What do Catholic’s believe!


#1

Where do you stand on these two ideas?
When reading these thoughts, keep in mind that the car represents Salvation and the life of the car represents the length of our lives as Christians.
Example A:
You walk out of your home one day and there in your driveway sits a brand new car. A note attached to the car states that it is a gift with no strings attached. The registration is pay for, the title is in your name, and the insurance is paid for the live of the car. Some will work very hard to care for the car and the car will stay in very good condition. Others will just drive the car doing little or no work to maintain the car and it will eventually break down and have to be abandoned. The last group will not believe that someone would give them a car and will not expect it.
Example B
You walk out of your home one day and there in your driveway sits a brand new car. A note on the car states that the car is yours, but for the car to be yours, you will have to pay for the insurance, and pay to register the car. The note states that the title will not be signed over to you until all conditions have been met. It also states that the car must be maintain in a certain way and all maintence must be completed. If all conditions are met to the satisfaction of the giver of the car then the title will be sign over in your name. Some will work very hard to care for the car and others will feel that to do all the things required it really is not a gift at all, and will not accept it. Some will quit after it becomes too hard to continue with the requirements. There will be some that do not believe that someone would give them a car and will not expect it.

Which one represents your view on your salvation A or B?


#2

Hello zcharry and welcome the the forums. I noticed no one had answered your questions so I thought I might tell you that since this is a question posed towards Catholics that it may be better asked in the apologetic forum.

As for what Catholics believe, you can find their beliefs both in the Catholic Answers library here and also in the Catechism of the Catholic Church found here:

scborromeo.org/ccc.htm

Grace and Justification:

scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s1c3a2.htm

Justification:

scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s1c3a2.htm#I

Grace:

scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s1c3a2.htm#II

In brief:

scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s1c3a2.htm#brief

God bless


#3

Neither A nor B. The Catholic faith is grounded in the Gospel and in the grace of salvation through Jesus Christ Our Lord.


#4

I have to agree.

If however, you MUST use some sort of analogy, a much better one than a dead car would be a live puppy to stand for the gift of salvation since it is the gift of life, not of something dead.


#5

Zcharry,
The fact that you posed this question in this manner reveals that you have bought into the false Lutheran/Protestant view of the Catholic view of salvation.
Paul


#6

smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/12/12_7_5.gif is the car a convert-ible ??

Is there holy water in the radiator?

Does the radio bring in Catholic channels…

Is it built for the difficulties of off-road travel, or just the wide easy road?

We are saved by grace alone (the gift), through faith alone acting in love.

By the way, our “car” also comes with a driver (Magisterium), a road atlas (catechism), and a manual (Catholic Scripture).:thumbsup:

though admittedly, some of our tires are over-inflated

.


#7

The car indeed is a convertible, but no Holy Water, but rather runs on the pure blood of the Lamb.

Only the truth comes through it’s speakers.

This car carries you through good and bad times and is always dependable.

this car come with a driver called the Holy Spirit, a road atlas called Jesus (the only and right way) and a manual called the Bible Only.


#8

#9

Explain to me what I have bought into.


#10

In that case, it is better that this post IS on the non-Catholic forum!


#11

We saved by grace alone. Our response to Gods grace is faith working through love. Faith and works are needed for salvation as St.Paul tells us. God Bless you on your journey!

The Catechism says:
1815 The gift of faith remains in one who has not sinned against it.80 But “faith apart from works is dead”:81 when it is deprived of hope and love, faith does not fully unite the believer to Christ and does not make him a living member of his Body.


#12

:rolleyes: :thumbsup:


#13

Here is the first error. Salvation is a process, and it requires cooperation on the part of the participant. This is because God has made us co-heirs to the promise. He does not want passive puppets, but active sons(daughters). Participation in salvation is not the same as “strings attached”. Using this phraseology indicates that you have erroneously evaluated the place of the believer in salvation history.

One who is forgiven much, loves much.

This is an erroneous assumption about salvation. The parable of the seeds clearly tells us that most of the seeds do sprout. Some spring up and are taken over by weeds, some spring up and are scorched in the sun and wither. But they did sprout.
It is erroneous to say that everyone who throws away their salvation never had it in the first place.

It seems that you are contradicting yourself here, which may be the seeds of the error you were taught. Forst you say the note states the car is yours. But the next sentence says it is basically not. So, which is it? this is error and confusion.

The treasure of our salvation is kept in heaven, imperishable, waiting for us.

This also contradicts your premise that the car had a note on it saying the care is yours. But now you are saying it is not really what the note says it is. The sample is contradictory, and the comparison to salvation is contradictory. It reflects a truncated understanding of salvation, and is non-Catholic.

This is further erroneous comparison. Jesus paid for our lives at the cross. The warrant against us was cancelled. His blood has sanctified us, and by his death He purchased life. The title has already been given to Him, and the keys to death and life.

Jesus wants us to participate in His divinity. By His sacrifice, we have been freed from the law of sin and death. Those who have become members of His body already have their names written in the book of life. However, names can be blotted out of the book, and titles can be thrown into the sewer.

This analogy resists the role of grace working through the believer to will and to do the good pleasure of the Father. A person who thinks they can work their way into heaven, or can in some way merit salvation is lost, and is dead in their sins.

Furthermore, God is willing that ALL be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth.

Neither. Both have errors.


#14

A person who thinks they can work their way into heaven, or can in some way merit salvation is lost, and is dead in their sins.

Here is the first error. Salvation is a process, and it requires cooperation on the part of the participant.

For one you make a lot of assumption that are in error!
Second you contradict yourself and you are all over the place in your response.
It is a simple question. I just thought I would state it outside the box for people to think about it in a different way.
Its not a Lutheran/Protestant view or Catholic view it is a question on how you view your Salvation. As a complete gift or as some thing you Contribute to!
Has nothing to do with works or anything else you state above.


#15

For one you make a lot of assumption that are in error!
Second you contradict yourself and you are all over the place in your response.
It is a simple question. I just thought I would state it outside the box for people to think about it in a different way.
Its not a Lutheran/Protestant view or Catholic view it is a question on how you view your Salvation. As a complete gift or as some thing you Contribute to!
Has nothing to do with works or anything else you state above.


#16

Does the car have air bags? Why? Why not trust once you have the car you will never “loose” it?


#17

Jesus died to re-open the gates of heaven for all to be able to enter… this does not mean that all who see the open gates (believe in Jesus) will enter… we still have to walk the path… NO CAR.

Many who hold non-Catholic views might think that we are saved once we accept the car/gift… even if we use the car/gift to run down a Cathlic or two (:rolleyes: just kidding, I think).

I like the concept of the manual… not everything about the car/gift is written down in the manual… and much of it one will read and interpret to their own distruction.

.


#18

Air Bags, but of course.
Do let someone misunderstand you, thinking once saved always saved, but a gift that will never leave.


#19

I should have asked if the car had a security system, and an anti-theft device.

I should have asked if I am cooperating in this relationship. If I loose the car does that mean I never had it to begin with?


#20

The car could stray or you might forget where you park it. It does come with a security system called the Holy Spirit.
You have always had it, you can not lose it, but you can turn your back on it.
You did not help to get the car but you do help to keep it in fine working order. Wash and wax, seat covers, maybe that bouncing dog head in the back window.


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