sins? God did so in the Old Testament - Would he still do that now?

[/quote]

*I am not making any type of statement about God's justice. I am only asking a question. * Is there a possibility/chance that the physcial handicap of a child might be the punishment for the sins of its parent?


#8

[quote="NguyenKimPhat, post:7, topic:204102"]
*I am not making any type of statement about God's justice. I am only asking a question. * Is there a possibility/chance that the physcial handicap of a child might be the punishment for the sins of its parent?

[/quote]

I don't beleive God would do it on purpose under the new Covenant set by Jesus.

However, I accept that we punish ourselves adn our children with our actions when we ignore God. For example, in the OT there's lots of verses about God telling people not to marry their cousins and siblings et al. Now, chances are good if you marry yoru sibling/cousin you could have a child with serious defects because of genetic defects carried as hetrozygous recessive that pop up when two people carrying the same gene get together, which could be familiar.

So, if say Jack and Jill were siblings, and married and had a child and that child had a disability I wouldn't say it was God punishing them for incest, it was shonky genetics that merged with their incestous union.

With that said, I tend to beleive that God doesn't punish everyone who misbehaves in this life, I think the example you are giving just shows that God punishes a few people, like Jonah (the whale guy?), Lot's wife who got turned to stone. Perhaps He did this to make an example to the people.

Mind you, I do think that in all likelyhood God didn't punish the above Bibical people rather something awful happened to them after they sinned and people assumed it was God punishing them.

But honestly, I don't think any of us can really determine God's actions or inaction in said matters. Its okay to ponder on it, but we'll never really know till we're face to the face with the Big Man upstairs.


#9

How does one...steal the willing?:)


#10

[quote="NguyenKimPhat, post:7, topic:204102"]
**I am not making any type of statement about God's justice. I am only asking a question. **Is there a possibility/chance that the physcial handicap of a child might be the punishment for the sins of its parent?

[/quote]

I remember the story of David and Bethsheba too. I also remember the story of Jesus curing a man born blind. People questions whose sin caused it--his or his parents. Jesus responded by saying the man was born blind to reveal the glory of God. Then He healed the man. (See the ninth chapter of the gospel of John.)

Yes, there is God's punishment and justice. There is also God's grace. The two adulterous individuals in the story you posted sound selfish. Children help their parents overcome selfishness. A child born with a physical disability likely requires more from his parents than the "average", healthy child. God has given those two people an opportunity to be decent parents towards that child. That requires that they become better people than they were previously. God's justice and grace are perfect. God's glory may be revealed through this child.


#11

[quote="gardenswithkids, post:10, topic:204102"]
I remember the story of David and Bethsheba too. I also remember the story of Jesus curing a man born blind. People questions whose sin caused it--his or his parents. Jesus responded by saying the man was born blind to reveal the glory of God. Then He healed the man. (See the ninth chapter of the gospel of John.)

Yes, there is God's punishment and justice. There is also God's grace. The two adulterous individuals in the story you posted sound selfish. Children help their parents overcome selfishness. A child born with a physical disability likely requires more from his parents than the "average", healthy child. God has given those two people an opportunity to be decent parents towards that child. That requires that they become better people than they were previously. God's justice and grace are perfect. God's glory may be revealed through this child.

[/quote]

oh my godness, I cannot believe I totally forgot the story about the blind man. I guess that the story about the Blind Man is the answer to my question?


#12

Babies with handicaps are born to good and to bad parents alike. Your view really doesn't accord to the New Testament, just read what Jesus said about the collapsed Tower of Siloam (Luke13:4---).

I would regard the King David example as a 'one off' punishment. There is no statement to say that from hence forth all sinner parents would be punished with permanently suffering babies.


#13

Not all suffering is a punishment - sometimes it is a cross. Not until that child grows up and finds his/her true calling will that child truly know what the purpose of that cross is or how that cross has united him/her to the suffering of Christ.


#14

[quote="roveau, post:12, topic:204102"]
Babies with handicaps are born to good and to bad parents alike. Your view really doesn't accord to the New Testament, just read what Jesus said about the collapsed Tower of Siloam (Luke13:4---).

I would regard the King David example as a 'one off' punishment. There is no statement to say that from hence forth all sinner parents would be punished with permanently suffering babies.

[/quote]

Thank you for your answer, but I didn't really have a view. I wasn't making a statement about God's justice. I was just posing a question.


#15

[quote="NguyenKimPhat, post:14, topic:204102"]
Thank you for your answer, but I didn't really have a view. I wasn't making a statement about God's justice. I was just posing a question.

[/quote]

I'm late in the game and see your question has been answered. The one that puzzles a lot of people, which is kind of opposite your question, is the life and suffering of Job. yes, we read that God allowed it to happen to prove Job's loyalty to him, but I think in the end that with all of these stories, God's Will is done though we on earth may not understand why certain things are part of His Will.


#16

[quote="gmarie21, post:15, topic:204102"]
I'm late in the game and see your question has been answered. The one that puzzles a lot of people, which is kind of opposite your question, is the life and suffering of Job. yes, we read that God allowed it to happen to prove Job's loyalty to him, but I think in the end that with all of these stories, God's Will is done though we on earth may not understand why certain things are part of His Will.

[/quote]

What is the puzzlement regarding Job?


#17

[quote="MtnDwellar, post:16, topic:204102"]
What is the puzzlement regarding Job?

[/quote]

Why bad things happen to good people. There are plenty of works written about Job because I think many don't question when bad things happen to bad people and good things happen to good people (afterall, the word Karma is thrown around a LOT).


#18

[quote="vera_dicere, post:8, topic:204102"]

......But honestly, I don't think any of us can really determine God's actions or inaction in said matters. Its okay to ponder on it, but we'll never really know till we're face to the face with the Big Man upstairs.

[/quote]

That's an excellent point - and so true! God does work in mysterious ways - all according to His perfect plan, not ours.


#19

[quote="gmarie21, post:17, topic:204102"]
Why bad things happen to good people. There are plenty of works written about Job because I think many don't question when bad things happen to bad people and good things happen to good people (afterall, the word Karma is thrown around a LOT).

[/quote]

Why was Satan permitted to attack Job? It was because Job had a lack of faith. Job states that his greatest fears had come to pass. Fear is the opposite of faith.


#20

[quote="MtnDwellar, post:19, topic:204102"]
Why was Satan permitted to attack Job? It was because Job had a lack of faith. Job states that his greatest fears had come to pass. Fear is the opposite of faith.

[/quote]

You have it wrong, Job was allowed to be attacked to prove Job's loyalty to God through it all, that indeed, Job was a faithful servant of God.


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