What do you tell an atheist that tells you this

I’m struggling with this one…

“We fought 2 world wars where soldiers on both sides were in their foxholes praying to the same god. And about this one world government that Christians go on about, aren’t Christians the ones trying to make the whole world convert to their religion? Seems to me, Christians are trying to create the very thing they fear. So much irony and contradiction.”

There’s an eternal difference between trying to save someone’s soul and recognizing the results of a one world government as it’s commonly understood.

That’s great! God loves them. That every soldier would pray to God.

There was a time when schools posted the 10 commandments for the students to see on a daily basis. Do you have a problem with a society that says “Do not steal, do not murder, do not commit adultery, do not bear false witness against your neighbor”? Seems our society would be a much better place if we could wave a magic wand and everyone followed that. Can you imagine? Our jails that are over flowing today would be empty. Following the 10 commandments is good for a nation, for families, for marriages and children and for the economy.

The WW2 thing has me scratching my head. Soldiers on both sides of the war prayed to God ergo God doesn’t exist? Since there were atheist soldiers on both sides of the war should we conclude that atheism doesn’t exist?

One World government- That one is easy, he’s taking the views of a part of a population and projecting it onto the whole population as if it were a necessary characteristic. Hutchins and Dawkins are atheists. Both are men. Therefore all atheists are men.

Why does he think Christians fear a one world government ?

What connection does truth about God have to do with extent of dominion to be exercised by a secular government???

Just because someone believes there is singular truth in some area (religion/scientiic laws/moral laws…) doesn’t mean they should accept the concept of everyone on earth being ruled by a singular governing body. :confused::confused::confused:

BTW, you give that statement as a quote. Who said it?

Erm, what one-world government? :shrug: Does he understand the difference between politics and religion?

Obviously a lot of people, regardless of nationality, believe in God. Wars are often fought more for the people in power, not the people who fight the wars. We don’t know why God allowed this suffering to happen. However, God allows free will. Therefore, God allows people to choose evil. Sometimes, that evil spreads throughout the entire world.

It will get more complicated if this person starts going into nationalities because during WW2, the Germans effectively silenced anyone who really believed in Jesus and fought against what the Nazis were doing. A lot of martyrs died in concentration camps during this time period.

Russia, actively atheist, was still on the winning side of the war.

History is a lot more complicated than two sides praying to the same God. I mean, that completely ignores the Asian part of the war all together. China/Japan aren’t known for being Christian nations. I’d encourage this person to consider the bigger picture (in so many ways…)

I’d point out that Christians have a complex history. Yes, we had the crusades. Yes, we go all over the world on mission trips. We did horrible things to other races. However, we aren’t the only ones who have a complicated history. Look at Islam. Look at how they invaded Spain in the Middle Ages and nearly captured Vienna in the 1400’s. Look at how people argue they are ‘infiltrating Western culture’ - you can find a ton of examples of this on the internet.

This person can’t just sit and blame all the world’s ills on Christianity when a lot of bad things have happened, in spite of Christian influence in the world. Japan had its own agenda when it invaded China in the 1930’s. Japan is known for having a lot of Anti-Western/Anti-Christian attitudes, especially pre-WW2. Russia, an atheist country, overran the Ukraine around the same time period and virtually starved all their people.

The thing is that Christians aren’t the only people on Earth who try to convert people to their ideology (religious or secular). To not know this is to be absolutely clueless about the world around you. Ideology and theology can be motivators for war, but you also have to have a population that is willing to fight the war.

Not all populations at all times in history are willing to fight major wars.There are periods in history where people are more willing to strive to keep the peace because they’ve seen firsthand how devastating a major war can be and they aren’t interested in fighting another one. However, when the generation that fought the major war starts to die off, the lessons of working together start to fade as well - increasing the likelihood of a major war happening.

Honestly, I’d look at this atheist and wonder if they’ve even opened a book in their life and actually read it.

History is complicated and ironic. (face palm) Countries and people are contradictory all the time. Honestly, a lot of people find value in being consistent. However, there are times when we just aren’t. It’s a totally human thing to be this way. Why would we act against our nature? We aren’t perfect like Jesus was! :thumbsup:

I hope that I answered your question or gave people something to think about.

This atheist is all over the place. He (or she) needs to be more concise because there are so many arguments that can be made, but there’s the question of should they be made and would they actually be useful. Happy Easter.

Exactly. Does this person have any historical context of the world or are they just spouting off something they’ve heard from somewhere?

The one-world government people have, um, interesting ideas :rolleyes:

You don’t get far making arguments against it. I’ve learned to stop - to save my sanity. There is no response other than WTH. Seriously.

Is it really fair to try to blame both WWI and WWII on Christians?

There isn’t anything you can say to a strident atheist, especially when it’s an anti-Catholic strident atheist.

That being said…

  1. Too bad it takes a war to bring us to our knees.
  2. If this is a vast Christian conspiracy, why didn’t anybody tell me? One world government? Who knew? :shrug:
  3. We don’t MAKE people convert. In fact, that would be quite UN-Christian. :eek:
  4. Conversion to Christianity would be nice! :slight_smile:
  5. Let me see if I understand…
    “Seems to me, Christians are trying to create the very thing they fear.” :confused:
    So, Christians are trying to create one world government under the umbrella of Christianity because we’re afraid of one world order under the umbrella of Christianity which is the thing we Christians want???
    :p: :confused: :rolleyes:

Ok then!

  1. We want moral governments.
  2. We want folks to come to faith in Jesus Christ.
  3. Neither of those things scares us. Do they scare him/her? :smiley:

Sorry to be so sarcastic here! The statements are just far too ridiculous to take seriously. As I said in the beginning, you won’t change his/her mind.

And his point is…? The fact that some bad guys who were unfortunately in a position to start a war used as soldiers Christians doesn’t negate either the evil of the war nor the prayers of the soldiers. What Christians are supposed to ultimately pray for is that God’s will be done.

And about this one world government that Christians go on about, aren’t Christians the ones trying to make the whole world convert to their religion? Seems to me, Christians are trying to create the very thing they fear. So much irony and contradiction."

Protestants tend to go on a lot more about the One World Government thing than Catholics are, but even so, if the powers that be in several nations were to join together and make a OWG, would he really like to see the likes of Putin and whatever US President he particularly dislikes in charge *of the whole world? *

Catholics don’t want a OWG, but if everyone were a good Catholic, then nations would be well-ordered because everyone would be on the same page. So it makes perfect sense to be against a OWG and for everyone to be Catholic.

A OWG ruled by men is the scariest thing imaginable.

A OWG ruled by Jesus Christ is the Kingdom of God.

:thumbsup: :slight_smile: :thumbsup: :slight_smile: :thumbsup:

This is a group of individuals that aren’t easily defeated, though I believe I have put them back on their heels as long paragraphs have turned into one sentence responses. Appreciate the responses but I feel these will not be effective against these individuals.

Well if they want to claim that people killing each other discredits a belief system, you may want to point out to them that atheist governments in the twentieth century were responsible for murdering nearly 32 million of their own citizens, a number greater than the number of military deaths in either world war.

Don’t fall into this trap. Next thing you know you’re going back and forth about this or that event or how many died for what cause.

Just keep it simple. Just say “What does that have to do with God existing or Christian teachings being right? After we come to an agreement on that, then we can discuss what’s the best method of persuading others.”

There are COUNTLESS examples of Christians failing to live up to their standard. That’s what sin is and we all do it. The question is, are Christians right about God and right about Jesus?

God isn’t a magic vending machine, giving people whatever they pray for, nor contradicting Himself at every turn.

God said “No” to most of those prayers, and you know what? Most of those people still held on to their faith in God.

And about this one world government that Christians go on about, aren’t Christians the ones trying to make the whole world convert to their religion? Seems to me, Christians are trying to create the very thing they fear. So much irony and contradiction."

  1. The True Religion isn’t a government. 2. Believing in, or fearing, a one-world government has nothing to do with being a Christian. This is a conspiracy theory believed by people who have too much time on their hands; not a tenet of Christian faith.

I wouldn’t think that it’s the individuals that you’re trying to defeat so much as the lies they believe (perhaps you meant to say such), but just to be clear our job in defending the faith is not to defeat an opponent but to edify through proclaiming the truth in love.

That said all you can do is what you have already done, plant seeds.

The rest is up to God. He knows how and when to use those seeds we plant to enact His will.

Pray for them that God may enlighten and save them.

Converting people to Christianity is not a political aspiration, i.e., it’s not an empire (one world government) we are trying to establish but a spiritual “kingdom” of Christian believers.

Moreover, Christians have fought each other for thousands of years, it is if anything an example of our failure to fulfill our faith and/or live by its commandments when we war with each other. And the fact that we pray to the same God doesn’t change the fact that there is a right or wrong. God decides what and who to answer or how history will be played out despite prayers that are contradictory.

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